Pavilion Digest: July 2009

A plethora of perplexing pavilion posts. The Pavilion Annex thread, the Pavilion Discussion thread, and monthly digests of all messages from the Pavilion.

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Douglas Harrison
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:26 am

GOOD NEWS, HARLAN

Postby Douglas Harrison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:19 am

Name: Douglas Harrison
Source: unca20091007.htm
The bookseller in the UK confirmed to me that the copy of the 1 March 1930 issue is available, and I have made payment, which was less than anticipated: only 10.85, or about $18.00. So cross your fingers and I'll let you know when it's mailed.

Cheers,
D.


Douglas Harrison
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:26 am

GOOD NEWS, HARLAN

Postby Douglas Harrison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:19 am

Name: Douglas Harrison
Source: unca20091009.htm
The bookseller in the UK confirmed to me that the copy of the 1 March 1930 issue is available, and I have made payment, which was less than anticipated: only 10.85, or about $18.00. So cross your fingers and I'll let you know when it's mailed.

Cheers,
D.


Douglas Harrison
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:26 am

MORE GOOD NEWS

Postby Douglas Harrison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 2:19 pm

Name: Douglas Harrison
Source: unca20091007.htm
HARLAN:

The bookseller just e-mailed me to say that the magazine was shipped this morning (GMT) and should be there in about a week.

D.

Douglas Harrison
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:26 am

MORE GOOD NEWS

Postby Douglas Harrison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 2:19 pm

Name: Douglas Harrison
Source: unca20091009.htm
HARLAN:

The bookseller just e-mailed me to say that the magazine was shipped this morning (GMT) and should be there in about a week.

D.

David Webb

The one remaining acceptable bias

Postby David Webb » Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:50 pm

Name: David Webb
Source: unca20091007.htm
As someone who turned 60 not too long again, it pains me to see how acceptable it has become to make fun of those who are no longer young. It strikes me that the dummy copy of Realms of Fantasy on Ms. Bradford's web site referring to Mr. Ellison's cognitive abilities was mean sprited and elicted an angry response by Mr. Ellison that could have been anticipated. I have never voted for a Republican presidential candidate but it pained me to see how John McCain's age was ridiculed....jokes about Depends, Viagra, etc. Why is it acceptable to ridicule the old but any comment remotely mentioning race or religion is politically incorrect?
Everyone over 60 is not senile, impotent or incontinent...it will be interesting to see how some of those ridiculing the elderly will face their own aging.
I have nothing against Ms. Branford but note that the dummy copy of the magazine is still on her website, and I don't see her apologizing for the ridicule of Mr. Ellison's cognitive abilities.

David Webb

The one remaining acceptable bias

Postby David Webb » Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:50 pm

Name: David Webb
Source: unca20091009.htm
As someone who turned 60 not too long again, it pains me to see how acceptable it has become to make fun of those who are no longer young. It strikes me that the dummy copy of Realms of Fantasy on Ms. Bradford's web site referring to Mr. Ellison's cognitive abilities was mean sprited and elicted an angry response by Mr. Ellison that could have been anticipated. I have never voted for a Republican presidential candidate but it pained me to see how John McCain's age was ridiculed....jokes about Depends, Viagra, etc. Why is it acceptable to ridicule the old but any comment remotely mentioning race or religion is politically incorrect?
Everyone over 60 is not senile, impotent or incontinent...it will be interesting to see how some of those ridiculing the elderly will face their own aging.
I have nothing against Ms. Branford but note that the dummy copy of the magazine is still on her website, and I don't see her apologizing for the ridicule of Mr. Ellison's cognitive abilities.

steveperry
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:31 am

Don't Look Back ...

Postby steveperry » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:08 pm

Name: Steve Perry
Source: unca20091007.htm
What goes around comes around; all those people laughing at granny and grampaw now will -- if somebody doesn't step on them first -- eventually be long in the tooth.

When my children were teenagers and lippy, I'd sometimes offer them the Parents' Curse -- Someday, you might have children, and if and when you do, it'll be my turn to laugh.

Happened that way, and while I know it's not karmically-clean to smile when I see my kids having to deal with teenagers of their own, I do it anyhow. Now you know ...

