Pavilion Digest: July 2009

A plethora of perplexing pavilion posts. The Pavilion Annex thread, the Pavilion Discussion thread, and monthly digests of all messages from the Pavilion.

Moderator: Moderator

Jonathan Head

Postby Jonathan Head » Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:13 am

Name: Jonathan Head
Source: unca20091007.htm
Harlan,

This is one of your younger followers speaking up to thank you for The Thick Red Moment, your essay on knife-kill films. Ive been delving in and out of the Essential Ellison recently and came across the essay for the first time just tonight. Its given me some reassurance after having a similar experience at a recent movie marathon (dont worry, I wont go into unpleasant details).

Suffice it to say that the film, Inside, (it was French, so I thought Id be in reasonably safe hands) was the most disgusting and abhorrent one Ive so far come across. Since the films shown beforehand were The Cabinet of Dr Caligari (the original) and The Vanishing (again, the original), I was led to expect something better than I got.

If I hadnt promised a friend that Id give him a ride home afterward, Id have fled after the first twenty minutes. Instead, I had suffer for another hour, with nothing to do but occasionally throw my arm up in front of my eyes while attempting to block out the gleeful exclamations of my fellow cineastes.

So thanks for the essay, you managed to articulate, and alleviate, the thoughts and concerns that have been repeatedly surfacing in my mind for the last couple of weeks.

Jonathan

Jonathan Head

Postby Jonathan Head » Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:13 am

Name: Jonathan Head
Source: unca20091009.htm
Harlan,

This is one of your younger followers speaking up to thank you for The Thick Red Moment, your essay on knife-kill films. Ive been delving in and out of the Essential Ellison recently and came across the essay for the first time just tonight. Its given me some reassurance after having a similar experience at a recent movie marathon (dont worry, I wont go into unpleasant details).

Suffice it to say that the film, Inside, (it was French, so I thought Id be in reasonably safe hands) was the most disgusting and abhorrent one Ive so far come across. Since the films shown beforehand were The Cabinet of Dr Caligari (the original) and The Vanishing (again, the original), I was led to expect something better than I got.

If I hadnt promised a friend that Id give him a ride home afterward, Id have fled after the first twenty minutes. Instead, I had suffer for another hour, with nothing to do but occasionally throw my arm up in front of my eyes while attempting to block out the gleeful exclamations of my fellow cineastes.

So thanks for the essay, you managed to articulate, and alleviate, the thoughts and concerns that have been repeatedly surfacing in my mind for the last couple of weeks.

Jonathan

paul
Posts: 877
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:04 pm
Location: ATX
Contact:

The Love of Family

Postby paul » Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:56 am

Name: Paul
Source: unca20091007.htm
As many will attest, when one turns twenty-one years of age, it can be a watershed moment. It is something you look forward to, you make plans, the realization of full societal adulthood settles upon your shoulders. The eyes of your family and friends are upon you.

It is in this spirit that my friend Nick recorded a short birthday message for his son, Nathaniel, who just turned 21.

Nick is a writer, Renaissance man, a musician and raconteur I first met years ago when he was working a newspaper and he and I were kind-of joint best-men at our friend's wedding. He is smart, erudite, eclectic and hilarious. I haven't heard Nat's response to this video yet, but I only wish I had received a gift like this when I turned 21. As my daughter (and to her embarrassment, her friends) will attest, being THAT dad comes with a heavy burden of responsibility.

I cannot promise you will enjoy what you see, however in Nick's own words, "The art of humiliation requires having no shame."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMtE53vbGFw

paul
Posts: 877
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:04 pm
Location: ATX
Contact:

The Love of Family

Postby paul » Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:56 am

Name: Paul
Source: unca20091009.htm
As many will attest, when one turns twenty-one years of age, it can be a watershed moment. It is something you look forward to, you make plans, the realization of full societal adulthood settles upon your shoulders. The eyes of your family and friends are upon you.

It is in this spirit that my friend Nick recorded a short birthday message for his son, Nathaniel, who just turned 21.

Nick is a writer, Renaissance man, a musician and raconteur I first met years ago when he was working a newspaper and he and I were kind-of joint best-men at our friend's wedding. He is smart, erudite, eclectic and hilarious. I haven't heard Nat's response to this video yet, but I only wish I had received a gift like this when I turned 21. As my daughter (and to her embarrassment, her friends) will attest, being THAT dad comes with a heavy burden of responsibility.

I cannot promise you will enjoy what you see, however in Nick's own words, "The art of humiliation requires having no shame."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMtE53vbGFw

Adam-Troy
Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am
Contact:

To Jonathan Head

Postby Adam-Troy » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:18 am

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20091007.htm
That film is probably REST STOP or THE VISITORS. Neither of which I've seen in their entirety.

