Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion

Archive - 08/15/2005 to 09/26/2005

Unca Harlan's Art Deco Dining Pavilion

: One of them seemed to me a pleasant man with a nice manner.

: The other struck me as a superannuated teen-age golem with a slack jaw, a slow manner, a typical pointless surliness at a world unwilling or unable to accept him as Superlative, and on sum a twerp easy to dismiss.

I suppose then, sir, that the particular observation is the very reason the two of them are able to produce such a splended and unique blend of humour. Please remember that there are a lot of intelligent people in this world -- some, dare I suggest, are more intelligent than even you -- and this intelligence need not be expressed in the same manner by which you measure your own. I hope that you would not pretend that you could compose music with the same degree of insight you use to compose a sentence.

You may not find their breed of humour funny or their form of expression engaging, but you have to respect that they were invited to the event as your peers. If you really believe what you seem to believe about one or both of them, I see only two real possibilities:

Your breed of expression is past its prime and you lament the end of the 1980's. You are sorry to see what is becoming of your aging fan base and helpless to cope with the onslaught of Internet publishing [Even this interface is crude and five years behind the times]. You feel the need to lash out at any conceivable threat and hide behind a shield of vocabulary whenever your motives are called into question.

- or -

You really are a complete and total megalomaniac.

I find the second conclusion most likely, but I still feel the first has merit. You are of course entitled to feel however you wish, but please take the following into account:

I am not a young man, though I am not nearly as old as you and far older than either of the Penny Arcade authors.
I was a fan of yours before Penny Arcade existed.
I am no longer a fan of yours because you ruined my fun. I could care less about how smart you are. I know plenty of people personally who rank at the highest levels of intelligence by various means of measurement and none of them would behave like you have. Welcome to the list of idiot savants.

Fools and foolscap
Hey all,

As a long-time lurker and Ellison admirer, I hate to prolong the discussion of the foolscap foolishness, but there is a question I must ask. Am I correct in my understanding that Harlan Ellison, a writer whose contributions to English literature will be remembered for as long as this thing called civilization continues to sputter and gasp, was asked to share guest-of-honor status with two nimrods whose only claim to fame is a snarky web site about video games? And then asked to don a dunce cap on stage with said meatballs?

Is this correct?

If Oscar Wilde wasn't dead, he is now.

Chuck

Hello little fuck
Love your star wars material, keep up the good work.

"Of course I wasn't there, but the first thing I think of when I think of insulting Harlan Ellison is to call him a little fuck. There's an old story out there (stop me if you've already heard it) about him propositioning a tall blonde woman at a party with the line, "What would you say to a little fuck?" Her answer, of course, was, "Hello little fuck."

Still gets him riled I hear.

Harlan, I need to apologize for my meshuggener behavior during the book signing Saturday night right before your charity lecture.

To be brief, one of the items I wanted signed was the booklet from the On The Road With Ellison volume 2; only I forgot to remove the security strip from the jewel case. With people behind me and the time almost 9:30, I got really flustered and HE deservedly so busted my chops for the way I acted. BTW, HE signed the jewel case!

I agree with HE's assessment of Gabe and Tycho.

Yes Kristin there are Webderlanders in the Seattle area. As I posted yesterday, I was only able to attend the guest of honor and charity speeches. I wish was able to spend time Sunday at the con.

In rooting about the internet, I found another great quote from Louis Pasteur:
"I beseech you to take interest in these sacred domains so expressively called laboratories. Ask that there be more and that they be adorned for these are the temples of the future, wealth and well-being. It is here that humanity will grow, strengthen and improve. Here, humanity will learn to read progress and individual harmony in the works of nature, while humanity's own works are all too often those of barbarism, fanaticism and destruction."

David

I can't believe you got up there and made fun of Gabe and Tycho! Tycho -- Tycho! -- who has never written an unkind word.

And children around the world were raised on Gabe's beloved brainchild, the Fruit Fucker. You smear their memory with dirt. How could you? How could you get up there and do it?

Yay.

"Hi Mr. Ellison.
Just wanted to tell you how much I loved your Star Wars book.
Cheers!"

And who says Oscar Wilde is dead?

say what?
WHAT? There are Webderlanders in Seattle??? I'd gotten the impression it was only the five of us Harlan took to dinner NONE of who was local and several (such as Barney) had bigger reasons than me for doing it, (going out of their way I mean) like having had years to really make friends with The Man. I'd have loved to have met YOU! (the name tags dopnt say where anyone is from, because mostly only local people attend I guess)

nice reports, guys!

Ugh. Giving out a URL in public brings the trolls out too...

Well, I suppose Harlan isn't for the shy or fearful; I wouldn't sic Harlan on myself. Except I did, by coming here. I decided long ago I wouldn't be scared away from this board, As for the con...*Eventually* I think i did manage to look HE in the face if not in the eye....if I ever get it right he'll call me by my first name instead of my last name like a drill sergeant....never mind. Um. I was not there at the Gabe/Tycho thing if that is what you mean. I hope they were not overly offended - somehow everyone always seems to get angry on behalf of somebody *else*.

I do know "foolscap" means paper, but I think I learned it from something in Cecil Adams' "Straight Dope" column. Pure chance, not from looking it up. Of course, most people have dictionaries around somewhere. Don't they? I mean, I had to buy one for Freshman English.....and there ARE reputable dictionaries that have online or CDROM versions (although subscribing to the electronic Oxford English Dictionary costs more than most non-academics can probably justify.) Anyway, many people are well informed about specific things since modern society often forces you to specialize, but nobody (except maybe Harlan) knows absolutely everything.

Kristin
I was a spooky horse in a previous life...or maybe a scared bunnyrabbit...

Hi Mr. Ellison.
Just wanted to tell you how much I loved your Star Wars book.
Cheers!

THE MOON AGAIN
Hmmmm.....the ever truthful news media has reported that we...homosapiens will be back on the Moon by 2018. This could be very interesting when the Mayan calender declares the end of humanity by 2012. This could very well be verrrrrry interesting
indeed!

Well
I am hoping this reaches the ears of Mr. Ellison, but I just want to say something. I read penny arcade every day (yes, by that I do mean that I read it every day, even when there hasn't been an update, as there are news posts). On the other hand, I had to wiki YOU.

Thus, I can't understand where you get off acting like a jackass to two people you just met and assuming they are below you (and implying that they are somehow less by accusing them of not finishing high school, very childish...), thinking that you can just dismiss them out of hand. If you didn't know who they were, maybe you should have at least tried not being rude and mouthing off. Courtesy isn't too much to ask from you, I hope.

I won't be reading any of your material. ever. (just so you know)

Ryan


p.s.- ...although I just can't wait to read your next star wars book.

Geeewhiz, I seem to have aroused the feral bleats of Gabe & Tycho's aficionados.

Met the co-guests of honor at Foolscap for all of two minutes.

One of them seemed to me a pleasant man with a nice manner.

The other struck me as a superannuated teen-age golem with a slack jaw, a slow manner, a typical pointless surliness at a world unwilling or unable to accept him as Superlative, and on sum a twerp easy to dismiss.

But then, I'm known for my compassion.

Harlan

More Foolscap. Paper, eh?
Intelligence and wisdom aren't the same thing, Robert Morales. I don't claim to be an expert on either, or on the little Foolscap incident itself, but from what I can see the situation was really ridiculous. EXTREME rudeness with a capital "R." Detestable. OH, and I find it HILARIOUS that people consider degradation intelligent. Stellar. Like your implication that Andrew was socially inept. That's precious. OOZES intelligence. It is SO intellient, I am forced to add a SMILEY to express my opinion!

">:("!!! GRAA to you, I say! GRAAA!

Harlan! Love your Star Wars stuff man. Keep it up!

I have the misfortune to live in the state that claims Bill Frist as its own; he wants to be the next George W. Bush, or did want to, anyway, before Our Glorious Leader's approval ratings went into the toilet.

Formerly, I lived in the state that claims such sorry sacks of fewmets as George W. Bush, Tom DeLay, and Phil Gramm as its own. I worked for the Texas State Legislature for fifteen years, 1978-93, but took to telling folks instead that I played piano in a whorehouse.

A long time back, I lived in Topeka, Kansas, which is home to the Westboro Baptist Church, whose members believe that God hates fags.

Is this a great country, or what?

Looks like Bill Frist is another stock crook. Boy, the locusts just keep shadowing the capital.

Almost three hundred thousand marchers at the anti-war rally, but a middling four hundred at the pro-war one. A fun, cloud flecked day for the left.

The hurricane wasn't as bad as it was reported.

Really is a good start for the week, for a change.

------------

"You seem to think that your shit don't stink, but lean a little bit closer and the roses seem to smell like boo boo. The Roses really smell like boo boo"

Outkast.

Love those Star Wars books Mr. Ellison. You should read more Penny Arcade and realize that you are not god's gift to wit.

HARLAN: Just wanted to let you know that I got your package. Thanks again, man! For everything.

-John

A word from the chair
As the chair of Foolscap, I wanted to write what a great joy it was to host Harlan for our convention, how much we enjoyed bringing him to Bellevue, and how easy he made it for us.

In retrospect, I wish we'd gone easier on his scheduling, as HE was dead tired at the end of the con, but wouldn't consider dropping anything once it'd been printed that he'd be at an event. HE gave very generously of himself, and it was much appreciated.

I hope Harlan will chalk up the over-scheduling to enthusiasm, and our hearts speaking. As HE will remember, mortals are weak and frail. When their stomach speaks, they forget their brain. If their brain speaks, they forget their heart. And if their heart speaks, they forget everything.

best regards,
Hank

Pardon me. My last sentence should have been "You can be both."

That must be it. I've personally never met a hostile intellect. Clearly one can't be intelligent and egotistical at the same time. Being smart and being rude are not mutually exclusive. You be both.

Andrew, it's funny how intelligence always comes off as hostility to the ignorant or the socially inept. Funny, but not cool.

Foolscap
Wow. I don't want to say Harlan came off like a complete ass, but I'd be lying. I sat in when he had some sort of weird confrontation with Penny Arcade creators "Gabe" and "Tycho." A tip: trying to imply that people who don't know that "foolscap" is another term for paper are ignorant fools makes you look like a pompous jackass. Way to be cool, sir.

And it must be great to be so damn cool that a person can come up with the best quip or response in any situation, said in JUST the right way. If I were cynical, I might think that he exagerrated some of those situations.

Re: "Foolscap VII"

Sounded like a great outing. Wish I'd attended that one.

Always wanted Harlan to yap up on the Holmes scrapbook (both the Doyle stories and the film log).

...and with regards to Mr. Pasteur: MY mind was NOT one prepared coming in; so, I'm still at the bus stop waiting for that Chance. Hope it won't be too much longer; it's gettin' chilly out here.

Foolscap
Harlan was in top form. His lecture on the secret of life (theme: "chance favors the prepared mind") was illustrated by anecdotes from his ill-starred army career, full of frying pans to the face, drunken sadist sergeants and machine-gunned cows. In fact, I noticed on every panel -- and Harlan pitched in for several hours each day, to his credit -- he illustrating his points with anecdotes. The storyteller can't help himself.

New short-short story: he composed a 15-minute (!) gem...the vocabulary this guy has on the tip of his tongue is a marvel...based on a painting of a stone tower (?) writhing toward a nebula. It was an elegaic, but not dour, vignette of the end of the universe.

Mortality, alas, is clearly an insistent presence in the Ellisonian mind (and lifelong-svelte Ellison detests his post-bypass paunch, often enjoining himself and all similarly afflicted [in a target-rich environment, given this is a con for bookworms, myself included] to lose weight.

In sum, it was Ellison at his angsty, hilarious, encyclopedic best. He was recorded on digital video throughout; let's hope it's disseminated soon.

In re to Foolscap VII, I had a wonderful time. It was great seeing Harlan and Susan. Unfortunately with a little one at home my attendance was limited to a brief stop on Friday, the Guest of Honor and charity speeches on Saturday, and a quick looksie on Sunday with Shanee (2 1/2 years old). Silly me didn't think to stop in again today on my way home from seeing my Dad.

I did meet a few Webderlanders. Maybe the Seattle area Webderlanders can meet once in a while. The talks that I did see were quite entertaining and vintage Harlan. I don't know where he gets his energy from!

The charity talk was just amazing. I'd identified with what HE spoke about and liked the advice he gave:
read the Sherlock Holmes stories and remember this quote from Louis Pasteur: "Chance favors the prepared mind."

I'll post again tomorrow with an apology to HE for my behavior during the book signing before the charity lecture...

David

(hic) oops, double post I meant Ellisons.

Foolscap day 3
2 funny panels. Banquet ($29 ticket.) Dinner with the Ellisonians and Webderlanders at Black Angus. No more to say. Sworn to secrecy (bad enough i committed the vile sin of bringing a laptop to a CON!!!) If even this was evil speech, Rick can delete it.

Kristin

Latest projects
I would like to know if there are any recent television projects I can check out.

American Ideals
Harlan is a well-known champion of the right to free speech, and the right to an (educated) opinion.

In today's Yahoo news (from Reuters) there was an article noting that yesterday's anti-war rally at the Mall in Washington DC was attended by some 100,000 people.

In contrast, today's Pro-war, Anti-anti-war protesters rally was attended by roughly 400 people.

In comments at the lightly attended rally Senator Jeff Sessions observed:
"The group who spoke here the other day did not represent the American ideals of freedom, liberty and spreading that around the world, I frankly don't know what they represent, other than to blame America first."

The 100, 000 do not represent his ideals of freedom (including freedom of Speech, we must assume). His 400 attendees evidently do.

Additionally (from Yahoo): One sign on the mall read "Cindy Sheehan doesn't speak for me" and another "Arrest the traitors"; it listed Sheehan's name first among several people who have spoken against the war.

Yes, Democracy is healthy and alive here in the land of the free, as long as you agree with the Bush agenda. Those that disagree with the conservative minority are, evidently, traitors.

I have a shot in my portfolio I wish I could share. It's entitled "Land of the Free" and was taken last Christmas in Washington, DC. It's of the White House, separated from the National Christmas tree by the famous black wrought-iron fence, as well as freeway-style stone dividers, a chain link fence, and a fourth barrier of chains.

Steve B

Hurricane Katrina, cont.
Whatever may or may not be true about the causes of Hurricane Katrina, I can vouch for one of its effects. This past Friday, I got a call from a trauma surgeon of long acquaintance (we graduated from high school together, back in the Late Pleistocene) who had just returned to her home in Texas following weeks of rescue work in Louisiana. Previously she had described conditions in the devastated area as "horrible, just horrible," adding that "you can't imagine the misery and stench." This time, almost the first words out of her mouth were, "Bush is such an asshole!" Later she qualified the remark: "he's a double asshole." Now, this is a lifelong Republican and koffee-klatch pal of the First Lady's I'm talking about. The Great and Mighty Oz really has been unmasked. The millennium really has arrived. Hell really has frozen over.

United States
>The Earth is, afterall, a singular and marvelously complicated system, but not impervious to humanity.<

I'd say it was the other way around. Global warming may be bad news for humans and other large mammals, but the insects are loving it, and plants, which are really the dominant life form on earth (and perhaps the "reason" animals exist at all), will thrive.

In Crichton's otherwise silly book "Jurassic Park" this point is made very well. Arrogance got us here, and arrogance continues to feed the idea that man will ruin the planet. But the planet will still be here long after we've burned ourselves off of it, and life will march on.

Foolscap day 2
..Harlan just (well, between 11:30 and 12 or so) finished delivering his lecture/reading/rap on the secret of life, his favorite aphorism from Louis Pasteur , "Chance favors the prepared mind."

He also announced he would autograph every book for every person (well, this is a smallish con...) before the con ended. Harlan, are you just feeling...OLD? Guess you can't go and die leaving someone's book un-autographed. That would be evil!


Oh, and he did a mini-writing workshop for stories inspired by computer print outs of paintings from the artshow. Of the dozen some odd people there several actually did register on his talent meter. I'm not one of them...I think I had the worst story there...but I admitted it so there were no unpleasant scenes.

This is a nice friendly convention and I hope to attend another in the future.

Kristin

Peter:

It wasn't butterflies in that room. It was Ashton Kutcher frantically waving a copy of the one good review for THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT.

D.

My theory
Forget this global warming stuff. The real culprit for these hurricanes is Chinese Terrorists. I heard they filled a room with butterflies, then opened the door.

---Peter

"The changes are there, they are measurable and we need to address this situation."

Yup, indeedy. It's frustrating to watch the scientific community, particularly with the Earth sciences, only begininning to acknowledge that the entire global ecosystem is linked; what happens in one area affects another area. Everyting's connected, and they NEED to start coalescing their data. The Earth is, afterall, a singular and marvelously complicated system, but not impervious to humanity.

Thankfully, on the other side, I covered in advance everything I'd have to say further on the subject to Todd OR Peter Reeves. It's not much different from talking to this guy I know who only (and I mean ONLY) listens to Rush Limbaugh for his information. It's scary...and THOROUGHLY pathetic.

Re: our ventures into space, returning to the Moon, etc.

At the right pace, it's all going to happen. Many solutions to the problems our species have created for this planet lie out there in space (from mining resources to re-adaptation...after all, between a human global population that grows, and grows, and grows, an atmosphere that's being battered, glaciers that are melting, and an interglacial period that will take a turn some thousands of years from now, not to mention a sun that will nova in millions of years from now, we'd BETTER be "spreading our seed" to the heavens or we're doomed as a species), and it will also help resolve issues for starving populations and disease.

Whatever misgivings at the present any of you have about venturing back to the moon or beyond, it's inevitable. It WILL happen according to the urgencies and necessities dictated by the time and by research. Even if we remained earthbound, the solutions we'd find would probably be overwhelmed by the infinite number of disasters that await us. Global warming is an established fact. Glaciers are melting at a slow, yet steady rate. Polar ice can change the water level of the oceans, the temperature and climate of an entire region, and alter the exchange of heat between the ocean and the air above. Oceans have risen in the last 100 years by, I recall reading or hearing, as much as 6 to 8 inches in the last 100 years. The seas actually appear to be rising fast because the land is actually sinking in some places and rising in others. I don't think they know yet how much of the rising global sea level is caused by melting of the glaciers or by expansion of the existing ocean water due to slow warming. Either way, the rising ocean levels would make hurricanes and other storms more dangerous. So imagine: more than half the U.S. population lives within 50 miles of a coastline. Many land masses like that region in Louisiana, and countries like the Netherlands are BELOW sea level. What do you suppose is awaiting THEM?

So, humans have to and WILL steadily head for the stars. Do you think humans are going to allow themselves to succumb to the fate Nature holds for them in the long run, at least without a fight? No way.

"The Man Who Was Heavily Into Revenge"
Harlan...

Bob Ingersoll is an amusing fellow. I've been dealing with a contractor for several months now. Not a pleasant time.

Hearing of my latest clash, Bob said that if you ever asked me to adapt another of your stories for comics, I should ask for "Revenge."

He (as opposed to HE) thinks I could bring some personal anger to it.

Can I claim "dibs" on it now?

Much love to you and Susan,

Tony

P.S. Ingersoll will let you know where to send contributions to my bail fund. Doesn't hurt to plan ahead.

An invaluable resource for pricing rare books is http://www.abebooks.com/

RE: your rare books...I'd keep them, if I were you. Why sell them, they sound wonderful!

However, if you really want to sell them, cut out the middle-man and do some research on their value...there are a few used book guides out there. Then sell them on e-Bay. To me!!

Or, offer them up as lots right here. You'll have a few takers.

Selling the used books
Tim,

For God's sake, DON'T just take those books to a local used book shop. Latch on to a reputable specialty dealer. Dreamhaven Books wouldn't be bad, ditto Lloyd Currey, and no doubt Barney or some of the other folks on the board can give you a fairly comprehensive list of straight arrows who'll give you a fair price (and aren't a couple of you folks dealers yourselves?).

I've scrounged around used book shops a lot since I was 14 years old, & I've never seen a copy of Canary in a Cat House. If it's in excellent shape, that's probably worth some decent $$$. Ditto some of the rest.

Anyone who's more current on today's prices and dealers care to help this guy out?


Bests to all,

--tr

Can Someone Give Me Advice?
I'm a longtime Ellison reader, and I have a question for the group regarding a box of about 50 old SF paperbacks which was recently given to me. The box contains 1st ed. paperback originals from the 1950's, nearly all in excellent condition. The titles and authors were instantly familiar to me, as many have been mentioned repeatedly in Harlan's work: "The Demolished Man" by Alfred Bester, for example, and "Mother Night" and "Canary in a Cat House" by Kurt Vonnegut. Other titles are by Charles Beaumont, Brian Aldiss, Algis Budrys, Isaac Asimov and Fredric Brown.

I'd like to sell these in toto...but, short of taking them to a local used bookstore, have no idea how. Any advice?

(BTW - I've snagged the early Ellison paperbacks from the box already)

Consenting adults flushing $500 hammers down the shitter

Even aggressive efforts wouldn't have us in lunar colonization mode so soon. Even if we had started in the 1960s. Though one has to think that in an ideal world a multi-national approach to such an effort might have lots of people thinking of space in a much different manner. Star travel instead of Star Wars?

Yeah, I've read too much of Asimov's fiction and not enough of his hard science.

So far as technological advances are concerned, why aren't we (in an effort to save one of our grandest cities), emulating the amazing efforts of Dutch engineers in the Netherlands?

We can't seem to get some of the most vital things right on this planet, let alone the engineering wizardry involved in putting a metroplex in Tycho or a mall on Mons Olympus. Recurring theme, eh?

Agreeing with Stan, I guess, in a way.

Now someone separate Todd and Rob. That stuff is unnecessary.

I am,
Neal

Hi Cindy

While it's true that September has always been the worst month in hurricane season, a scientist has found some disturbing shifts in storm trends. A professor at MIT named Kerry Emanuel, who studies atmospheric science reported in "Nature" that the number of category 4 & 5 hurricanes have increased by 15% since 1970. The change coming as a result of a half-percentage rise in water temperature. And these findings are coming from a scientist who was skeptical of global warming and wasn't looking for a link, but after his study claimed the issue stuck out like a sore thumb.

The changes are there, they are measurable and we need to address this situation.

Mark W.

Rob sez, “God knows what your moronic point is THERE….” in reference to my recent posting about hurricanes.

Hey, Rob, your knee-jerk response to my “moronic” statement once again proves you are a preacher on a soapbox rather than a rational listener/reader.

1) I was not poo-pooing category 4 hurricanes. I was focusing on category 5 hurricanes to make my point with Frank WHO WAS FOCUSING ON CATEGORY 5 HURRICANES. Yes, Robby Boy, we all know that category 4 hurricanes are bad things. Any hurricane is a bad thing. Sheesh, try some interpretive reading.

2) My posting had nothing, nada, zilch, the big ‘O’ to do with the Bush response to Katrina and the levees in N’Orleans. Read it again, nitwit, and you’ll see that my posting was about a brief timeline of past category 5 hurricanes and how they (and other hurricanes, if you put on your glasses and read between the lines) will often hit around September as September is Hurricane Season and has been Hurricane Season even before hurricanes had names and categories and humans to worry about them. Where Bush? Where Conservatives? Where levees? Where Halliburton?

Rob, you irk me with comments such as yours that relate nothing to my posting and yet call me moronic and dumb. In fact, I must warn you so that you can back calmly away from the pc, as may others who are easily offended….I must warn you that I need to curse you brutally with many expletives so that I can feel much better and go back to what I was doing prior to reading your response.

Here goes.

Rob, you are a motherfucking cocksucking sonofabitch bastard dogballlicking kittycunnilinging asshole.

Try not to misinterpret that one.

Ahhhhh. Feel much better. Ommmmmmmmmm.

-TODD

COLONIES ON MOON AND MARS
You know...I put the blame of not having colonies on either the Moon or Mars...squarely on the shoulders of NASA...the other bureaucratic assholes who THINK they run this country....and the invisible shadow government who needed the money ear marked for space research to their black ops operations. We should have enjoyed Disney on the Moon by now...or staying at the luxury MARRIOTT HOTEL ON MARS BASE ONE.
Instead of spending $500 for damned hammer that cost less than twenty bucks at Walmart...and the millions upon millions these people have literally flushed down the toilet (which cost us taxpayers another $5,000 or more!) We could already having the citizens of good ol' planet Earth on a time ship heading for Alpha Centauri. But! Why look on a fucked up past...lets try not to make a fucked up future.

What does GW stand for???
GW? You know what is scary??? People will think that stands for George W!

Speaking of politicians, I am NOT defending Bush - i loathe him - but all politicians, left or right, get all the blame/credit for whatever happens on their watch, even if they share it with their predecessors. So I'm willing to believe the katrina damage is partly Clinton's fault too, but it does little good to say so, since he is safely out of office and despite being impeached (for silly reasons) managed to avoid conviction (maybe there is something good about our political system after all.)

Ooh, and at www.skymall.com you can buy a talking action figure of GWB. (Or Reagan, or Clinton, or Albert Einstein, or Theodore Roosevelt, or any of many others.) Eeek!

Kristin
Posting from Foolscap where Susan thinks I'm "stressed out" (It's just my fevered brain overexcited at being here which is excessively like the fight or flight response! HE called out to Susan from across the hallway...she came....cool. :))

I agree, Global Warming Denial (like Holocaust Denial) is dangerous and evil.

GW rant

One of the most wearying and insulting positions taken by the Right is that which minimizes Global Warming.

Don't spoonfeed me cat shit and tell me it's oatmeal. This is a quantifiable, measurable, demonstrable phenomenon.

The hurricane cycle we are currently in is arguably a weather trend, and not necessarily an indication of GW. Scientists are loathe to pinpoint warm water in the Gulf of Mexico as solid proof of said phenomenon.

But there are plenty of other data compiled by folks a lot smarter than any of us that points to SOMETHING effecting a profound change in our environment.

Every time I see a fucking dumptruck belching blue, gray and black I know what that SOMETHING is. I used to live close to I-80, a major east-west thoroughfare. I lived close enough to hear it. No matter what time of day it was, I could always hear it. Every time I think of that artery I know what the SOMETHING is.

Don't be doodieheads.

Pogo knew,
Neal

P.S. Regarding political and public non-reactions and lack of proactive thinking with regard to impending doom, a politician whose name escapes me recently said (paraphrase),

"Our memories are so short, there is no telling what we will do on a pretty day."

oops, devastating

Rob, a little honesty wouldn't hurt. The threat of a devestating hurricane didn't just arise in 2000. Bush funded more levee upgrades in the last 5 years than Clinton did in the previous 8. Funding for the New Orleans levees was one of the targets of Clinton's budget balancing efforts, and he "cut" (i.e., did not fund at the level the Corps asked for) funding for the project.

http://eurota.blogspot.com/2005/09/us-left-all-straws-clutched-every.html

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=46132

Todd...

That's right, Katrina was a 4.

God knows what your moronic point is THERE. It's a bit like talking the differences between the H-Bomb and the A-Bomb.

Important issue is a 4 was anticipated years ago, Bush had been advised about it and the urgency of bringing the levees up to date, which were NOT constructed to withstand a 4 or 5. But your hero - this brainless fuck who is destroying the country in whole chunks (God knows when YOU'LL ever grasp that) - cut funds to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, while maintaining MASSIVE tax cuts for the wealthy (it eludes as to how you Conservatives can remain so untroubled by this), and, as a bonus, giving Halliburton guaranteed business.

Get your priorities straight: Bush underfunded the levees and they failed when warned this was coming.

Are you guys so BLINDLY "idealistic" that reality is THAT far out of your reach?

As Randi Rhodes says about Conservatives, "you're either very dumb or very cruel". My guess is generally the former.

Katrina was a Cat 5; fortunately it weakened to Cat 4 shortly before landfall. Per National Weather Service bulletins, both Katrina and Rita were, at one point, the third strongest hurricanes on record as defined by how low the barometric pressure had gotten (Rita, obviously, bumped Katrina down to 4th). While we're fortunate that both dropped down from Cat 5 before landfall, they were both very significant hurricanes shortly before doing so.

Frank Sez: "Two category five hurricanes within about three weeks, and in about the same area. They rev up once they hit the warm, inviting water of the Gulf Of Mexico. To say there is no global warming is to say their is no gravity."

First, Katrina was not a 5, and Rita no longer is anyway. But that's all beside the point.

There have been category 5 hurricanes throughout the previous century, in early enough times that they could not be cause by human exhaust. 1928, 1932, 1935, 1938, 1947, 1950, 1951, 1955, yadda yadda yadda. Two within 11 days of eachother in 1969.

Guess what is shared by all of these? The month of year: September. The height of, you guessed it, Hurricane Season. Just because all of these category 5 hurricanes did not hit the U.S. does not mean they did not exist. They existed, they always existed, they always will exist. Especially in September. Hurricane Season.

-TODD

space travel

I placed my comments on the future of the space program in the Forums.

You can go to that bookfair in D.C., but don't forget about the big anti-war march. It is your duty to be there and watch the people take back the flag from the jackels and brownshirt Republicrats.

--------

Irv Rubin went out like a man. I usually don't mock the dead, but in his fanatical name I will.

Dancing on graves is my new hobby.

Washington, D.C.ers
Anyone in the area going to try to make it to the National Book Festival on the Mall?

http://www.loc.gov/bookfest/pavilions.html

Neil Gaiman, E.L. Doctorow, George R.R. Martin, are just some of the talent represented.

I've slotted tomorrow morning for yardwork, but I hope to get down there by 12 or 1.

-Keith

No Eric, let's don't mess up Venus! Leave it as it is, what with all the dinosaurs and swamps and steamy ferns and such.

Anybody coming up here to YOUR NATION'S CAPITOL tomorrow for the big protest? Ms Sheehan will be here and that means the press so it'll likely be quite a day.

I'm going but that's not why. I'm going to stage a one man protest against the emptiness behind the Simian Rictus Mask, whosever face it covers. I'll have a two sided poster. On one side in Verdana Bold

WAR IS PEACE

FREEDOM IS SLAVERY

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

(Who knows I might run into Christopher Hitchens.)

And on the other side

CROATOAN

Thanks HE. It pays to have good writers huh?

Something Completely Different...
Sorry to deviate from the pending planetary exodus, but I was tickled to see in the new issue of Top Ten (a comic book which thrives on its obscure geek references) a scene of half-a-dozen Derradadaists dumping jellybeans on a crowd. They even drew the swizzle-skiffs to code.

Tee-hee,
Marci

cronk kite


am i the last person to hear about this? i just can't imagine myself breaking anything, especially NEWS.

http://www.philipkdick.com/films_scanner-061204.html

The Fart Factor
What you're forgetting, Eric, is what all the sulphur dioxide in the atmosphere of Venus is going to smell like. Imagine the hottest, windiest, filthy sock fart emanating from one of those coal fired kilns used to bake ceramics. Sure, we can filter MOST of it out, but I don't think it will be any more effective than rolling down the windows when your 350 pound habanero chili eating buddy cuts a wet one in the car.

All hail the Moon, where at least we're smelling our own.

>I would not be surprised if, in a hundred years, there are not permanent colonies on the moon and Mars.

I will be. Of course, I'll be rotting in the ground, so I'm sure I'll be surprised at everything at that point.

The incentive to make the moon pay off is just not here. It's close, but it has no pressure, temperature, gravity, or atmosphere that we can do anything with. Ditto Mars, which is kind of like the moon dressed up, just a lot farther away.

Go to Venus, say I. Plenty of atmosphere to work with, and the gravity, pressure, and temperature are just about right...if you're floating a few miles off the surface. Build there, and then go to work on Saganizing the atmosphere. Venus is closer, our bones won't turn into rubber bands working there, and the potential is much greater -- once you shake and bake the place a la Aliens.

I have no doubt that in the fullness of time human beings will move out into space and I would not be surprised if, in a hundred years, there are not permanent colonies on the moon and Mars.

But NOW, RIGHT NOW I think it is too soon to focus so much of our resources on the act of physically sending a privileged few to the moon just so we can say we've done so.

These marvelous unmanned probes, which cost a fraction of what manned flights do, function as our surrogates, the eyes of us all, not just a privileged few. We should be seeding our solar system, from Mercury to the Oort Cloud, with these machines, scoping out our immediate environment.

But by focusing on manned flights these worthy projects are done on the cheap or worse, eliminated altogether.

Just so homo sap can beat his chest and stick a flag in the ground.

TO FRANK CHURCH
Hey Frank! Maybe our sons should send us old farts out to fight in Iraq....bet the war would be over in a heart beat.

You guys missed a good Bill O'Reilly last night. The fucking guy almost threatened Phil Donahue with violence. Donahue mentioned to O'Reilly that he had not sent his son to fight in Iraq and O'Reilly went crazy. I tell you, the guy has mental problems. He does need to be sent straight. Would love to see Harlan give him some guff. I can dream, right?

--------------

Todd is a conservative, so his love of green cheese is understandable. They tell you they believe in responsible government, but the guys spend more than woman on a hot credit card spree.

Shoot for the Moon and Other Observations
(God I just love coming up with the subject line...)

Todd is exactly right regarding the monies for the new Moon effort -- this is money that is already earmarked for the NASA budget. Yes, it supposedly comes at the expense of items like Hubble and the Shuttle, but there is no guarantee that the money would be there for them in any other scenario.

Alan Coil is right. "Spending money to return to the moon will leave people here on Earth still homeless and malnourished."

And NOT sending people back to the Moon will leave them in exactly the same condition. You seem to feel the money would be immediately diverted to a humanitarian cause, and that every dime spent in another direction is also directly out of the mouths of the homeless. I would support your cause if I thought anyone could actually redirect the money in that way, but it ain't gonna happen no matter how hard we squinch our eyes and say "I wish, I wish, I wish"...

I agree, however, that the Moon costs have been very badly presented to the public, but the fact remains that the Moonshot will, at the very least, NOT contribute much more to already bad financial shape Mr. GWB has thrust the nation into. As I have repeatedly stated, at least it's something I can support, as opposed to tax cuts for his buddies, cronies running FEMA, religion being taught as science, and this little military action he's taken in a far off land called "Iraq".
________________________________________________

Leave it to Poppy Brite to find something amusing in a hurricane. My younger sister awoke after hurricane Ophelia (North Carolina) to find a Port-a-Potty in her front yard. Disaster Relief with home delivery?
________________________________________________

Three cheers to the jetBlue pilot who safely got a lot of people back onto the ground. I fly jetBlue as often as possible, and this is one more reason to chose 'em. Good pilots.
________________________________________________

I decided this morning that the quarantined dude in the "hatch" is Danielle's ex. He got the house.


SB

Those attending the Foolscap convention this week-end, please e-mail me. I'm looking forward to meeting some fellow webderlanders!

David

Simon is gone
Well...I think the most important Nazis are either dead, dying or have already been dealt with legally. I think Simon Wiesenthal, could rest on his laurels....he outlived them all, after spending the worst time in the hellhole of a concentration camp. I believe his legacy of hunting the guilty involved with the Holocaust is still going on...I suppose the only ones left are the young guards who are now entering their eighties. Simon made sure that all of the World would never forget...because it could happen again...and it did in Kosovo...the mass genocide of Saddam against his own people...PolPot in Cambodia. Why is it human beings who attain a lot of power, feel the need to destroy other human beings?
I guess it is something to do with our genetic makeup. It so sad, we have to deal with the power mad homosapiens...and as Rodney King said long ago....and I quote: "Why can't we all get along with each other?" It is still a question not answered to the fullest, maybe it never will.

cool link here (time valued)
Check this out.....


http://stores.ebay.com/AuctionCause/

First Amendment Project - you could be written into a book as a character (Or have an alien race named after you in a David Brin sf novel.) Participating authors include Neil Gaiman as well as several more mainstream writers (I think the auctions may have already closed for some of them.

I wonder if cynicism about space travel (especially manned space travel) is especially characteristic of New Wave authors and fans due to their generally leftist orientation??

Kristin

RE: Hurricane Rita.

Whipping off the Florida Keys, hitting speeds up to something like 120mph...

The beauty of it is that the Mayor of N.O. has announced that there will not be enough gov't help for those stranded when Rita hits. "Neighbors must help each other", he urges. Fend for yourselves.

Thats the beauty of a Faith Based gov't policy.

Oh, yeah. Halliburton is getting a ton of contracts out of this thing.

Oh, yeah. And Bush has appointed a vetinarian to head women's health care. No joke; look it up.