Harlan's tender spots are well-known, and easily prodded, and there are a lot of trolls out there who enjoy nothing more than poking somebody just to elicit a response.

The internet makes people brave. They say things they would never say to your face and think of themselves as tough hombres. Keyboard warriors.

It is not nearly as satisfying as slapping them silly, but the best way is still to starve them to death. It isn't the issue they care so much about, but the attention, yea or nay. Hey, look, I got somebody well-known to *notice" me! Telling them what idiots they are, in great and lucid detail? They don't care. In the words of Ron White, "You can't fix stupid."

Deny them the satisfaction, you win. Let them get your goat, they control the situation. Remember Sonny Coreleone ...

Perry

steveperry
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:31 am

Don't Look Back ...

Postby steveperry » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:08 pm

Name: Steve Perry
Source: unca20091009.htm
What goes around comes around; all those people laughing at granny and grampaw now will -- if somebody doesn't step on them first -- eventually be long in the tooth.

When my children were teenagers and lippy, I'd sometimes offer them the Parents' Curse -- Someday, you might have children, and if and when you do, it'll be my turn to laugh.

Happened that way, and while I know it's not karmically-clean to smile when I see my kids having to deal with teenagers of their own, I do it anyhow. Now you know ...

Harlan's tender spots are well-known, and easily prodded, and there are a lot of trolls out there who enjoy nothing more than poking somebody just to elicit a response.

The internet makes people brave. They say things they would never say to your face and think of themselves as tough hombres. Keyboard warriors.

It is not nearly as satisfying as slapping them silly, but the best way is still to starve them to death. It isn't the issue they care so much about, but the attention, yea or nay. Hey, look, I got somebody well-known to *notice" me! Telling them what idiots they are, in great and lucid detail? They don't care. In the words of Ron White, "You can't fix stupid."

Deny them the satisfaction, you win. Let them get your goat, they control the situation. Remember Sonny Coreleone ...

Perry

Semi-Writer
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 6:24 pm

Whew.

Postby Semi-Writer » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:38 pm

Name: Semi-Writer
Source: unca20091007.htm
I'm glad to have avoided the majority of the issue surrounding Realms and so on, as I'm more of an observer than a do-er. And, to paraphrase from the '70s, "I'm not a Jew, but I've played one on TV!": http://www.mechon-mamre.org/jewfaq/speech.htm

Semi-Writer
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 6:24 pm

Whew.

Postby Semi-Writer » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:38 pm

Name: Semi-Writer
Source: unca20091009.htm
I'm glad to have avoided the majority of the issue surrounding Realms and so on, as I'm more of an observer than a do-er. And, to paraphrase from the '70s, "I'm not a Jew, but I've played one on TV!": http://www.mechon-mamre.org/jewfaq/speech.htm

Warren Lapine

Just Posted on K. Tempest Bradford's Blog

Postby Warren Lapine » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:59 pm

Name: Warren Lapine
Source: unca20091007.htm
I realize by posting this on Tempest's blog I'm about to a lot of heat, but I had to set the record straight.

I realize I should just stay out of this and let all of this stand. There is nothing that I can possibly gain posting this, but Harlan is a friend of mine and though I certainly did not want him to enter the fray I know that he did it, in part, because we are friends and he thought I was being treated unfairly. Frankly Id have been happier if everyone on my end would have stayed out of it and allowed me to deal with the entire thing myself. That didnt happen and so here I am to bring a reality check to a lot of what is being said here.

First Harlan never called Tempest a Nigger (I hate even typing that word) as many of you are stating here as bald fact. Moreover Harlan did not even call Tempest a NWA. Now I realize why many of you think this is what he said. Here on her Blog, Tempest said, he hurls several insults at me, but some of my favorites are: Im in the NWA, a Women of Cuhluh, and a swineherd.

As to the NWA what Harlan actually said was She has dummied-up a truly insulting mock-cover of REALMS that is intended to be offensive to anyone who values my sixty years' work. Now: watch your step. She is apparently a Woman of Color (which REALLY makes me want to bee-atch-slap her, being the guy who discovered and encouraged one of the finest writers and Women of Color who ever lived, my friend, the recently-deceased Octavia Estelle Butler). And she plays that card endlessly, which is supposed to exorcise anyone suggesting she is a badmouth ignoramus, or even a NWA.

