Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

General discussions of interest to readers and fans of Harlan Ellison.

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:05 pm

Lotsa FAIR, mainstream media bashing to wet the eye and the soul:

http://www.fair.org/blog/2011/04/05/is- ... etraction/

See, they love the Tea Party:

http://www.fair.org/blog/2011/04/05/not ... -not-news/

Bob Woodward is not our friend:

http://www.fair.org/blog/2011/04/05/the ... ournalism/

Rachel Maddow, does she support war crimes?:

http://www.fair.org/blog/2011/04/05/mad ... -targeted/

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Apr 06, 2011 10:24 am

This Alfie Kohn quote about cheating just nails it dead on:

"Just about everyone agrees that cheating is bad and that we need to take steps to prevent it. But it is precisely this overwhelming consensus that makes me uneasy. Whenever a conclusion seems so obvious and is accepted so uncritically, it’s probably time to take a fresh look. That doesn’t mean we’re obligated to give equal time to arguments in favor of cheating, but it may make sense to reconsider what the term actually signifies and examine what leads students to do what they’re not supposed to – and what that tells us about their schooling."

That's my problem with some of you here, you accept ideas uncritically, without looking at fresh views about them.

Why do kids cheat? Is there something about the boredom, idiocy of their schooling that leads them to cut corners? The media works the same way. Like a boring teacher giving us the conventional wisdom like beets from a babies backside.

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Ezra Lb.
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Ezra Lb. » Wed Apr 06, 2011 10:43 am

That's my problem with some of you here, you accept ideas uncritically, without looking at fresh views about them.

:lol:


Any comment Frank?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html
“We must not always talk in the marketplace,” Hester Prynne said, “of what happens to us in the forest.”
-Nathaniel Hawthorne, The Scarlet Letter

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:30 am

FrankChurch wrote: That's my problem with some of you here, you accept ideas uncritically, without looking at fresh views about them.



I don't think that's true or fair comment on anyone here, Frank. I think you're misconstruing trusting sources you personally don't like for closed minds -- and to be honest your own views tend to be very one-sided in and of themselves. There's a difference between being critical of sources and being outright dismissive of them. I don't recognize some of your sources as any more irrefragable than you consider some of mine.
- I love to find adventure. All I need is a change of clothes, my Nikon, an open mind and a strong cup of coffee.

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Moderator » Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:35 am



Kudos to Goldstone for not only keeping an open mind, but admitting and re-evaluating his position. The mark of a responsible, neutral and ethical chair.
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Lori Koonce
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Lori Koonce » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:04 pm

"That's my problem with some of you here, you accept ideas uncritically, without looking at fresh views about them."

Frank

When did it become necessary for people to discuss their thought process in order to have an opinion.

It's things like this that make you the pariah around here. I've never once accused you of not thinking about your positions, I just happen not to agree with them. Two intelligent people can come to different conclusions based on the same information. We aren't robots, we aren't programed with the "only" correct way to think and behave after all.

Not that it's any business of yours, but I've spent my late teens and early 20's being a Republican. I have changed and so have my points of view on a lot of things, politics included. If anyone accepts things uncritically it's YOU. How many times have you found reasons to discount what I and others have said to you. And if you can't find anything to criticize, you just ignore it.

Now, I know you didn't mention me by name, but I'm sure most of the people you are refering to won't respond, and if they do it won't be quite as nice as I'm being. Just think about things before you speak. It's hard, but it would improve things a lot for everyone.

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:22 pm

Ah, guys, nudge, nudge, don't get too excited:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-d ... t-1.354376

Goldstone is backtracking on only some of the report, especially the parts about intent on Israel's part, which is hard to prove, especially when powerful states give you zero cooperation, something that needs to be mentioned for full knowledge on this issue.

Also, Goldstone is not dropping the probe from the UN, a very important point, since Ezra thinks this is some smoking gun. Obviously Israel wants the entire report scrubbed, which the UN will not do and Goldstone agrees.

The main body of the report is about the unfair use of force against a dense population of mostly civilians. This Goldstone still agrees on and the report will still go to the General Assembly. Sure, the US will reflexively veto it, just as they vetoed the resolution on the Settlements being illegal.

Jonathan Cook, an Israeli journalist says that Israeli human rights agencies interviewed soldiers who said that they were instructed to carry out operations, with little or no regard for civilians, as long as there was zero risk to soldiers.

Israel also has a vast record of killing civilians, with little concern for their safety. Human rights groups and guys like Cook and Amira Hass have been outlining this stuff for years.

Cook also says that Goldstone may have been pressured.

We shall see what comes next.

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:27 pm

Granted, Lori dear, but you didn't call me illiterate, like Rob did. He's the one who doesn't look at available sources, especially ones that are dissident sources. I tend to trust independent inquiry over corporate tainted ones.

He also has a real problem with Muslim people--not bigotry, per se, but a problem.

I will do better. Ok?

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:31 pm


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Lori Koonce
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby Lori Koonce » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:41 pm

FrankChurch wrote:Granted, Lori dear, but you didn't call me illiterate, like Rob did. He's the one who doesn't look at available sources, especially ones that are dissident sources. I tend to trust independent inquiry over corporate tainted ones.

He also has a real problem with Muslim people--not bigotry, per se, but a problem.

I will do better. Ok?


That would be GREAT Frank. You know where to find me if you need to bounce things off of someone before posting them.

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Thu Apr 07, 2011 3:15 pm

Once again ABC cannot wait to have on Jesse Ventura:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_iQxXWsfu4

I tend to believe they have on charactors like this to make our side look silly. I wish Jesse could understand that he is being shucked.

It will be fun though to look at the new book. See if the documents are real or not. I will say that the public record is full of stuff that will make your hair turn white.

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Ezra Lb.
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Re: Party like it's 1939

Postby Ezra Lb. » Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:12 pm

An article in today's WashPost about Bob Dylan's big tour of mainland China. Including info about how he had to agree to drop songs from his set list that were bothersome to the government censors as a condition of performing. Of course that would be most of the early "protest" songs that made him famous and are still prominently highlighted in his set list.

It's too easy and facile I suppose to talk about "selling out" and offering criticism from someone who will never be offered the big paycheck to someone who is, but I can't help but think there's something rather shabby and sordid about entertaining the sons and daughters of the party elite while an artist like Ai Weiwei is "disappeared" and no doubt languishes in some cellblock reserved for those whose crime it is to speak out.

Dylan is not unique of course. After the current excitement in Libya started it was revealed that several major western artists had entertained at private parties in Europe financed either by Colonel Gaddafi himself or his sons. Such luminaries as Sting and Beyonce now somewhat shamefacedly promise to return their fees.

Ok the 60s were over a long time ago and I will cop to terminal (or at least relapsing/remitting) naiveté but at what point did we decide that the party goes on no matter what?
“We must not always talk in the marketplace,” Hester Prynne said, “of what happens to us in the forest.”
-Nathaniel Hawthorne, The Scarlet Letter

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:24 pm

Dylan has always said that he was not the representitive of the peaceniks. In interviews he even says Masters of War is not an anti-war song. He has been apolitical for the most part, but he should boycott China. I'd say it was an ego thing. He has enough money.

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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:26 pm

What's ironic is that I can find more things to cut from the government then both the GOP and the goofy democrats. Cut the military in half and you save bundles of money.

Single Payer would save the government oodles. Can I dream?

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FrankChurch
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Re: Frank Church's news corner, the sequel.

Postby FrankChurch » Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:52 pm

I just heard that the US wanted Columbia to extradite a venezuelan narco-trafficker to us, but they refused, saying that they were going to extradite him to Venezuela, where he is wanted on murder charges. Columbia sites the fact that they have an extradition treaty with Venezuela and not the US and that murder is more serious a charge than drug dealing.

This victory is a real stick in the eye to the American empire who want to kill the socialist experiment.

In the end, guys, it is not about Chavez, it is about the oil. Always has been.

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