Pavilion Digest: April 2009

A plethora of perplexing pavilion posts. The Pavilion Annex thread, the Pavilion Discussion thread, and monthly digests of all messages from the Pavilion.

Moderator: Moderator

Posts: 195
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:58 pm
Location: Bremerton, WA

Postby shagin » Mon Apr 13, 2009 6:04 pm

Name: shagin
Source: unca20090603.htm
While searching fiction markets today, I came acrossed a little beauty by the moniker SPACE SQUID. It's almost worth submitting a few pieces just to put that title as a credit on a cover letter.


Amy Kostyn-Jenkins


Postby Amy Kostyn-Jenkins » Mon Apr 13, 2009 8:29 pm

Name: Amy Kostyn-Jenkins
Source: unca20090603.htm
Dear Susan,

I will admit to not reading this site on a daily basis lately. I've been extremely busy with work (and play) and missed out on Harlan's shocking announcement entirely. I would have, of course, wished you and Harlan our best and whatever passes for prayers from two atheists. Ben and I love you both and would do anything you wanted or needed from us, hence my earlier phone call. I apologize, as I must've seemed really uncaring to not even mention Harlan. I would give the man a kidney (or bone marrow) if he needed it. I am so sorry if I seemed brusque or indifferent--I was simply unaware.

With massive amounts of love,

Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am


Postby Adam-Troy » Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:39 am

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20090603.htm
Thanks for the scattering of congratulations here. I am kvelling.


Sorry, "Gunfight on Farside" is not available in its entirety online.


I am looking forward to that new short story.


I recently ordered 10 copies of THE ESSENTIAL ELLISON - 50th for my sf book discussion group (thanks folks for your help obtaining); they are being delivered to the group this weekend, and I just thought I'd assauge any idle curiosity by listing the contents we isolated for the discussion meeting, a month hence. (This should be interesting since I know much of this will be new to at least some of the participants.) Because we have a couple of violence wusses in that group of participants, I took the liberty of marking the couple of the stories that those two need to be prepared for.

Life Hutch
I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream
Prince Myshkin, and Hold the Relish
The Very Last Day Of A Good Woman
Tired Old Man
One Life, Furnished in Early Poverty
Jeffty is Five
Alive and Well and On a Friendless Voyage
Repent Harlequin Said the Ticktockman
Pretty Maggie Moneyeyes
Paladin of the Lost Hour
The Man Who Rowed Christopher Columbus Ashore


Shattered like a Glass Goblin
Final Schtick
The Resurgence of Miss Ankle-Strap Wedgie
Neither Your Jenny Nor Mine
The Prowler in the City at the Edge of the World **
The Whimper of Whipped Dogs **

I think we'll hear heads exploding all over South Florida.

Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:33 pm

Postby Onlooker » Tue Apr 14, 2009 5:53 am

Name: Onlooker
Source: unca20090603.htm
Pretty Maggie Moneyeyes:

User avatar
Site Admin
Posts: 10607
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:17 pm

Postby Moderator » Tue Apr 14, 2009 6:29 am

Name: Steve Barber
Source: unca20090603.htm

As we all wait for news of our patron; congratulate A-TC on his now multiple honors for a damned good book; throw marshmallows at Frank; and add up our pennies for the next big purchase from HERC, I noted the following kinda fun website at Yahoo: ... /fp#photo0

And no, A BOY AND HIS DOG isn't one of them.

Yet more new pics (damn, I bin bizzy) in the April Images Gallery on my website.

With Mr. E's permission, which I shall request well after he's done being abosed by doctors, I'll take pics at next week's DWST screening at the New Beverly. Cris and I are both gonna be there, so we'll be taking names of those locals who don't attend.

Detention is a serious possibility.

User avatar
Posts: 1817
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 2:25 pm
Location: Köln

Postby Jan » Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:40 am

Name: Jan
Source: unca20090603.htm
Susan: Renewal notice and RH#48 have arrived - a big thank you. Stamps for my collection received also.

I hope Harlan's doctors and nurses have proved capable once more.

Susan, the Polish edition of Pulp Fiction: Villains mentioned in RH is really a Serbian edition. It was published March 14th, and there's no Polish one.
ISBN 978-86-7274-324-1
(I know you guys and your staff need such info to be correct.)

I have seen a new anncouncement of the HE week at New Bev - Scroll down a bit.
This says Harlan will be present Thursday (with Joshman), Friday, Sunday, Wednesday. Apparently he intends to be there once for every selection. How great would that be - for those who can attend. Harlan, if you can't make it one time, send Cordwainer Bird. He's at least as funny as you are, even if his credits aren't as impressive.

Found out yesterday more of the last Ellison/Olson appearance has appeared on YouTube (the first fifteen minutes). Prime stuff.
Which Steve is that who went up to Harlan to pick up the tape of Boy/Dog and was then recognized by him and rejected?

I got a call from Barber who is apparently trying to find out which of us get those free COMP COPIES of RH - he thinks he should get free copies more than anybody and seemed slightly agitated.

Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am


Postby Adam-Troy » Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:43 pm

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20090603.htm
Y'ever hear of a cult movie for decades and even hear it referenced with awe in other movies and know that it's probably not much good but finally get a chance to see it and it turns out to be not just dated and not just bad and not just pointless and not just overly impressed with its own profundity
and not just filled with scenes that are supposed to boggle you with their symbolism but are just embarrassing, not just that, but is also, you know, fucking inept in just about every possible way for a movie to be, from the acting to the camerawork to the staging, even though some people fucking swear by it, and you end up watching the whole goddamned thing just to see whether it ever arrives at its point and you find yourself despairing with half an hour to go and angry with fifteen minutes to go and dismayed with a minute left to go and finally fucking outraged as the stupidest thing of all happens, and you finally get to the end and discover that your first impression was right, that it's inane and empty and stupid? Y'ever fucking do that? Anybody? Bueller?

Greg Hurd


Postby Greg Hurd » Tue Apr 14, 2009 3:17 pm

Name: Greg Hurd
Source: unca20090603.htm
Oddly enough Vanishing Point was on earlier but I missed it. Oh well...'Skidoo' did it for me. 'The World's Greatest Sinner' is on TMC this Friday + I hope this doesn't hit the stink pile too. Even though a lot of people dismiss it I have a fondness for 'Robinson Crusoe on Mars'.

Film Buff

R.C. on Mars

Postby Film Buff » Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:36 am

Name: Film Buff
Source: unca20090603.htm
Hi, Mr. Hurd: Robinson Crusoe on Mars was put out in a Criterion Collection edition on DVD. Which leads one to believe a few people hold it in higher esteem than you think.

Kevin Avery


Postby Kevin Avery » Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:40 am

Name: Kevin Avery
Source: unca20090603.htm
Harlan, if I recall correctly, in the mid-Seventies or so, in an interview in TAKE ONE magazine, you expressed a fondness for VANISHING POINT. I'm just curious if the film still holds up for you. Myself, I've always enjoyed it...

Brian Phillips
Posts: 85
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 2:07 am

In response to Adam-Troy Castro

Postby Brian Phillips » Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:44 am

Name: Brian Phillips
Source: unca20090603.htm
Mr. Castro (congratulations) has hit upon something that has happened in modern culture. There are good works, bad works, overrated works and underrated ones as well. I would like to add the category of "over-reviewed" or "over-analyzed".

I haven't seen "Vanishing Point" since it came out, but I recall my brother having to explain it to me, Cleavon Little, a bit of blood and Gloria Texter (I hid my eyes).

Danny Peary, in his book, "Cult Movies 2", gives it a long write-up and I seem to recall it was a "worth a second look" essay, not a "lost folk classic" essay. It would seem that subsequent or even previous articles seemed to have boosted this film's rep. This is a good and a bad thing for a lot of works, at least for me, because by the time you see something, if you aren't completely knocked out, you end up disappointed or worse, blessing out said work with such vehemence that passers-by stop and stare with great amazement.

Some films that are unearthed by this method deserve it, as for me, blessings are to be showered on my brother who insisted that I watch "Citizen Kane" with him on TV. I had not read "Cahiers du Cinema" or "Raising Kane" by Pauline Kael, I just sat and watched it with wide open eyes and with my own opinion to form. "Citizen Kane" is still one of my favorite movies, so thanks Steve (and Mom, the serious cinema buff in the family). Had I seen it NOW, I might have liked it, or, because I was that way, hated it, because so many others with and without pedigree slobbered all over it. I will also cop to a bit of ego, the "I discovered _________ all by myself!", I feel that way about "Le Million" and "The Ghost Goes West", which are both fun movies.

A film that went through a "less-than-Vanishing-Point" (it's a system of measurement; go metric, folks!) downgrading for me was the original version of "The Wicker Man" (sorry, Steve!). It hasn't aged as well for me, even though I still like the movie.

The film that I perhaps should see again that I was disappointed in because of the "over-reviewed" stigma is...


This may upset our gracious host, but having heard SO MUCH about this film and not having been alive during World War II, it didn't resonate as deeply as it had for many others. Had I just seen it at, say, my Mother's urging, I might feel differently. This is not to say that I think it's a BAD film, quite the opposite; I prefer "The Big Sleep" as far as Humphrey Bogart films go.