**I think new ventures to the moon are sound: we can ship the poverty-stricken up there and start freeing up some space in the Superdome again.

THIS FROM POPPY Z BRITE

too damn funny not to post

over the course of the past couple days Poppy got into her house

here is one of the high points from today's journal entry:

"One embarrassing footnote: The animal rescue people had to heave the mattresses off our bed to catch cats underneath, and lying out in the middle of the floor were two bongs and a huge hot-pink dick-shaped jelly vibrator. Sadly, we are so vanilla that it's been years since I used the latter to do anything but massage Chris's neck and calves after a long kitchen shift. "

Unabashedly,
Neal

the fucken blues


this country is so broke it cannot afford to spend the night.

(stolen from Buddy Guy)

Two category five hurricanes within about three weeks, and in about the same area. They rev up once they hit the warm, inviting water of the Gulf Of Mexico. To say there is no global warming is to say their is no gravity.

All I can do is hide under the blankets. Your world scares me.

Going back to the moon?
What an incredible waste of money.

The entire purpose of this Republican empire is to bankrupt the country so they can dismantle Social Security and all the other social programs. Spending money on a return to the moon will just help speed this process.

We can't even afford to pay for Katrina relief.

And now, Bush was on promising the people of Texas that what happened with the relief effort in New Orleans and southern Mississippi would not happen in Texas. Of course it won't. It's his home state and they voted for him.

His promises are all empty air. There are no relief people left. There are no relief supplies left. There are no more spare doctors to tend injured and ill people. If another disaster occurs, we will have to call on the Mexican government to lend us a hand. We have no resources left.

Spending money to return to the moon will leave people here on Earth still homeless and malnourished.

People, people, people,

NASA is not stating that they need $104 billion handed to them for a special project to go to the moom. NASA is stating that a project, with a target date of 2018 (13 years from now) will total $104 billion.

First, that's $8 billion a year. Second, they are stating that this mission will be paid through the current NASA budget. Priorities will be shifted (including the already planned decommissioning of the space shuttle in a few years) and the moon mission will rise to the top.

NASA is not asking for a hand-out; they are stating the costs of a project as it falls within their budget. A budget cut on NASA will result in a project delay/concern, but otherwise they are simply saying "instead of buying these 4 paperbacks, we're going to buy this 1 hardcover."

-TODD

Ezra #
"If it's a massive social works program you want, why not spend the $100 billion on a Manhattan Project/Apollo type program to develope alternative or renewable energy resources in order to wean ourselves off of Texas Crude?"

I could not agree with you more on this, E#. If you can get this puppy onto Congress' docket with a snoball's chance of passage, I would be more than thrilled to support and advocate it. I'm sure the President would have an opinion, however, that we would all disagree with.

I also am heartsick at the dismissal of Hubble. It's an incredible tool which is being allowed to die -- but what a legacy it leaves behind.

Yes, machines have the capability to explore the solar system. That's what we've been doing for the last three decades, in fact. To argue that machines can do it and that we ought to have our feet solidly welded to our tiny little world, not venturing into the great unknown (or partially known, as the Moon would be) defies the core of what we, in our most enlightened moments, call the Human Soul.

There will always be humanitarian ways to spend money. There have been for thousands of years, ever since mankind invented the coin and the difference between poverty and wealth.

Not every penny goes to those programs, however. Nor should it. And, as I said below, I'm much happier some of my hard-earned taxes are headed for the Moon (and into the pockets of hardworking earthbound employees) than into rebuilding a nation we should never have invaded, or lining the wallets of the already wealthy.

Going to the Moon gives us a reason to look up, not down. A human voice and a human mind can describe, in infinitely greater detail, the "maginificent desolation" and incredible beauty of their experience.

And that's an experience no computer can duplicate, no matter how well it is made.
________________________________________________

I went back to the bookstore yesterday and elected not to purchase what turned out to be "Rumble" as theorized on this board.

I am sad to report that, according to the bookseller, the last three known copies of Harlan's completion of Lewis Carroll's "Rombles" were destroyed at the Burning Man Festival in 1992. Nobody's talking, but an oblique reference was made to a "Smokey the Bear" incident.


Steve B

Earth, Space, the Moon, and Beyond: why we must go!
Ezra,

I see your points and agree with all of them except the little one you make that we shouldn't be sending manned craft into space.

Developing the technology to go to back to the moon, and then Mars, will require extensive scientific and engineering feats, which will drive our economy, our universities, and our spirit as a species for decades to come.

Those are the 3 reasons we should go.

In fact, Bush's call to go to Mars is the probably the only political statement he's made with which I agree. It requires federal resources, and what Republican wants to spend federal dollars on anything but defense? It is a very UN-Republican goal. Coming from a man whom I view as the Tourist-in-Chief, it was a surprise.

Now, the one problem with NASAs plan is that they plan to use the rocket technology we already have, instead of developing new technology, to get us there. I find it hard to believe we don't know of better ways to drive to the moon. The good thing is, with all the advances in computer technology, we can probably go lighter and smarter, since the computer systems they used back in the 60s and 70s that wrapped around the craft internals several hundred times will now fit in chips that weigh thousands of pounds less, and are at least 30 orders of magnitude more powerful.

I say, it's about time.

-Keith

But cookie we ARE exploring space. See

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html or

http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.cfm or

http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/

The idea of the human race moving off of a dying earth to seek some New Jerusalem in the Milky Way is fantasy, not SF. Here we live, here we die. This world could be a paradise. If we destroy it we don't deserve to survive.

Hm. . .that'll actually dovetail nicely with my annual October 1st personal holiday of 'Bring a bat to the bookstore'. And to think, all these years I've been wondering the true purpose of that holiday. Been celebrating it for years. Now I see why.

And they say faith isn't rewarded in this day and age.

Stacy

"The Bookstore Mob Project
"At 2 p.m. E.T. on Saturday, October 1, independent bookstores across the U.S. will be the setting of a boisterous demonstration against the liberties of the solitary reader. Precisely at that moment, "flash mobs" will descend on indie bookstores everywhere, open their favorite books and read aloud simultaneously for two minutes, driving literate malcontents from the stores and demonstrating that the power of loud recitation and action-by-mob will conquer even the most dedicated reader.

"We anticipate that this will be the most thoroughgoing crushing of the independent mind," said Mr. O'Brien, coordinator of the de-mob-stration. "Readers tend to enjoy peace and quiet when they read. Well, we're going to remind them about the real wold that awaits them outside of their precious bookstores. Our flash mobs will demonstrate that not even a place _dedicated_ to reading can be free from the triumphant voices of the Popular Will."

This year, the Bookstore Mob project has added a new twist: encouraging its members to read aloud from "officially subversive" books.

"In years past, we usually encouraged our mobs to read from popular works, such as _The Da Vinci Code_ or _Left Behind_ or even that perennial favorite, _The Holy Bible_," says O'Brien. "But this year, we've decided to experiment. For example, If you have a stringy-haired, eyebrow-pierced poser in hornrims and a sweater standing next to you, declaiming _Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas_ at top volume, are you really going to look at it as a 'subversive' book anymore?"

Other planned "public readers" will include confused-looking older men reading from _Manufacturing Consent_, footnotes and all; teenagers in anarchist uniforms declaiming from the works of Kathy Acker, Henry Rollins and Valerie Solanas; men in Armani suits reading from _Nineteen Eighty-Four_ and _Atlas Shrugged_; and massively overweight, bearded men and women will perform selections of _Ender's Game_, _Farnham's Freehold_, and _Singularity Sky_.

The event coincides with the first day of Banned Books Week."

The Final Frontier
I'm thrilled about another mission to the moon. Eventually, and soonish, we may get to Mars.

Maybe it's the sci-fi lover in me, but I think that we *need* to explore space. I just don't see this planet lasting forever. I think that our survival as a species may some day depend on our ability to relocate.

Yes, we should be putting more money and research into alternative energies and green living. But it probably doesn't hurt to be exploring space in case that doesn't work out.

Still, I agree, that's a ton of money and we're stretched pretty thin as it is.

I ran across this posting and thought it might interest some folks here…

The Bookstore Mob Project
At 2 p.m. E.T. on Saturday, October 1, independent bookstores across the U.S. will be the setting of a boisterous celebration to show support for locally owned and operated booksellers. Precisely at that moment, "flash mobs" will descend on indie bookstores everywhere, open their favorite books and read aloud simultaneously for two minutes, symbolizing the immense variety of voices that can be found in America's hometown bookshops. The event coincides with the last day of Banned Books Week.


See:
http://bookstoremobproject.blogspot.com/

Awwwww...
Steve, how can somebody who reads speculative fiction be so anti-space program?? Yeah, the original apollo program was an arms race/publicity stunt..the REAL crime was the NASA turf wars that resulted in things like the Saturn V engineering drawings being destroyed, so to go back (and I think we SHOULD go back) we have to start again from SCRATCH!!

People refuse to believe the original moon landing ever happened at all. Well, nothing came of it in the long run so it might as well not have. That is reason enough to go back. (Although I agree that the timing may not be good w/Hurricane Katrina...)


As a kid I read hard sf first, and fantasy second..sorry...so I got my mind corrupted by rocket ship stuff.

Kristin
That's too bad about Simon Wiesenthal; he was one of the greatest heroes of the 20th century.

Simon Wiesenthal always struck me as a real-life amalgam of Dr Van Helsing and Lt Columbo - a peerless and gracious avenging angel. (Even though he let Errol Flynn and Charles Lindbergh skate, 'ey, Frank Church?)

Anyhow, before we all go off on another maudlin tally of the well-known recently deceased, can I suggest Webmaster Wyatt add a "Bring Out Your Dead" section to the forum?

Harlan - A while ago you mentioned that you had been invited to speak at Boston University in mid-October. Is that still a go? Or have the plans been changed?

Mark W.

Here After Rita
Had a windy night, a rainy day, and nothing more. Didn't even lose power (we were without for two days after Katrina). But all is well.

Someone of true importance has died today: Simon Wiesenthal.

-TODD

Steve Barber

If it's a massive social works program you want, why not spend the $100 billion on a Manhattan Project/Apollo type program to develope alternative or renewable energy resources in order to wean ourselves off of Texas Crude? Think how many future wars that would prevent! Think how much environmental degradation that would stave off!

I support the peaceful exploration of space. At this time that can best be accomplished by the sorts of unmanned probes like Cassini which is daily sending back amazing data from Saturn and its neighborhood. And losing the Hubble without replacing it is a crime against science. It would be like going blind.

Honey Bruce Friedman passes
I see in today's New York Times that Honey Bruce Friedman, Lenny Bruce's ex-wife, has passed away. I believe the divorce came before Harlan's association with Bruce, but I can't help wondering--Harlan, did you know the lady?

Florida Denizens
Hi, just a check-in on our FL friends... hopefully all are ok and/or unaffected by Rita...

Of Rombles and Rumbles
Thank you all for the input. I'm going to be near the bookstore again today and will drop in for a check and possible buy.

Stay tuned.

Rombles

"Rombles" was a tone poem fragment of Lewis Carroll's that Harlan was commisioned to complete on behalf of The Things we Find at the Bottoms of Barrels Formerly Belonging to The Estate of Lewis Carroll Society. At first, they paid him in clams or oysters but they all ran away. Nobody knows what became of them. Finally, he settled for a bound-in-white-vellum edition of The Hunting of the Snark and a picture in a small silver locket but nobody is saying what the picture is of. If you find another copy of ROMBLES, which was only reprinted once, in the horribly ill-fated BUISINES PARTNERS IN WONDER, I would go $85.00

- Barney

ps. They tell me there is a Skiffy Museum in Seattle. I'm hoping to track it down LATE Thursday afternoon or early Friday morning. Anybody with True Gen on this place or any other places cooler than a hotel room in Bellevue is welcome to shoot me links off-line. Or in the words of Daffy Duck, "Just shoot me. Shoot me now!"

- B.

Steve:

The first (1958) Pyramid edition of "Rumble" bears the code number "G352" at the top of the spine. Could be the "63" you're referring to. (See http://www.islets.net/novels/rumble.html).

Depending on condition, $85 could be a reasonable price, though hardly a steal. On the other hand, possessing a copy of the first edition of HE's first book is, as the commercial says, priceless ...