If you take the time to actually parse the sentence in question youll see that what is actually being said is that Tempest plays the race card whether the person shes interacting with is just disagreeing with her or if said person is calling her a member of the NWA. The latter would, of course, deserve to have the card played; the former would not. He did not say, Tempest is.... That just didnt happen. Tempest misread the sentence and I can only assume all of her friends either didnt check the original or they also misread it.

Harlan also did not call Tempest a Women of Cuhluh. What he actually said was, Well, folks, if you'd like to give this termagant a taste of her own approbrium sic, you got the Public Name in a Public Place, so have at it. Even those of you who are Merely Women, or even Women of Cuhluh. The name in question is clearly intended for those minions of his that he is sending to do battle with Tempest, not for Tempest herself. As for calling Tempest a swineherd, yeah, he did call her that.

I am not trying to defend anything that Harlan said here, he can do that for himself. If you want to think of him, or call him, a racist because he called Tempest a swineherd or because he said he wanted to bee-atch-slap her or because he claims she plays the race card to her own advantage, you have every right to your oppinion. I wont agree with you, but I wont try to say you are wrong for feeling that way. What you cannot do is say Harlan is a racist because he called Tempest a nigger or said she was a NWA because that did not happen. If you are going to make these kinds of accusations against anyone you have an obligation to get it right.

Warren Lapine

Just Posted on K. Tempest Bradford's Blog

Postby Warren Lapine » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:59 pm

Name: Warren Lapine
Source: unca20091009.htm
I realize by posting this on Tempest's blog I'm about to a lot of heat, but I had to set the record straight.

I realize I should just stay out of this and let all of this stand. There is nothing that I can possibly gain posting this, but Harlan is a friend of mine and though I certainly did not want him to enter the fray I know that he did it, in part, because we are friends and he thought I was being treated unfairly. Frankly Id have been happier if everyone on my end would have stayed out of it and allowed me to deal with the entire thing myself. That didnt happen and so here I am to bring a reality check to a lot of what is being said here.

First Harlan never called Tempest a Nigger (I hate even typing that word) as many of you are stating here as bald fact. Moreover Harlan did not even call Tempest a NWA. Now I realize why many of you think this is what he said. Here on her Blog, Tempest said, he hurls several insults at me, but some of my favorites are: Im in the NWA, a Women of Cuhluh, and a swineherd.

As to the NWA what Harlan actually said was She has dummied-up a truly insulting mock-cover of REALMS that is intended to be offensive to anyone who values my sixty years' work. Now: watch your step. She is apparently a Woman of Color (which REALLY makes me want to bee-atch-slap her, being the guy who discovered and encouraged one of the finest writers and Women of Color who ever lived, my friend, the recently-deceased Octavia Estelle Butler). And she plays that card endlessly, which is supposed to exorcise anyone suggesting she is a badmouth ignoramus, or even a NWA.

If you take the time to actually parse the sentence in question youll see that what is actually being said is that Tempest plays the race card whether the person shes interacting with is just disagreeing with her or if said person is calling her a member of the NWA. The latter would, of course, deserve to have the card played; the former would not. He did not say, Tempest is.... That just didnt happen. Tempest misread the sentence and I can only assume all of her friends either didnt check the original or they also misread it.

Harlan also did not call Tempest a Women of Cuhluh. What he actually said was, Well, folks, if you'd like to give this termagant a taste of her own approbrium sic, you got the Public Name in a Public Place, so have at it. Even those of you who are Merely Women, or even Women of Cuhluh. The name in question is clearly intended for those minions of his that he is sending to do battle with Tempest, not for Tempest herself. As for calling Tempest a swineherd, yeah, he did call her that.

I am not trying to defend anything that Harlan said here, he can do that for himself. If you want to think of him, or call him, a racist because he called Tempest a swineherd or because he said he wanted to bee-atch-slap her or because he claims she plays the race card to her own advantage, you have every right to your oppinion. I wont agree with you, but I wont try to say you are wrong for feeling that way. What you cannot do is say Harlan is a racist because he called Tempest a nigger or said she was a NWA because that did not happen. If you are going to make these kinds of accusations against anyone you have an obligation to get it right.