Normally, I would say, "just don't listen" to the critics and articles and well-meaning friends, but in an age where information leaps out at you like ads in the movie of Philip K. Dick's, "Minority Report", that is getting increasingly harder to do.

Brian Phillips

Robert Ross

Postby Robert Ross » Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:25 am

Name: Robert Ross
Source: unca20090603.htm
HARLAN & SUSAN: Luck and love.

VANISHING POINT: Oh boy. ATC and that film are perhaps two ships passing in the night. I don't know. VP is, it seems to me, one of those things, like McGoohan's THE PRISONER, that is more than the sum of its parts, and some people love it, and some don't. I love it as ... whatever. I could write fifteen thousand words and not even crack the surface. That doesn't mean I think I'm right and ATC is wrong.

I have seen films described as "classic" that left me cold. VERTIGO is one. THE ENGLISH PATIENT is another. But ...

Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am


Postby Adam-Troy » Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:53 am

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20090603.htm
And I could go on for five thousand words, easily, on why the film is not just vapid and stupid and dishonest and morally reprehensible, but incompetent. In another mood I would. But since I'm not in that mood, I will entertain y'all with the intelligence that the film's, watchable character, the naked blonde motorcycle rider who hops off her bike to tell our hero, at length, that she's been a fan of his for years and has in fact made collages about him (producing one just to prove she's not kidding), and that he can stay with her, because she'll happily give him anything he wants...gee, I lost control of that sentence. That woman. Gloria Texter, who played her, went on to a long career in the movies. In the wardrobe department.


My personal list of critically acclaimed movies that I despise beyond measure includes ATONEMENT, THE THIN RED LINE, SCENT OF A WOMAN, and THE ENGLISH PATIENT. I was also put off, but not to the same degree as the prior four, by MY BIG FAT GREEK WEDDING, in large part because I was engaged to Judi at about that time and everybody hopped up and down and cried, "You've got to see this!" (Its one effect on our wedding? We called ours The Big Fat Geek Wedding.)


Noted elsewhere: The entire run of LOST is an exercise in creating a character, Ben, who gets beat to a bloody pulp on a regular basis, and making us feel ebullient about it Every. Damn. Time.


So who wants to start a nationwide blitz of Ovaltine parties?

Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am


Postby Adam-Troy » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:01 am

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20090603.htm
Gilda Texter.

User avatar
Chuck Messer
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed May 21, 2003 9:15 pm
Location: Lakewood, Colorado

Postby Chuck Messer » Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:02 am

Name: Chuck Messer
Source: unca20090603.htm
Films that didn't take my breath away when I finally saw them:

This Island Earth. I knew the film by reputation only until about 1976, when I was in college. Someone told a friend of mine that he was putting together a Science Fiction film festival and wanted some suggestions. My friend steered him toward me and I gave him a pretty good list of films, including This Island Etc. so I could, at long last, see it for myself.

Man, was I disappointed. Even taking into account the naivete of some of the older films, this one seemed to combine interesting ideas with some rather goofy moments. Main characters not noticing that the white-haired guys with enlarged foreheads seeming kinda alien, for example. These guys must be from Sweden or something, right? And the "Mu-tant". Exposed brain and all. Just didn't trip my trigger.

Then there was Rocketship X-M. I knew it couldn't be a classic, but with all these big-brained analysts praising the film's "pulp poetry" and their orgasms over the apocalyptic ending, I finally rented the VHS.

Not only was the science totally bogus -- cribbed from a badly-researched Life Magazine article -- but the script spent MORE THAN HALF THE FILM'S RUNNING TIME with the crew standing around in the rocketship's cabin and spouting inane dialogue. R-XM was more than fifty percent filler. By the time the ship suffered an engine failiure, causing it to hang motionless between the Earth and Moon (happens all the time, right?), then sending it careening to an accidental rendezvous with Mars, I was doing crossword puzzles. I hate crossword puzzles.

Planet of the Apes told a similar type story, but got the boring trip out of the way during the opening credits.

It also caused one of the stars, Lloyd Bridges, to swear off doing SF projects of any kind, leading him to reject the part of Captain Kirk in Star Trek. Imagine if he'd taken the part:

"Captain's log, stardate thirteen forty-one point seven. It seems I've accidentally fired myself out the airlock in my underwear. Fortunately, I lost my lungs to a Klingon disruptor on Archanis Four. Had them replaced by stainless steel liquid oxygen tanks, so I can last quite some time in a vacuum. One problem, though. It's really cold out here, and I'm experiencing some major shrinkage."


Return to “The Art Deco Dining Pavilion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests