THE PAVILION ANNEX

General discussions of interest to readers and fans of Harlan Ellison.

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diane bartels
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby diane bartels » Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:11 pm

Frank, dear, FYI one reason folks get angry with you here is because you never respond to points people actually make. You just wander on off on another happy tangent. What about my point that copyrites are not based in some feudal guild system. And then you quote the same guy again. The reason Chomsky is not in msm is because most people on the planet find him impossible to read and boring. Same reason Harlan is not the best selling author of all time. Most people are stupid. I have a hard time understanding Chomsky. It takes 2 reads and a dictionary by my side. And he aint sexy looking like the Palin. Much as I hate the Palin, she is hot. Msm is driven by profits, appeal to most sales, most people. Take care. Is as hot by you as it is by me?

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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Moderator » Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:17 pm

Odd.

Frank is inordinately fond of attacking the Mouse but totally neglects the lack of Chomsky/Ali on NBC, FOX, CBS, CBC, Al Jazeera, BBC, Australian tv...

Wait. *I've* never been on any of those networks! They're silencing Progressive Voices!!!

*Gasp*

(Or maybe, just maybe, they don't attract enough viewers to be worth the appearance?)
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Samuel John Klein
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Samuel John Klein » Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:38 pm

FrankChurch wrote:
Big corporations use monopoly power to control the flow of free speech, this is not controversial. This is why you don't see Chomsky or Tariq Ali on ABC television, owned by the mouse.



And here was me, thinking the reason you didn't see Noam Chomsky on ABC was because he was dry and abstruse. I've been co-opted by the dominant paradigm!

I remember recently overhearing someone in a cafe all but damning Noam to Hell because his ideas of the "universal grammar" were so orthodox in academia that to differ from them meant academic ostracism. No, wait, that happened at OryCon one year (Gott in Himmel do I love the discussions you can get into in the hospitality suite! So many bitter intellectuals! I LOVE THAT!).

We also have this fellow renting a room from us, and you know how to really get him going on a rant? Just say the term "anarcho-syndicalism" to him. It's like saying "universal healthcare" in a room full of teabaggers. That little vein starts pulsing. So cute!

Sam.
I could translate this into the original proto-Indo-European, but why bother? It'd just be lost on you proles.
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Samuel John Klein
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Samuel John Klein » Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:49 pm

diane bartels wrote:And he aint sexy looking like the Palin. Much as I hate the Palin, she is hot. Msm is driven by profits, appeal to most sales, most people. Take care. Is as hot by you as it is by me?


I must respectfully disagree with you on this one, Diane. $arah Palin isn't ugly by any means, but I've never found her sexy. As a matter of fact, I've found the ceaseless reflexive remarks by media about how attractive Palin (and Bachmann) are supposed to be going beyond tiresome. Whenever the tradmed talks about teh Palin we always, guaranteed, get at least a paragraph about how hawt she's supposed to be, but there's something about her, maybe it's that crayzee, glazed-eye gaze she gives everything, that erases all sex appeal and makes me think I'm looking at, oh, I don't know, The Shrike* with a good tailor and a great makeup crew, and she just wants to impale us all on her steel tree of thorns.

Sam.
And Bachmann is just another word to me for sheer existential terror. You can't sex THAT up by putting it in a bikini.

*Dan Simmons' Hyperion reference
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FinderDoug
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FinderDoug » Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:43 am

Nope. Corporations don't need protections. They're perfectly fine.

http://behindthewall.msnbc.msn.com/_new ... d-in-china

Nope. All fine and dandy.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Jul 20, 2011 11:11 am

That fake Apple shop put a smile on my face. Korea did this for years when they were a developing nation, selling knock-off handbags, shirts, they ripped off computer hardware. Made their economy boom. Poverty was cut down fast. China is taking the train on Korea's lead.

This is a complex world, there are warring ideals--property rights of billionairs vs poor people having bread. I know what side I'm on.

----------

Lori, I'm an art snob. Memo sent.

---------

Diane, let him explain it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXPvPxOFba0

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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Moderator » Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:55 pm

FrankChurch wrote:
This is a complex world, there are warring ideals--property rights of billionairs vs poor people having bread. I know what side I'm on.



Well...at least you're now being honest about your motivations. Claiming to be pro artist now rings completely hollow.

You're on the side of the thieves and anti intellectual property. In other words, you're against any kind of initiative or creativity.