MZ

TO PATTY
Dear Patricia....Yes...I have found that in my mailbox too...only it wasn't from here. Those damnable spoofing spiders will take you email address or anyones including Harlans to use it to send their virus infested crap to us.
I have been on the Pavilion long enough, that Harlan's webmaster must know that I am regular or semi regular, that is why I will not put my email address on here anymore. I have already been in touch with MSN on this matter.

STAN IN BEAVERTON, OREGON

Researching a screenplay entitled "Mail-Order Murder", written in 1989 & is supposedly connected in some way to Harlan. It may be based on one of his short stories... Have had no luck finding any connection so far. Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks!

The Irked Shirker Unlurks.
Alex Jay Berman knows I'm not nice to be around when I'm irked.

I'm irked, Webderlanders, even though I know it can't possibly be one of you.

I accept that the Internet is populated by all kinds of people. Including those people who have the know-how and the free time to create and distribute spam with spoofed e-mail addresses.

I found a spoofed e-mail from webmaster@harlanellison.com in my box when I got back from NEBA this weekend. I know it's spoofed because the subject line is similar to many other pieces of spam I get daily. Plus it's 42k, a common size for spam e-mails with lovely virii built in.

I would think that Unca Harlan's living room would be free of Internet spiders collecting e-mail addresses. The only spiders I expected here would be my eight-legged ladies.

No real point to the story, except that, if you find a similar e-mail in your bulk folder, it's probably NOT from www.harlanellison.com.

--------Patty

http://www.mikescomics.com

*rombles could be part of a foreign title...maybe a foreign edition?

Could it have been "Rumble"?. There was a Pyramid paperback by this title (which is actually "Web of the City") published around 1958 or so.

Mark
heading down to the San Gennaro festival for a sauage and a bag of hot zeppoles, extra sugar please.

Mystery
Okay, Ellison-o-philes:
Today I was in a little used bookstore tucked into a corner of Long Beach (not Acres Of Books, so don't rush down there to nab the prize). In the "Rare Books" locked-up bookcase I spied a little book with the name "Harlan Ellison" on a portion of the spine. A tag with the price covered part of the title which looked like "*rombles". Looked to be either late fifties or early sixties in wear and tear, with the number 63 at the top of the spine.

The person with the key had stepped out for lunch, so rather than bring too much attention to it I simply told them I'd be back. I will get more info, but I can't find this title (or anything similar) in any of the biblios for Harlan. I consider myself fairly well versed in Ellisonia, but this one's beyond me.

Should I run and buy the thing immediate-like or run just as quickly in the other direction? They want $85...????

_________________________________________

And Ezra: I really would like to know if you truly think the $104B is going to be loaded up into rocket ships and launched to the moon? That money, mon ami, will be spent right here on lil' old terra firma going into the pockets of many thousands of American workers -- including a significant number in New Orleans, where they put together the external tanks.

Seems like a helluva lot better way to spend my taxpayer dollars than on war/reconstruction in Iraq or tax-reducted into the pockets of people significantly better off than the majority of us everyday workers.

Steve B

book question
Hi,

I know Dangerous Visions came out a little while back in a newer version with multiple covers. Thing is, I never got to see all the covers available. Does anyone know where I can see the covers and from there buy whichever covers strikes my fancy?

Thanks,
Tony

BOONDOGGLE
What possible reason could there be for homo sap to spend $100 billion to go back to the moon http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4261522.stm
????? We've already wasted billions on the International Space Station. Consistently successful unmanned probes have to fight for their lives for approval, barely squeaking by congress. The one unalloyed victory of the modern space program, the Hubble Space Telescope, is slowly being allowed to die on the vine with no firm plans to be replaced in the foreseeable future.

More imperial chest beating, hoorah!

Where's My "Little Buddy?"
If it's not too late, can someone locate the Professor and have him wire together a defibrillator out of coconuts?

Aye, thar seas be lonely ...
http://thewhizbang.org/

...which is my favorite local theatre group. Buy their cd, get on their mailing list, and check them out if ever you're in their proximity. Unpaid ad.

Talk Like A Pirate Day!
Avast ye mangy flea-bitten scurvy ratdogs!!!!!!! Tighten the jumpers and lower the shrouds!!! Darrrrgh! Who be thinkin' up the word "Grommet" anyway?! Someone three sheets t' the wind?! Maybe he be tackin' an' ate sail an that's all the crew could understan' comin from his mouth!!! It be a life question I can only solve by goin' to the crow's nest an finishin' the grog before it turns t' vinegar!!!! Who be the coxswain 'round here???

ATTENTION!!!!!! JOHN PACER!!!!!!!!!

If you're lurking out there, John...

Can't find your phone number.

Spoke to "the Man," Carl Gnam at Sovereign Media (REALMS OF FANTASY magazine) this morning. Called to find out what dispensation had been made with the folio you sent me. He said he was favorably impressed with your work and would be getting in touch with you. He added that the folio had been sitting on his desk, in a pile of "pending" since May (which I suspected), and he was apologetic for the delay. BUT he said he would be getting in touch with you, and would be returning the folio to me, rather than to you, as I'd requested. When it arrives, I'll send it back ASAP.

If you don't hear from him within a reasonable space of time, let me know.

All best otherwise,

Yr. pal, Harlan

(aka Trimalchio in West Egg)

Comments here are like the pitter patter of little muddy feet; you know, the kind of feet that you see leaving the scene of a gruesome axe murder. The blood drippings lead to a typewriter and the lead sheet has a red stain that looks like a big obscene H. Gotta love you guys, even though you have been grumbling lately.

-----------

Harlan, you hip to Henry Threadgill? Great modern jazz there.

AAARRRRRRRRRRRR!

Avast, ye seadogs! Today be National Talk Like a Pirate Day! Ye'll be keel-hauled at twelve knots and fed to the bilge rats if ye dasn't shiver yer timbers smartly!

And, I say, do be so kind as to stand and deliver your valubles in order to avoid a rather sticky end, old boy. (a non-scurvy pirate)

Chuck

Dostoyevsky ...
... I haven't read much of lately.

On the other hand, if you'd like to discuss Twain, Vonnegut, Verne, Heinlein, Hemingway, Frost, Bradbury, Martel, LeHane, Gaiman, Pat Frank's "Alas, Babylon" or this wonderful new writer named Ellison I'd be happy to oblige. (Why does this sound like a massive law firm?)

Then again, picture's being worth a thousands words and all, how about Henri Cartier-Bresson???

"Lost" season premiere is Weds, BTW.

One of the Other Steves

DTS: where you from? If only 2 cities get a movie, it's New York and Los Angeles. San Francisco is the next tier down, while San Jose never seems to be on the list at ALL for limited releases. guess i'll just have to wait for the DVD.

Amy, did you get my email? Yahoo mistook your earlier message for spam - good thing I checked the spam folder!

The only Dostoyevski novel I've finished is THE IDIOT, which is Harlan's favorite, isn't it? Anyway I might never have read it if I hadn't read "Prince Myshkin and Hold the Relish" and I will always associate that name with hot dogs somehow. There's also NOTES FROM THE UNDERGROUND, which is a shorter piece so if you want to give out a Spider-type "reading assignment" that one would be good. (Anything from the anywhere is a parody of that title, you know.)

Where's the Marilyn Mansion? Does anybody live in it? ;-)

Kristin
"My name is Montoya the Pet Avenger. You killed my dog. Prepare to die!"

Dream Corridor on DVD series?
Quite awhile ago I read in Starlog or Dreamwatch that Dream Corridor is being done as a series straight to DVD. Is this true? How is the project? Is it still a work in progress?

Good for you Dooner

right on with the right on

Neal

Steve: I'll meet that challenge, on one condition. Describe an ACTUAL "Courageous Cat and Minute Mouse" episode where Minute is NOT knocked unconscious (fainted, whatever) and upon regaining consciousness, told that he's the REAL hero by Courageous Cat.

Before you ask, Doug, you are NOT eligible for this offer.

"Is this board broken? The last posting was eleven hours ago!!!!

Or is it just Saturday? Hum."

If this was filling up with posts on a *Saturday*, I'd be concerned for y'all.

=)

Okay, I have a suggestion: no more talk about television or movies until we have talked about one great novel by Dostoyevsky. I double-dog dare all of you!

Snobbishly yours,

Steve Dooner

On TV themes:

When I was little(er), it was the DOCTOR WHO theme that had me running behind the couch. And I wasn't the only one! Probably the most atmospheric tv theme ever.

On banned books:

The fatwa may have boosted Rushdie's sales, but he had to go into hiding that whole time. I am sure he did not enjoy the experience. And the fatwa extended to people associated with the book as well. Wasn't one of its translators actually murdered?
That's an extreme case.
On the other hand, controversy does help. How many people rushed out to buy "The DaVinci Code" after church officials slammed it? And moving to other mediums, one Mr. Marilyn Mansion would have vanished off the pop culture radar with nary a blip had not the religous right made herculian efforts to keep him in the media spotlight. A billion dollars worth of free publicity and advertising guaranteed his success with high schoolers.

Frank:

I saw Mr. Galloway speak at the University of Toronto on Friday. Interesting guy. I'm surprised he wasn't detained at the border!

-Steve E.

By the way...and addendum to the post below
ALL: By the way (for anyone who _does_ read the profile), yes that's a typo in the first phrase of the first sentence uttered by Spragg. Should've been "are" instead of "is" -- but these things happen sometimes (and, unfortunately, go unnoticed by editor and writer alike). --DTS (thanks for your forebearance, Rick)

An Unfinished Life
ALL: Okay, folks, you've GOTTA check out the Lasse Halstrom-directed movie, "An Unfinished Life." It's only showing on something like 139 screens (this is it's second weekend of release), because some idiot in the upper Hollywood echelons decided to group it with films that are regularly "dumped" around this time of year. I read and reviewed the novel by Mark Spragg last year and can tell you that he used all sorts of hackneyed, formulaic characters and situations: single mother and her daughter on the run from a bad boy friend; father-in-law who despises said mother and blames her for the death of his son; two old codgers in their twilight years, caring for each other, sharing a bond that can't be broken. Then Spragg proceeded to take all of that refried material and magically breath new life into it, touching on issues of life and death that regularly haunt us all. He did so in his novel and in the script he simulataneously cowrote with his wife. If you want to read more about that and Spragg, here's a link to a profile I wrote. Click on number 13 and then use "settings" on the tool bar to magnify it all:
http://www.costcoconnection.com/connection/200409/

This movie is one of the best I've seen in a long time. What's more, it deals with adult concerns in an adult way; and like the novel, takes what could've been a merely hackneyed formula and turns it into something damn close to brilliant. That's just the script: the actors are fantastic -- Robert Redford, Morgan Freeman, Carolyn Mannheim, Josh Lucas, Becca Gardner, Damian Lewis (who was also great in "Band of Brothers"), and last, but not least (believe it or not) Jennifer Lopez. Finally, the camera work and direction turn the whole thing into the cinematic equivalent of an oil painting.

I know that there aren't many theaters showing this brilliant movie (KC just went from one last week to four - 'course, we did the same thing for "Off the Map," so maybe folks around here DO have some aesthetics where art is concerned); but if you can find it in your area, you'll be doing yourself and any friends or family a favor by taking it in. My daughter and I both enjoyed the hell out of it -- there's a 30 year age difference between us -- and I'm planning on going back to see it with my wife when she gets back in town.

If you've read bad reviews of the movie -- and I know of at least one simple-minded reviewer (in "Entertainment Weekly") that slammed it, ignore them and see the movie for yourself. You'll enjoy it.

--DTS

Test....
Is this board broken? The last posting was eleven hours ago!!!!

Or is it just Saturday? Hum.

Looks like there's two ways to attract more attention than you ever got before and they both suck: (A) being dead, (B) having a fanatical Muslim cleric accuse you of blasphemy and order his followers to kill you. (And you think you have a problem with deranged fans!) BTW if I understand it correctly "fatwa" just means *any* religious dictum issued by an imam and usually the issue is peaceful enough; the Rushdie thing got people thinking it meant putting out a contract on somebody (and many in the Muslim world attacked Khomeini's order as un-Islamic...but enough fanatics would have carried it out that Rushdie had to lie seriously low for a long time.)

Kristin
Testing to see if this goes up on the board

TODD:

Unabridged.

he

"So...
"...what you're actually telling me is that I am the only 10-year-old here who ISN'T a fairy."


Okay, coffee through the nostrils is really, really not a good time. Doesn't this place come with a disclaimer of some sort????

HARLAN,

Just got your package in the mail. Thanks! I'm a big fan of Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow. I'll be sure to watch the Sinister Cinema tape as soon as I can. Work's been nuts. Again, thank you so much, it was really cool of you.

Sincerely,

Stacy

"I'm afraid (pun fully intended) that I'm with Jan and Mark on this one. The Haunting was a truly frightening film."

...So, what you're actually telling me is that I am the only 10-year-old here who ISN'T a fairy.

Harlan, on your reading of Jack Williamson's new novel, will that be an unabridged reading or abridged?

-TODD

Sheep Star in Croatia Online Reality Show

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/tv/article.adp?id=20050914104309990014&cid=936

*makes note this is not anything your mother couldn't see*

A funny thing happened on the way back from the scary movie...

All this talk about "The Haunting" reminded me of a silly yet really well timed prank I pulled on somebody many, many years ago.

One of my best friends in high school had an older sister who had some VERY pretty acquaintances, so when we were sophomores we obviously enjoyed hanging out with those high and mighty seniors. Hey, we were young and dumb and thought we could get lucky! The week "The Exorcist" was released, a whole bunch of us, ie. a few male sophomores and a load of seniors of the very female persuasion, went to see the first late Friday night showing. Well, good or bad, there was a lot of screaming and fidgeting and generally nearly jumping out of our seats through all the gore and vomit on the screen. Afterwards my buddy and I, along with his sister and a couple of her lady friends, went back to their house to play records (remember those?), wash down some chips with soda, and all try to calm down after the cinematic assault. While nobody was paying attention, I grabbed my friend and whispered an idea in his ear. He loved it, we snuck into his sister's room, and crawled under her bed. A few minutes later she came in, sat on the bed to take off her shoes, and we suddenly arched our backs to "levitate" that bed several inches off the floor! Her scream could have drowned out a Ted Nugent concert!!

...the awe and mystery...


the lead-in to THE OUTER LIMITS scared green shit out of me as a kid

"WE HAVE TAKEN CONTROL OF YOUR TELEVISION SET..." oh shits

Neal

Alex jay started a thread in the forums called "Could someone post this for me?" Since I couldn't figure out how to cut and paste it, I'm simply directing people to it, and adding this: https://www.conlanpress.com/youcanhelp/index.html

I just recently discovered Peter S.Beagle's books, and they are wonderful. I have one on order and intend to order more.

Please read this. Thank you.

debbie

For those interested in all aspects of Shirley Jackson's life, I highly recommend Judy Oppenheimer's PRIVATE DEMONS, a full length biography of Jackson.

Shirley Jackson is glorious. Allow me to recommend the SUNDIAL to you also.

The later remake of the Haunting of Hill House is a steaming pile of ostrich shit.

Shirley Jackson lives!

How odd that Robert Wise's passing should start a discussion of "The Haunting" here, right at the moment when I'm reading the book on which it was based, Shirley Jackson's _The Haunting of Hill House_, for the first time.

Jackson was my featured author in "Story Time for Grownups" at Grendel's Coffee House on Labor Day. (I started out cold with "The Lottery," modulated to a humorous romance called "About Two Nice People," and finished with a lovely tale called "The Most Wonderful Thing." Was tempted to do the Jackson tale first printed by Fantasy & Science Fiction, "An Ordinary Day, With Peanuts," but it was a little long for my purposes.)

Haven't seen the Wise movie, but it sounds intriguing. The recent remake with Lili Taylor, Liam Neeson, Catherine Zeta-Jones, Owen Wilson, Bruce Dern, etc., appears to be conspicuous by its absence from this discussion. (Didn't see that one, either, but I remember the trailer.)

Helluva bad break for 20th century American literature that Jackson died when she was only 48.

__On Friday, Septermber 23 Turner Classic Movies will have a 24 hour salute of the movies Robert Wise was involved in___

Where's Trek I? Elitists.

On Friday, Septermber 23 Turner Classic Movies will have a 24 hour salute of the movies Robert Wise was involved in. Here is the schedule:

6:00 AM Citizen Kane (as editor)
8:00 AM The Magnificent Ambersons (as editor)
9:30 AM The Curse of the Cat People (director)
11:00 AM The Body Snatcher (director)
12:30 PM Born to Kill (director)
2:30 PM The Set-Up (director)
4:00 PM Executive Suite (director)
6:00 PM Somebody Up There Likes Me (director)
8:00 PM West Side Story (director/producer) 12/05,
10:45 PM Run Silent, Run Deep (director)
12:30 AM The Haunting (director/producer)
2:30 AM Odds Against Tomorrow (director/producer)
4:30 AM Blood on the Moon (director)

Looks like a good line-up

HARLAN's "I, Robot" script.
Not the other tripe.

(Just thought I'd clear it up before someone else did..."

Banned Hauntings
Rob -
I'm afraid (pun fully intended) that I'm with Jan and Mark on this one. The Haunting was a truly frightening film. If it didn't move you I'd wonder what did scare you as a kid (and don't say nuclear war or the Real Don Steel)?

Mark hits it right on the head with the comments about the use of sound. My imagination went into full overdrive picturing the creature that was pounding the walls, and that sufficed to give me nightmares for weeks. And, as for the films listed as OBVIOUS, there's a reason for that -- it's the same reason that the film Casablanca is so full of cliches. They're the obvious choices because they ARE so good that they BECOME the obvious choices. Less defensible would be something like Cat People 2 or whatever it was called.
____________________________________________________

Suggestion for the crowd: speaking of Ellison's vast array of incendiary works, I have an idea.

Harlan writes brilliant stuff. He writes banned stuff. He writes Brilliant Banned Stuff. One of the bestselling books of the 1980s was this little ditty called "The Satanic Verses" by Salman Rushdie, who was fairly unknown (by the general public) until a fatwa was issued by Ayatollah Khomeini in 1989. Instant bestseller.

Does anyone have contacts in this regard? I figure if the "I, Robot" script is declared "apostatic" by an Ayatollah we could have a huge bestseller on our hands. This would also help Asimov's estate. Just musing aloud.

And if anyone finds this offensive, my name is really Frank Church and/or Henri Cartier-Bresson (writing from beyond the grave).

No, banned books do not help anybody, just ask Henry Miller. The fucking guy ends up broke most of his life because Tropic Of Cancer cannot be released, once it did, sure the the guy started rolling in the money, but what for cost?

I would hazard a guess that Harlan's ample use of the f word is the reason some of his work is banned. Sure, the kids can roam the halls listening to violent gangsta rap, but damn them for hearing a well heeled story with that dreaded word.

Fuck is such a cute word too.

------------

Amazing debate between Hitchens and MP George Galloway. They really go at it.

http://democracynow.org/

should be a comma after "suspects". grrr.

bannd books
***Harlan*** I probably shouldn't even be typing this, as it speaks to "stategery" and self-promotion, but for once [lately] I feel the urge to amplify a thread. Banned books are good business. As I'm sure you know. In the same way that "infamy is the new fame" as you have explicated, banned books are now as much a marketing tool as buying the endcaps and re-stock cart space and ladder space in a Barnes & Noble.

So... If there is a documented incident - and I suspect there are *plenty*, of DANGEROUS VISIONS or DEATHBIRD STORIES just to name two likely suspects being banned by a school district, or a specific library, you are well on your way to having these books shortlisted alongside 1984 and INVISIBLE MAN and HUCK FINN and all those other treats we tuck in the walls in order to keep safe from the tender mercies of the Firemen.

Of course those guys are all safely dead and you're not, but shyness and reticence aren't exactly your strong suit. Or, in the words of "your people" - It couldn't hurt.

- Barney

ps. I'm looking at this post like a racoon with a new shiny object and trying to imagine it being a "problem post" and coming up blank. Hoping you do the same. If not, well I'll see you in a week and you can beat on me in person. Hugs to the missus. - B.

Batman Set, Again
Harlan, I hate to repeat a question, but again, it may be useful if I can get the review assignment.

So: which "Big Batman set" are you providing commentary on? The four-disc set of the Burton incarnation vomited on by Joel Schumacher? The deluxe release of this year's BATMAN BEGINS? Some version of the animated series? A release of the serial, or of the sixties tv show? All seem to be in the pipeline?

The Haunting
Rob & Jan,

I first saw the Haunting about 5 years ago when everyone was coming out with various lists of the greatest movies of the 20th century. I was familiar with Shirley Jackson, and decided to give the movie a shot.

What impressed me the most was the use of sound in the film. The scene where the men in the group are lured away and the women are trapped in the room by the spirits, was particularly effective. I had hooked up my surround sound just a few weeks before and it really helped provide a dramatic effect, as, in the film, the ghosts kept knocking, then pounding around the walls and ceiling.

I believe it was Hitchcock that said what is unseen is infinitely scarier than the seen, and I feel that is true in this film. The spirits that inhabit the house are never shown but their implied presence allows the imagination to conjure up all sorts of macabre spectres.

Just curious, what movies do you find scary, if the Haunting is not to your tastes?

Mark

I saw the latter half of THE HAUNTING as well when I was around ten, and I was so frightened I never could forget it, so that when I saw it again two years ago (when I was 27), I still remembered the images, as well as the twists and turns of the story. But that movie is not for today's audience, and like most horror films it's not designed for repeated viewings.

Steve,

"I agree that the original The Haunting is one of the most terrifying films of all time."

Each to his own, but I think that's a shade overstated.

I saw this film on tv when I was a kid (and I was around 10 - when PLENTY o'flicks sent my ass a'quakin'!); I rented it once as an adult. Had nary a shiver in either viewing.

It's an interesting film. An intelligent film. An evocative film. But terrifying? Well...not to THIS 10-year-old.

Wise was a very good craftsman, however, always pushing for intelligent material, and I always had a great time with RUN SILENT, RUN DEEP along with the other OBVIOUS titles already rattled off here. Right now I have DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL on "hiatus" for having run it so many times.

Banned Harlan books
I can't imagine why, they're all full of, oh, things like not believing in God, (or showing that God is a bad guy), dark fantasy (you know the kind people think will turn their kids into devil worshippers), gory violence, street crime...

Y'know, I have a sweatshirt that says "Read a Banned Book" and it has a list of famous titles that have been banned/attacked somewhere...no Harlan books on it, alas....I think I got it from the Signals (used to be PBS/WGBH) gift catalog, which doesn't have that particular one now as far as I know, but sells really clever and witty shirts.

Looks like i'm really going to Foolscap...anybody need crash space? let me know.

Kristin

Harlan's work banned
Yeh...Harlan what of your work has not been banned? In one form or another. That's what makes you so unique among the sages of modern literature...and why we like your work and like you too.
It's too bad the clowns in the suits that run things in New York and Hollywood can't recognize genius when they see it.
May you always lead in the pack of contraversay (I don't know if I spelled it right...hell..where is my f**king dictionary?)
Anyway...keep 'em guessing my friend.

A STAGED READING OF "NOAH AND THE GREMLINS"

To One And All:


A staged reading of NOAH AND THE GREMLINS, a musical based on Harlan's story WORKING WITH THE LITTLE PEOPLE!

On: Thurday, 29 September 2005 at 7:30pm

At: The Theatre At Saint Peter's -- Citigroup Center
619 Lexington Avenue (Entrance on 54th Street), NY, NY 10022

There is no charge for the tickets BUT seating in this elegant venue is limited so you will need to reserve your seats. Theatre capacity is 178. First come, first served.

Telephone: 212-935-5824

www.yorktheatre.org.

Note: Harlan will not be in attendance. He's still recovering from being trapped in the elevator during his last NY trip!

A STAGED READING OF "NOAH AND THE GREMLINS"
To One And All:


A staged reading of NOAH AND THE GREMLINS, a musical based on Harlan's story WORKING WITH THE LITTLE PEOPLE!

On: Thurday, 29 September 2005 at 7:30pm

At: The Theatre At Saint Peter's -- Citigroup Center

genius



Rob just mastered the understatement.

"I was blown away because Wise instantly resolved one of the great mysteries of cinema--ie: Who reshot Welles' Ambersons?--just because I asked him the question. I guess no one ever had."

Wise reshot a few parts of AMBERSONS at Welles' request - most significantly, the death of Major Amberson. He had nothing to do with the final scenes, which were directed by Freddie Fleck - all that happened much later, after Welles had lost control of the film.

Wise didn't even shoot much of THE CURSE OF THE CAT PEOPLE - at least two-thirds of that film (including all of Simone Simon's scenes) were the work of credited co-director Gunther Von Fritsch.

Wise was nonetheless a real auteur. He even managed to make something personal out of STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE, which is essentially a remake of Wise's THE HAUNTING.

The key division in Wise's work is between his widescreen films (STAR TREK, THE HAUNTING, THE SAND PEBBLES, THE ANDROMEDA STRAIN, THE SOUND OF MUSIC, WEST SIDE STORY), which are often about harmonious group activities, and those films made in the narrower 1.85 and 1.66 ratios, which tend to deal with either isolated protagonists (BLOOD ON THE MOON, BORN TO KILL, THE BODY SNATCHER, THE SET-UP, SOMEBODY UP THERE LIKES ME, I WANT TO LIVE!, AUDREY ROSE), or groups that are torn apart by internal tensions (ODDS AGAINST TOMORROW).

DEAR MS. CROSSLAND:

You has gotta be kidding me, sweetie!

Has ANY of my work been banned?

Ask rather: which of it HASN'T been attacked in one or another venue.

Proudly, Yr. pal, Harlan

I once asked Robert Wise how he got the Cat People sequel that started his career. Without hesitation, he said he got the clout to direct that film by shooting all the bridge scenes for Magnifcent Ambersons after RKO chopped up Orson Welles' original.

I was blown away because Wise instantly resolved one of the great mysteries of cinema--ie: Who reshot Welles' Ambersons?--just because I asked him the question. I guess no one ever had.

Steve Dooner

PS. If you look closely at the Cat People sequel and other RKO films of that year, you'll also see the studio re-using all the sets from Amberson's too.

Robert Wise
Mark is right. Robert Wise had to have been one of the most accomplished and diversified directors of the 20th century. I agree that the original The Haunting is one of the most terrifying films of all time.

In no particular order, my favorite Wise films are:
The Haunting
The Andromeda Strain
West Side Story
Run Silent, Run Deep
And, of course, Day The Earth Stood Still

On a personal note, his most famous war film was Run Silent, Run Deep. The novel on which it is based was written by a family friend (Ned Beach), so it holds a fond place in my life. (Though, to be honest, Ned was unhappy with the movie -- but what author ever feels justified by the screen version of their baby?)

Personally, I don't give a rat's posterior about his personality, it's his art which matters to me. Wise left a legacy, that's his mark.

Texas killed another death row inmate yesterday. She was a black woman, had a fucked up trial, nobody cared. She had her arm swabbed and the needle calmly poked into her arm. Texas creeps jeered and did the two step in the streets.

Another shame for America.

The American Library Association is celebrating it's annual (since 1982) freedom to read campaign with Banned Books Week (Sept 23-30).

Mr. Ellison have any of your works been banned?

Thanks, Harlan.

Best,
Ray

Batman Set
(accidentally typed "Bartman." Totally by accident. Honest.)

Harlan, which "big Batman set" are we talking about? I may review it.

Robert Wise Has Passed
Just saw the news on IDMJ and on Ain't It Cool News that Robert Wise passed away yesterday at the age of 91.

He was one of the most versatile directors in history, having helmed some true classics in horror (The Haunting - still one of the most terrifying films I have ever seen), science fiction (The Day the Earth Stood Still - arguably the best science fiction film in history) and musical (The Sound of Music - not my cup of tea, but many love the film).

Harlan, not sure if you ever met the gentleman, but from what I have read he was a mensch and will be missed.

Harlan - CD is in the mail as of noon today; coming first class, should be there early next week. Enjoy!

TODD:

I am, indeed, on the commentary tracks of the forthcoming Val Lewton boxed set. Haven't seen it yet, and I await its arrival with anticipation. As well as the RUN FOR THE STARS audio, and the King Kong audio from Blackstone, and the big BATMAN set on which I also run my mouth.

Also performed a nice Peter David story, "Meeting at the River Styx," on a forthcoming audio.

Soon I go into the studio to read Jack Williamson's THE STONEHENGE GATE.

Been busy. Also writing lotsa stuff.

Yr. pal, Harlan

How in the world did one of those stupid scam letters get on this website? Damn, those little buggers are sneaky!

I saw Bush's speech this morning...bleagh. I keep hoping that I'll wake up one day from this nightmare and discover, to my utter relief, we actually elected someone with intelligence and compassion.

Well, I can always dream...sigh.

RAY:

Contacted Elkins. Waiting for him to call me.

he

This joint is gettin' a TAD weird for ME.

I'm expecting to see Rorschach from Alan Moore's WATCHMEN come poppin' oughtta the woodwork any second.

Dear A. Romantic:

Ever think of taking up smoking?

Dear A. Romantic,

I recommend that you read two stories by Harlan: "On the Downhill Side" and "Grail."

Steve Dooner

Dear Luvver Boy,

Romantical: Romance is perennial, born to die and rise again.

Statistical: If it seems too good to be true, it probably is.

Practical: NOTHING is more valuable than the proof of passing years.

Ethical: Honor your commitments.

To betray the trust that your faithful companion has given to you, along with the rest of herself, would make you unworthy of the affections of any good woman. Maybe your current companion is no longer awed or entertained by your cherished life-to-date collection of stories, concepts, moods and attitudes. Having your old schtick admired by another pair of eyes is a thrill for someone too lazy to keep inventing himself. Even so, work to be wonderful in the eyes of your present companion, and see her draw joy from your struggle to be good enough for her.

Speaking of Val Lewton, last weekend I attended a lecture/ signing by Yale U Prof Alexander Nemerov of his new book ICONS OF GRIEF, about VL's pictures during WW2. Not to disparage Prof Nemerov, who is a big time literary intellectual, but the theme that VL's movies reflected his sadness over the madness overtaking the world at that time seemed kind of well, uh, obvious to be presented as an awesome insight.

The highlight of the event for me was getting to meet Val E. Lewton, the painter, (VL's son) who also attended. Apparently the DVD prints are wonderful and Ted Turner personally took charge of the effort to colorize them suckers up right.

Heh Heh Heh, just kidding. About the colorizing part.

I notice that the Val Lewton DVD set will be released in a couple of weeks. Wasn't there going to be some participation from Harlan on this set (or, at least, The Cat People): either a commentary or interview?

-TODD

The Heart of the Matter
TO ALL THE DWELLERS OF WEBDERLAND: Though I know I risk getting all sorts of cynical and smart-ass answers (having always been something of cynic myself), here's my question for the folks on this board (cause you guys ALWAYS post interesting and insightful (or smart aleck) answers.

Here's a brief set-up: 12 years ago, you decided to buy a birthday gift for this female friend (girls, can substitute male friend for their purposes) whom you found quite attractive, intelligent and witty (but couldn't, for reasons that will go unspoken here, have a relationship with). You bought her a pair of earrings. When she opened the box, it turned out to be a saphhire ring; futhermore, it fit perfectly. At first you pretended it was the gift you intended; later, cause you liked her so much, you admitted what had happened, shared a laugh about it, and went on with your separate lives (still in awe at the happenstance). 12 years later, this same woman, living only three hours away now, contacts you after reading something in a local paper with your name in it. You rekindle the friendship and soon find that you have one hell of a lot in common: tastes in food, music, etc., etc., etc. (to quote Yule Brenner's character from "The King and I"). One thing leads to another (as they generally do in life) and you find that when Behind Closed Doors (to use a phrase from a Charlie Rich song) you fit as well as the last two pieces in a puzzle. Furthermore, the two of you are passionately, head-over-heels for each other.

So here's the question (s): If you found yourselves in such a situation, with a lover who seems to be as close to perfect as you're liable to find, would you think you've been ignoring the signs of fate (the ring, the words that got you back together, and about a half dozen other things)? Would you suddenly start believing in the possibility of that ideal we have all chased since childhood (the Right One, the soulmate)? And how much would you be willing to change your life for a chance to be with such a person? Would you upend a happy, loving relationship that has always been much more based on friendship than what I think of as the ideal (passionate love mixed with the sort of mature love that makes things last) so you could spend the rest of your life with someone who will be, ultimately, the perfect person? Someone who elicits that head-over-heels passion (as well as the mature, let's soldier thorugh this together, feelings)?

Whew! How's THAT for a longwinded question?
I'm not saying that I'm looking for advice on what to do (I believe I've made up my mind); but I AM interested in how most of you would react to such a situation (especially if you are or were, as I was, given to profound disbelief in mysticism and fate and such -- I'm definitely reconsiderding).

Phx, etc.
I spent a significant part of my growing up in Mesa, AZ, which is a suburb of Phoenix. It was a charmed life. We rode our bikes to school, swam for three hours a day at the public pools (every Junior High has one, it seems like), and made some great friends.

I had considerable difficulty with the public school system, however. After the system's repeated efforts to ram my "square peg" into its "round hole" (sorry), my parents made a great decision and moved us up to a small town in the mountains near Flagstaff. It gave us the breathing room we needed to develop our individual talents and bind together as a family again.

Perhaps the individual who slagged Phoenix was a troll of one kind or another who spent his or her time there sweltering in a cardboard box. I'd probably hate the place too.

Harlan and James Elkins

HARLAN:

Curious to know if you were able to make contact with James Elkins.
Hope you don't mind, but I practically guaranteed him a reply from you. Sorry, if I overstep.

Best,
Ray

Alex Jay

You’re probably getting much more advice than you ever wanted, but I’ll throw this in. About ten years ago, a co-worker had a significant stroke brought on by his smoking. (He survived – he isn’t quite the same – but he is doing well.) The next day I was talking to a good friend (also a co-worker) and asked if that was enough proof that she should quit smoking – asking this as a friend and someone who wanted to see her live for a few more years. She lamented that she just couldn’t do it, that she just liked it too much.

A few years later, (don’t worry, this isn’t going to be an obituary story) the doctor advised her things were getting bad. Not cancer bad, but “you may never breath right” bad. She started using Nicorette. Seven years later, she now works for me and is in incredible health (mid-50s). The twist to this story is that she is still chewing the gum. Nope, she didn’t have the strength to wean herself off nicotine, but at least she isn’t using a killer delivery system.

Just a thought.

Todd Cassell

Thanks for responding about Phoenix in a much calmer fashion than I would have been able to. (“I have heard that they are treated like children…given little freedom…have to wear wrist bands…don’t have a valid home…” Sheesh, where do people get these things? Next thing you know we’ll be posting messages like “I heard so-and-so was a communist.")

Mike

Alex, Alex, Alex....


"Upshot of that is, I have to quit smoking, and soon. Haven't set a date yet, but it WILL be by year's end. "

QUIT THE GODDAMN CIGS, ALREADY!

We love ya, man. Stick around.

Chuck

Quitting

Alex:

"Haven't set a date yet, but it WILL be by year's end"? C'mon. I've said that shit to myself (though not regarding cigarettes), and I know what comes next. Or, rather, what doesn't come next. Please set a date, man.

My good friend Tim managed to quit after twenty years by using Nicorette gum. He didn't have the heaviest habit, but he'd tried to quit a number of times before, and he found the gum let him wean himself off the nicotine effectively. (I should add, though, that he's a pretty disciplined guy.)

As for relapsing ... I got nothin'.

D.

p.s. I must warn you that when I tried KPAT (Keith's Patented Aversion Therapy), I developed an uncontrollable desire to keep my videocassette of CROCODILE DUNDEE in its box.

Keith--it also works with a wallaby, but they prefer Divinity to fudge. They're kinky little bastards.

Alex Jay--again, not a smoker, but my friend and her sister both had success using the OTC patches. They went from two packs a day to zip almost instantly. Her sister is still a non-smoker (for several years now). My friend is not, but christ, is she stubborn.

Stop Smoking Now.
Alex, I’ve never been addicted to smoking, but I HAVE been addicted to pornography. It’s great stuff, but I was told I had to give it up for health related reasons as well. Tennis elbow was causing strain on the ulnar nerve and the doc was afraid for my entire spinal column.