I have a tolerance for horror films, even the very violent ones, if they're any good; the problem is that well over 99% of them are *beyond awful*. My bugaboo is not the slasher stuff, but this newer, more repellent trend, of torture dwelled-upon at length.

Adam-Troy
Posts: 301
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:05 am
Contact:

To Jonathan Head

Postby Adam-Troy » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:18 am

Name: Adam-Troy Castro
Source: unca20091009.htm
That film is probably REST STOP or THE VISITORS. Neither of which I've seen in their entirety.

I have a tolerance for horror films, even the very violent ones, if they're any good; the problem is that well over 99% of them are *beyond awful*. My bugaboo is not the slasher stuff, but this newer, more repellent trend, of torture dwelled-upon at length.

Alan Coil
Posts: 538
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:21 pm
Location: Southeast Michigan

Postby Alan Coil » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:20 am

Name: Alan Coil
Source: unca20091007.htm
Duane recommended seeing Moon, saying we might have to search for it. It doesn't appear to be showing in the Detroit area, less than an hour from me. It is in Columbus, Ohio, about 3 hours from me. Maybe I'll see it on dvd.

This is one of the positive things about the internet...instant information...and one of the drawbacks is instant frustration.
___________________

I strongly urge fellow posters to be careful of putting personal information in their posts. Not job status or marital status or feelings about tree huggers, but stuff that you wouldn't want a burglar to know. Personal privacy is becoming less personal because of the internet.


Alan Coil
Posts: 538
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:21 pm
Location: Southeast Michigan

Postby Alan Coil » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:20 am

Name: Alan Coil
Source: unca20091009.htm
Duane recommended seeing Moon, saying we might have to search for it. It doesn't appear to be showing in the Detroit area, less than an hour from me. It is in Columbus, Ohio, about 3 hours from me. Maybe I'll see it on dvd.

This is one of the positive things about the internet...instant information...and one of the drawbacks is instant frustration.
___________________

I strongly urge fellow posters to be careful of putting personal information in their posts. Not job status or marital status or feelings about tree huggers, but stuff that you wouldn't want a burglar to know. Personal privacy is becoming less personal because of the internet.


john zeock
Posts: 167
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 6:30 pm

*

Postby john zeock » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:53 am

Name: john zeock
Source: unca20091007.htm
Rob- Martha Jones returns for the series finale. Jonathan- as repugant and repulsive as the films were that Harlan wrote about, they look like Don Siegel and Sam Fuller films compared to what's out there today. Why can't we stigmatize the fans of this dreck the way we can the dirty old men in raincoats going to porn theatres ?

john zeock
Posts: 167
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 6:30 pm

*

Postby john zeock » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:53 am

Name: john zeock
Source: unca20091009.htm
Rob- Martha Jones returns for the series finale. Jonathan- as repugant and repulsive as the films were that Harlan wrote about, they look like Don Siegel and Sam Fuller films compared to what's out there today. Why can't we stigmatize the fans of this dreck the way we can the dirty old men in raincoats going to porn theatres ?

Gary Lee

can you HEAR me?

Postby Gary Lee » Tue Jul 28, 2009 6:28 am

Name: Gary Lee
Source: unca20091007.htm
Is it just me or have you guys and gals noticed that the movies are getting LOUDER!!!!, for some time now Ive noticed the level of sound slowly rising till it seems that you head is about to explode. Even the rather subdued nature of the last Harry Potter movie had moments when I turned to my wife and said gee that seems loud.

I know I getting older but my hearing seems to be getting better, is this going to be the future?, the worse the film the louder the sound?, dont get me wrong I LOVE good sound effects and all that but you dont have to break my ear drums to put it over.

I hope you know what Im saying or do I have to SHOUT!!!,

Taking it down a notch.Gary.


Gary Lee

can you HEAR me?

Postby Gary Lee » Tue Jul 28, 2009 6:28 am

Name: Gary Lee
Source: unca20091009.htm
Is it just me or have you guys and gals noticed that the movies are getting LOUDER!!!!, for some time now Ive noticed the level of sound slowly rising till it seems that you head is about to explode. Even the rather subdued nature of the last Harry Potter movie had moments when I turned to my wife and said gee that seems loud.

I know I getting older but my hearing seems to be getting better, is this going to be the future?, the worse the film the louder the sound?, dont get me wrong I LOVE good sound effects and all that but you dont have to break my ear drums to put it over.

I hope you know what Im saying or do I have to SHOUT!!!,

Taking it down a notch.Gary.