You said it yourself.

Personally, if I expend my resources and you simply copy it, you're not doing anything constructive. These people are, in essence, Parasites that ultimately kill their host.
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Lori Koonce
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Lori Koonce » Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:59 pm

Frank

I know from art snobs, I'm one of 'em IMO. I mean try explaining to the masses why you prefer early Pollack and Warhol over the stuff that made 'em famous without sounding like a snob!

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FinderDoug
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FinderDoug » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:29 pm

Of course, there's no possible way anyone that ever made a fortune would ever, ever stoop to helping the poor, the needy, the socially or culturally impoverished.

I'm sure Bill and Melinda Gates are just running that foundation - you know, the one made possible in part because of the value of his intellectual property rights - as some kind of a shell game; I'm sure Michael Eisner's is too. So's Elton John's. Why, so is any corporate or celebrity philanthropy, one supposes. Hell, I'm sure Andrew Carnegie never actually gave any money for any library anywhere - it's probably all just big corporation propaganda going back decades.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Jul 20, 2011 3:47 pm

Finderdoug, Finderdoug, lookie here:

http://www.truth-out.org/second-green-r ... 1310411034

http://books.google.com/books?id=ibH9jP ... &q&f=false

So, I take it you don't support taxing big business more? They could retaliate by not giving as much to foundations. If we gave them zero taxes they could save the world.

Hey, you started to dig...

In the real world we should welcome any help we can get and from any avenue. But, we should have no illusions. Corporations do most things for their own gain, including giving. The PR benefit alone makes them fat.

Carnegie did great things, but don't forget the dark, like sicking Pinkerton's on labor organizers, beating them up, even women. You certainly want me to see the bad when it comes to Hugo Chavez.

Shovels are needed.

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FrankChurch
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:56 pm

Lori, now this is art:

http://apah.lakegeneva.badger.groupfusi ... 6036-4.jpg

Pieter Breugel, the Elder. Belgium's master.

I'm sorry guys, mere humanity cannot make art this stunning. There has to be a God to bring this out of someone.

diane bartels
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby diane bartels » Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:01 am

Frank, some day you must tell me how you get there from here or here from there. How does supporting copyright law take bread from poor people? No dont answer that. I'm sure you'll tell me and I done talked bout this un all I can. lol Have neither the time or inclination to listen to all your Chommie cite. No disrespect to the man intended here, but does he ever just get down to the effin point about anything in three cogent sentences or less? In my experience of his work, no.

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Samuel John Klein
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Samuel John Klein » Thu Jul 21, 2011 4:57 am

FrankChurch wrote:Lori, now this is art:

http://apah.lakegeneva.badger.groupfusi ... 6036-4.jpg

Pieter Breugel, the Elder. Belgium's master.

I'm sorry guys, mere humanity cannot make art this stunning. There has to be a God to bring this out of someone.


If you like.

I, for one, refuse to endorse, condemn, or extend to you kudos for whatever apologetic stance on God gets you through the day.

All this really proves to me is that Breugel, the Elder, worked wonders with a brush and paints.

This only has to be prima facie Godsign if you want it to be. If it makes you feel good. And if you feel like offering it up as some sort of evidence that There Is A God, well … spiffy. Maybe someone will give you a cookie for it, or something.

Sam Klein.
Facetiously speaking, if there was a God, wouldn't He have learned that guy about perspective?
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Samuel John Klein
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Samuel John Klein » Thu Jul 21, 2011 4:58 am

Lori Koonce wrote:Frank

I know from art snobs, I'm one of 'em IMO. I mean try explaining to the masses why you prefer early Pollack and Warhol over the stuff that made 'em famous without sounding like a snob!


Pollock never moved me, and I was bored by most of the art Warhol created … but mercy, I love reading about Warhol's life. That, to me, was the real work of art that Andy did. That bizarre, take-no-prisoners life he led.

Sam.
I'm no Warhol, but I do keep a diary. A very … banal … diary.
Samuel John Klein, your friend, and your friend, and mine too
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Steve Evil
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Re: THE PAVILION ANNEX

Postby Steve Evil » Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:14 am

Warhol was overrated. And the Gates Foundation is doing more harm to American schools than good, attaching all sorts of conditions to their "donations" which have little to do with education. (Maybe their activities in Africa are doing better?)


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