User avatar
Harlan Ellison
Harlan Fucking Ellison
Posts: 847
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 10:24 am

THANKYOUS THANKYOUS THANKYOUS

Postby Harlan Ellison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:15 pm

Name: HARLAN ELLISON
Source: unca20091007.htm
DOUG HARRISON: I wish, very very onceinawhile, that I were not a cheery Jew Atheist, so's I could blubber, "God bless ya, son."

But I are, so the simple thankyous for my soon-to-arrive Part One of "They March from Yesterday" will have to suffice. Thankyou.

ROBERT MORALES: As always, kid, you ARE d'Man. I cannot be as old and icky (ahem!) as all that, to have lifelong friends like you. (For those of you who've never had the rare wonderfulness of scarfin' at a deli with Morales, well...it's a lot like having missed knowing Terry Carr or Estelle Butler or Bill Rotsler...the Great&theNearGreat, the Grand&theSuperlative.

As for "Jim Davis" and "Rich" of posts earlier today:

There are lots of places for you to go, not to mention Hell, where y'all could Burn Forever. This is my ONE place, and I'm as classy as I can manage. If you don't like the cut of my jib, maggotii, just get in the wind. Everyone else here is, as you point out, an Ellison-loving toady; and that's just how I want it in MY house, ya pustulant turd-gobblers.

Classier than thou, the lease-holding tenant here, Harlan

User avatar
Harlan Ellison
Harlan Fucking Ellison
Posts: 847
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 10:24 am

THANKYOUS THANKYOUS THANKYOUS

Postby Harlan Ellison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:15 pm

Name: HARLAN ELLISON
Source: unca20091009.htm
DOUG HARRISON: I wish, very very onceinawhile, that I were not a cheery Jew Atheist, so's I could blubber, "God bless ya, son."

But I are, so the simple thankyous for my soon-to-arrive Part One of "They March from Yesterday" will have to suffice. Thankyou.

ROBERT MORALES: As always, kid, you ARE d'Man. I cannot be as old and icky (ahem!) as all that, to have lifelong friends like you. (For those of you who've never had the rare wonderfulness of scarfin' at a deli with Morales, well...it's a lot like having missed knowing Terry Carr or Estelle Butler or Bill Rotsler...the Great&theNearGreat, the Grand&theSuperlative.

As for "Jim Davis" and "Rich" of posts earlier today:

There are lots of places for you to go, not to mention Hell, where y'all could Burn Forever. This is my ONE place, and I'm as classy as I can manage. If you don't like the cut of my jib, maggotii, just get in the wind. Everyone else here is, as you point out, an Ellison-loving toady; and that's just how I want it in MY house, ya pustulant turd-gobblers.

Classier than thou, the lease-holding tenant here, Harlan

User avatar
Harlan Ellison
Harlan Fucking Ellison
Posts: 847
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 10:24 am

THING TO COME

Postby Harlan Ellison » Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:30 pm

Name: HARLAN ELLISON
Source: unca20091007.htm
You may miss it, which is just swell, trust me.

Apparently, as do many sites, we have our outpatient plethora of remanifesting looneytunes, who post ugly and senseless snippets of their inbred lunacy. One of these appeared (again) a few scrolls down from this one, as "Subjective Bourgeois" or somesuch. Gawd willin' an' the crick don't rise, by the time you read this, our Beloved Webmaster may already have mopped up the puke. As you know, Rick always does yeoman service in catching and flensing such dreck. Usually in mere minutes. But our boy is away on family business yet he heroically assures me he'll have it gone by tomorrow. It is time-waste, as always, so kindly do yourself and all the rest of us, even you toadies, lickspittles, drones and ass-kissers who are only here to ride my glorious coat-tails and pump up my rotting senile geeezer-ego...just let it fall in the ocean. As the great Dorothy Parker put it, "...if it falls in the ocean, well, hell, then it falls in the ocean."

Smiling through the shitstorm, I remain, still, Yr. Pal, Harlan


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