User avatar
Moderator
Site Admin
Posts: 10607
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:17 pm
Contact:

The Sound of Revolution

Postby Moderator » Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:30 am

Name: Steve Barber
Source: unca20091007.htm
GARY LEE - It is not your imagination. It used to be that commercials were significantly louder than most TV programs they supported. (They weren't genuinely louder, they simply hit the loudest volumes more frequently that the shows did. Now it isn't as noticeable -- the commercials aren't quieter, the programs themselves got louder.) Movies -- and the theatrical sound systems they are using -- are hitting the higher decidels more frequently (as well as using lower frequencies for effect, which duplicate "rumbles" -- remember "EARTHQUAKE in SENSURROUND"???)

The music we listen to has also followed this pattern. The increased volume on recorded CDs is easily noticeable if you compare a twenty-year-old disk with one purchased last week.

It gets even more distressing, though.

Cris recently was working on a project with a band out of Orange County. The Mastering Engineer -- the person who is responsible for producing the final Master -- told the band members to bring him CD recordings for bands they like the sound of. (Meaning, of course, pre-recorded copies purchased as a compelte project.)

The band brought in twenty examples, all of them downloaded MP3s. All of them copied onto recordable CDs. All of them compressed files, with all of the sound degradation inherent in that format. And all of them at several decibels above what the engineer considered "safe" for headphones.

No one in the band had a professionally recorded or duplicated CD, despite the fact that this is exactly the end product they, themselves, hope to produce. John Vestman, the ME at the studio Cris uses, told them to go out and listen at sound booths, etc, and buy copies of CDs they liked.

No one in this particular band had ever purchased a CD. And I would propose that they're not unique. It never occurred to them that the downloaded MP3s are so inferior to a recorded CD that it's NOTICEABLE to even the untrained ear.

So. It's not your imagination. Films, recorded music, television and other entertainment formats really have gotten louder -- and in many cases the quality of the sound is suffering at the same time. There's been some sort of unwritten agreement that increasing the volume will somehow compensate for the overall loss of quality. Make it visually overwhelming, hammer the eardrums, and most filmmakers/music makers/etc. know that they have an audience willing to pay for it.

It's the easy way out, but it is what it is.



(Though don't even get me started on the WRITING!)



User avatar
Moderator
Site Admin
Posts: 10607
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:17 pm
Contact:

The Sound of Revolution

Postby Moderator » Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:30 am

Name: Steve Barber
Source: unca20091009.htm
GARY LEE - It is not your imagination. It used to be that commercials were significantly louder than most TV programs they supported. (They weren't genuinely louder, they simply hit the loudest volumes more frequently that the shows did. Now it isn't as noticeable -- the commercials aren't quieter, the programs themselves got louder.) Movies -- and the theatrical sound systems they are using -- are hitting the higher decidels more frequently (as well as using lower frequencies for effect, which duplicate "rumbles" -- remember "EARTHQUAKE in SENSURROUND"???)

The music we listen to has also followed this pattern. The increased volume on recorded CDs is easily noticeable if you compare a twenty-year-old disk with one purchased last week.

It gets even more distressing, though.

Cris recently was working on a project with a band out of Orange County. The Mastering Engineer -- the person who is responsible for producing the final Master -- told the band members to bring him CD recordings for bands they like the sound of. (Meaning, of course, pre-recorded copies purchased as a compelte project.)

The band brought in twenty examples, all of them downloaded MP3s. All of them copied onto recordable CDs. All of them compressed files, with all of the sound degradation inherent in that format. And all of them at several decibels above what the engineer considered "safe" for headphones.

No one in the band had a professionally recorded or duplicated CD, despite the fact that this is exactly the end product they, themselves, hope to produce. John Vestman, the ME at the studio Cris uses, told them to go out and listen at sound booths, etc, and buy copies of CDs they liked.

No one in this particular band had ever purchased a CD. And I would propose that they're not unique. It never occurred to them that the downloaded MP3s are so inferior to a recorded CD that it's NOTICEABLE to even the untrained ear.

So. It's not your imagination. Films, recorded music, television and other entertainment formats really have gotten louder -- and in many cases the quality of the sound is suffering at the same time. There's been some sort of unwritten agreement that increasing the volume will somehow compensate for the overall loss of quality. Make it visually overwhelming, hammer the eardrums, and most filmmakers/music makers/etc. know that they have an audience willing to pay for it.

It's the easy way out, but it is what it is.



(Though don't even get me started on the WRITING!)



Josh (not Olson)

Forgive me for posting from Wikipedia

Postby Josh (not Olson) » Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:43 am

Name: Josh (not Olson)
Source: unca20091007.htm
For more reading on the subject, check out this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war

Ya'll have a good one.


Return to “The Art Deco Dining Pavilion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests