THE PAVILION ANNEX

General discussions of interest to readers and fans of Harlan Ellison.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:35 pm

" You make Frank look like a Harvard scholar!" At least he didn't make me a yale man.


"If we listened to our intellect, we'd never have a love affair. We'd never have a friendship. We'd never go into business, because we'd be cynical. Well, that's nonsense. You've got to jump off cliffs all the time and build your wings on the way down."

Ray.

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Steve Evil
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Steve Evil » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:56 pm

FrankChurch wrote:" You've got to jump off cliffs all the time and build your wings on the way down."

Ray.


That was one of my favorites. . .

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robochrist
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby robochrist » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:00 pm

Welcome to America!

Ray Bradbury is known all over the world. Many even read him in the Republic of Georgia when it was under the Soviet Union. He may be the only science fiction author who reaches readers not normally into that genre.

Earlier today - for the first time in MY experience - I met a girl, otherwise a very nice person, who'd never heard of Bradbury or any of his titles.

Unbearable. Just unbearable.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:23 pm

You met a girl! That was just too easy.

Jus havin fun. It's been a tough day.

cynic
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby cynic » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:11 pm

RIP Ray Bradbury
I will mourn this passing as I do all others, in memory of their efforts, good intent, and those left behind.

rob wrote:I'm not appalled by Jonathan Haidt, to the extent of what I've read, as I am by Sowell. But his comment, " atheists pollute the scientific study of religion" strikes me as hysterically jejune.

That comment likely refers to the confrontational style some atheists use, in "attacking" the religious;
"God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything ", "the god delusion".

As a social psychologist, his concern is in the benefit of understanding the rationale of those different from us,
rather than fall into a group narrative that demonizes them, and poisons discourse.

Given the widespread, if not universal "spiritual" nature of man, browbeating the alledged majority (religious)
does little to alleviate tension in the ongoing cultural clashes.

perhaps you may see the irony in characterizing his statement as "hysterically jejune" ?

Perhaps not.
But, Mike, you tire me. Do some of your own "objective" research, instead of assailing people here with assholish vacuity;

I can only imagine how exhasting it is, constantly spewing insults and dictating your views as gospel.
I get tired just reading them.

apparently it has left you no energy to actually read my comments to your queries, consider them, and formulate a response.
ask yourself more questions playing devils advocate;

I do my best to question the validity of those positions i am tempted to take, and those are few and far between.
if, for instance, one might take offense at the history Sowell omits from his generalizations about socialism, you might ask yourself what might be counterarguments to his screed?

aaaand you had nothing to more to say on those sowell as--oles. make up your mind.
It would be better if you tried something like that - to attempt some real dialog - rather than just coming in here to be a frivolous bullshitter. You make Frank look like a Harvard scholar!

yes rob, dialog.
you know the word; show us you understand the concept.
rather than continuing your insults and demands...

Address just one response i have already given you, and we can share and compare.

try not to take offense at what sowell has said, or what i may write.--------calm down.
Now enough. Ray Bradbury is more important.

Enough, indeed.

The man's passing is a great tradgedy; but would it be a vitue to use it as an imaginary shield or club;
to use it to justify one more order, one more judgement,
to continue to avoid actually discussing anything in a civil manner?

yes, perhaps it's only benefit to some is in such an effort.

I will mourn this passing as I do all others, in memory of their efforts, good intent, and those left behind.
RIP Ray Bradbury
follow your bliss,mike

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Chuck Messer
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Chuck Messer » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:49 pm

Mike:

Can you fucking cool it for a while? Even the whole Ray Bradbury issue is just another occasion for you to toss mudballs without contributing a goddamn thing of your own to any discussion.

You know, when you're not being a (insult deleted by moderator), you can make a good point once in a while. Now you're just being tiresome.

I'm getting goddamn tired of this. I'm taking the week off, so maybe I'll enjoy it more if I take some time from here. Enjoy, everyone.

Jesus.

Chuck
Some people are wedded to their ideology the way nuns are wed to God.

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robochrist
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby robochrist » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:02 pm

Frank: "You met a girl!"

There ARE times when I make things UP!

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Chuck - You said it for all of us! We're going to make you Webderland shop steward!

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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Moderator » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:09 pm

Okay, I'm seeing a lot of mixing threads. This one is for continuing Pavilion topics.

Take Haidt and the politics elsewhere.

Thank you.

RIP Ray. A bit of my childhood died today.
- I love to find adventure. All I need is a change of clothes, my Nikon, an open mind and a strong cup of coffee.

cynic
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby cynic » Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:18 pm

RIP Ray Bradbury
I will mourn this passing as I do all others, in memory of their efforts, good intent, and those left behind.
Chuck Messer wrote:Mike:
Can you fucking cool it for a while? Even the whole Ray Bradbury issue is just another occasion for you to toss mudballs without contributing a goddamn thing of your own to any discussion.

You know, when you're not being a passive agressive douche, you can make a good point once in a while. Now you're just being tiresome.
i did my best to contribute in my last post to rob.
I regret that my quibble with him caused you any further grief.
follow your bliss,mike

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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Moderator » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:29 am

Rob, Chuck

Ray's death is an emotional issue, and you may be offended Mike is continuing an existing discussion, but you've both launched personal insults and attacks at Mike and that's not acceptable. I've made this repeatedly clear.

I've edited the worst, but please make your points without name calling.

"Mod"
- I love to find adventure. All I need is a change of clothes, my Nikon, an open mind and a strong cup of coffee.

Mark Tiedemann
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Mark Tiedemann » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:54 am

Just as an aside, per a previous line, and not wishing to intrude upon mourning---but such things slip out of reach if not copied-and-pasted quickly, so for a continuation at a later date, day next week....

Someone asked what qualifies as anti-intellectual. Here's a good primer: http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... st-demands

Mark Tiedemann
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Mark Tiedemann » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:57 am

Oh, and with all due respect, I'd like to say that (since I've been wrestling with him for days now over a couple of issues) I don't find mike tiresome in the least. He asks questions. Sometimes it seems he asks questions about things that maybe we think should be obvious, but not necessarily. I have encountered true assholes, trolls, prognathic precognates, and ingrates on other fora, and mike doesn't come close. Just sayin'.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:10 am

I almost wanted to scream when MSNBC called Ray a noted "Sci-Fi" writer. See, if you don't sell millions of books, even if you change people's hearts and history, that all doesn't count; you have to be as known in the dull culture like Lady Gaga and the f'n Queen's jubiliee.

We remember, Ray.

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Chuck Messer
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Chuck Messer » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:28 am

I want to apologize to Mike for what was an uncalled-for attack on him. I have no excuse. I don't often do that, and when I do, I'm usually wrong.

Mike, I'm sorry for being such an asshat. There was no need for my behavior. I hope you accept this apology in the spirit intended.

Chuck
Some people are wedded to their ideology the way nuns are wed to God.

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robochrist
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby robochrist » Thu Jun 07, 2012 12:28 pm

re: Mike.

Yeah, well...that's fine. I don't agree.

Questions with the intent of composure, respectful engagement, and even-handedness is one thing; with all due respect...Mike doesn't usually present them that way.

That being said...let's fucking move on!

I'm much more distraught about knowing there are people around me who'd never heard of Ray Bradbury!


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