The act of breaking any addiction is hard, but I found an easy and surefire way to do it: You need a small kangaroo (preferably a joey, but a jenny will do in a fix), five 3” torque-tube ball bearings, one 2’x2’x3’ wood box, a sample of the object of your addiction, one standard dispenser of waxed dental floss, 8oz. of saline solution, Jack Kevorkian’s phone number, and two pounds of Amish fudge. I believe the ball bearings and the fudge are easiest to obtain, you being in PA and all. These, yes, THESE, are the ingredients you (or ANYONE) will need to break any (yes, ANY!) addiction!

Dr. Kevorkian was out when I broke the habit, but now he’s in the slammer:

Dr. Jack Kevorkian # 284797
Thumb Correctional Facility
3225 John Conley Dr
Lapeer, MI 48446-2987

You can write to him and get his new phone number. Tell him you’re with the Susquehanna Hat Company. That’s our code.

HERE is what ya do!

Mix the Amish fudge with the saline solution until you have a nice paste. Extrude the dental floss into the paste, ensuring a complete coating. Allow the kangaroo to eat as much of the fudge/saline/floss mixture as possible…it will probably finish it, as they love chocolate and salt. Add the ball bearings to the wood box, then add the marsupial. DO NOT SQUEEZE THE MARSUPIAL! I cannot stress this enough. If you squeeze it, your mission is aborted and you must start over!

Slam the lid of the box shut, and, holding it with both your arms and both your legs (leaving the top of the box at eye-level), place a cigarette, or a pack of cigs, on top of the box. At eye level. Hold on. Kangaroos like chocolate, but it doesn’t agree with their digestive systems. Nor does dental floss, and a dark box in which they cannot get their bearings.

Hold on for 10 minutes while staring at your cigarette(s).

Tada! You are CURED!

(Probably. If that doesn’t work, that's when you need to call Jack.)

-Keith

PS - Seriously, though: good luck. I've never smoked, but I have a sister, mother, and father who all did. Sis and Mom kicked the habit years ago, but dad, a smoker since 13, keeps trying and keeps getting these awful canker sores that last many months...so he switches from cigs, to cigars, to snuff, to chloroseptic spray....to cigs again. You have my support. I have heard good things about hypnosis and acupuncture, but I think those anecdotes are very unscientific. But if you find something that works, great!

Alex Jay Berman---

Try acupuncture. It's painless, only takes a few minutes, and could save you from suffering withdrawal.

A fellow I work with had acupuncture done. Said he had smoked for 40 years. He had absolutely no cravings afterwards. He also said he could sit at a table with a person who is smoking and not even feel the slightest need. Good luck.

Phone call
Hi Harlan:
Sorry I missed your phone call this morning- I was riding the bus and didn't hear my cell phone ring.
Your welcome and I'm glad I found the Balakirev recording for you-the "Suite in B" is a lovely piece of music.
Have fun in Seattle and a belated HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to you and the lovely Susan.
Cheers,
Colleen

Jeff R – Should we stop writing about the Holocaust because it’s all been written? Should we stop writing about slavery? It’s all there, why write more? Shall we just forget all history and wait to repeat it…..hey, at least it will be something new to write about, huh? And I did not state that the Katrina story should be reduced, I expressed an interest in seeing how the venerable Times handles the anniversary of that event. This is the NEW YORK Times. Not the Phoenix Times. Not the San Diego Times. The 9/11 tragedy is of high interest to New York area readers…..not just on nice little round figure anniversaries like 5 years and 10 years and 25 years. There is still a big fucking hole in the middle of the city while politicians and interest groups wrangle over how to fill it. I would think the NEW YORK Times would spend a little space on their 9/11/05 edition, an edition that happens to also be a Sunday edition full of scads of special sections previewing the new fall entertainment season, just a little bit of space somewhere up on Page One and pointing to a special section to remember what happened four short years ago. Take your journalism school exercise elsewhere….and your perspective on history.

Frank – Your lesson on gentrification has nothing to do with the discussion at hand; unless you believe that American Business seeded the clouds and created Katrina. As for how the families are being treated in Phoenix: interesting. Especially since the coliseum that was used for some immediate relief is now PRACTICALLY EMPTY. Evacuees have already begun to leave the city to their destination (for the next few months, at least) now that they have their minds settled, and others are moving into the city in permanent and temporary residence. Sorry, no wrist bands following them around. As to their not having a ‘valid home to stay in’……Jeezus Keeericed, Frankie Boy, their VALID home is underwater right now. That’s what happens when you have to EVACUATE AN ENTIRE CITY IN A DISASTER you saline-filled-tit! When you have to abandon your home in such a manner, it’s often called (look it up) a “tragedy”…..and when you deal with such tragedies you have to figure out what to do next. What should the cities that took in the evacuees have done, Frankie Boy?

As to your opinion on Arizona……it was only awful for those few months you lived here. The angst of actually bumping into you and realizing you are really what you present yourself as on this board was quite heavy. Without that fear, it is once again paradise. I hope your current city supplies you with everything you need to get by in the world happily and healthily.

-TODD


(Sorry everyone....I just had to get that out. I'll behave from now on)

HARLAN, this might amuse you:

http://209.198.111.165/thebeat/archives/2005/09/kyle_baker_sign.html#more

Btw, I'm pretty impressed James Elkins wrote in. He's one of the great art scholars of our time - that rare, genuinely USEFUL critic - and I'd urge anybody here to get a copy of HOW TO USE YOUR EYES. (As it happens, I'm deep into his THE POETICS OF PERSPECTIVE now.)

ALEX JAY BERMAN: Take care of yourself, for God's sake! Stop freaking me out.

Todd, exactly what aspect of 9/11 do you believe remains unwritten in The New York Times after four years? You're the editor -- give me three story ideas by the end of the day. Make sure all three are interesting and important and haven't already appeared in a hundred other places. If you care to, you can also identify which reporters you would have pulled off the Katrina story -- for which the NYT produced a special section several days running -- in order to accomplish this.

Got those three ideas yet? Hurry up. We're waiting.

Todd, you boob, have you ever heard of the term gentrification? Displacing the poor to help the rich is a normal part of American Buisiness logic over the decades and is readily known. Eminent Domain law is used for this practice, most often. African American groups are agreeing with me on this. They know how law can be used to take away their rights.

And, so what if Phoenix takes in the families, I have heard that they are being treated like children, and are given little freedom. They have to wear wrist bands and don't have a valid home to stay in. I doubt they want to live in awful Arizona. I see that as a punishment, in of itself.

-----------

Duane, I have a black heart.

Pictures and Tears
Dear Harlan Ellison,

Someone told me you're reading my "Pictures and Tears." I still take confessions, for future editions!

(My favorite story along those lines: an artist in Alfred, NY, told me he got an old canister of tear gas from his Vietnam days, and put it behind one of his scuptures. It was slightly open, enough so people got misty-eyed and didn't now why.)

Best,

Jim

Corrections
Please forgive my post of yesterday morning for the following omissions/errors:

The phrase "between our erstwhile patron and the last few weeks of postings" should have read "between our erstwhile SHARECROPPER AND LITERARY patron and the last few weeks of postings". Not only does this make a lot more sense, but also portends a bit less doom for said patron.

Robin Williams interviewed HE for Audible.com, not audio.com as I stated yesterday.

Sheesh.

Once again, this is why I use a camera, not an Olympia typewriter.

_________________________________________________

On separate notes: I love, love, love the British series UFO and its assortment of underdressed actresses; and I also commend the thousands of un-named FEMA, military and other emergency-related workers who toil in the hot sun trying to help those who their leadership abandoned.
___________________________________________

I reserve the right to correct any and all caffeine-deficiency-related errors in the future.

Typewriters
Harlan (and others) may get a chuckle out of this. It appeared in the NY Daily News sports section this past Sunday:

Monza, Italy (AP) – The click-clack of 71-year-old French journalist Renaud De LaBorderie’s typewriter can still be heard in press rooms of Formula One races around the world. “I’m the last of the Mohicans,” the amicable De LaBorderie said.

“It’s also very reliable,” De LaBorderie said of his typewriter, recalling last year’s debut race in Bahrain when a major technical outage affected the entire press corps – except him.

De Laborderie has five or six typewriters – including an Olivetti and a Hermes Baby – that he brings to races, and a bigger model at his Paris home.

He does encounter some problems in the computer age. Only one typewriter repair shop remains in Paris, and De Laborderie has trouble finding ribbons to work with. He has also been stopped by security officials at airports who have never seen a typewriter before.

Typewriters
Harlan (and others) may get a chuckle out of this. It appeared in the NY Daily News sports section this past Sunday.

>

Steve Niles' work seems derivative. His Cal Mcdonald character is simply John Constantine with dark hair (or Hitman or the Punisher or a dozen others). One irritating visual shorthand in today's comics is always portraying bad-ass characters with a cigarette dangling from their lips (and usually wearing a trenchcoat as well). This is an adolescent and lazy approach to characterization.

"He must be tough...because he chain-smokes!"

HARLAN: Steve Niles doesn't need to give up his day job; after all, he sold the rights to his breakout comics hit (drawn by Ben Templesmith, a moody artist in the Ashley Wood vein) 30 DAYS OF NIGHT, a re-imagining of vampires owing a great deal to both Romero's NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD and to Matheson's I AM LEGEND, for seven figures. He's been doing zombie books for years, at various comics companies--but it's his recent vampiric works which put comics company IDW on the map, which paved the way for them to re-publish the much-missed First Comics books Grimjack and Jon Sable, Freelance (and restart them as new series by their creators), as well as Eisner's John Law.

Not that the Niles books are my thing, but anything which helps bring back John Gaunt and Jon Sable cannot be anything but a good thing.

S.L. WATERMAN: Though I mourn Gate's passing, he was told he was dying of his various lung ailments several years ago, and decided he would go out--and go on--playing until the last. I'm just sorry that Katrina hiccupped his journey faster along.

ON FEMA: I have been in a steady state of rage against the incompetence and idiocy shown by the administration (and, to a lesser extent, the local and state authorities) in the leadup, duration, and wake of Hurricane Katrina. I am, of course, happy that Brown has resigned. Of course, "happy" is something of a misnomer: I will not be anything approaching "happy" unless Brown, and Chertoff, and those who mistakenly appointed them, are sentenced to hard labor cleaning up New Orleans, perhaps doing their work on the prison rations they so richly deserve.

But I must point out that there has been a lot of blanket condemnation of FEMA--and that is a disservice to the many NON-appointees who work there; people who took the job because they had a need to help people. The agency, once a model of efficiency and competence, has been hobbled over the last several years by budget cuts, pigeonholing into DHS, and those appointed to "lead" it. But the people who work for the agency whom I have met have uniformly been caring and competent people who are greatly pained by their organization's inability to do the right thing--ENOUGH of the right things.

And now, after all, I am one of them. I, and hundreds--no; thousands--of my fellow government workers, have been drafted to man the FEMA claim phones. When I say "drafted," by the way, I mean it in the structest sense of the word: We have been placed by Executive Order under FEMA's aegis and set to working mandatory fifty-hour weeks (with many of us working more, reporting in seven days a week), doing nothing but registering those people affected by the disaster, many of whose lives have been torn asunder.

It is not an easy job. I say this, I who just two weeks ago talked my sixth suicide threat caller on our tax line out of it. I'm batting a thousand; six for six in seven years of working for Uncle (several of whom I've followed up on, just to make sure), and this affords me no small pride. But I fear that number will grow in the coming weeks. And I fear, good a talker though I may be, that I may not be able to hold that unbeaten streak.

(The ironic thing is that this draft comes right when I was giving serious thought to volunteering with the Red Cross and going down to the Gulf to offer whatever help I could.)

PERSONAL, TO ALL: At a recent doctor's visit, my doc detected the minor wheeze I've had for ten years or more--and said that even though it's never caused me problems, it could be the harbinger of something much worse. You know; like maybe death. So now I've got a prescription thingy which looks like nothing so much as a birth-control-pill ring on steroids. You click it and turn it, and you suck in a small bit of powder it dispenses.

But I want this thing to be just a temporary thing; it's bad enough being on one drug for life (for my epilepsy).

Upshot of that is, I have to quit smoking, and soon. Haven't set a date yet, but it WILL be by year's end. The sad thing is that I really do enjoy lighting up ... I always said that there were only two things which could easily get me to quit: A woman, or a child. Still don't have either of them, but the affront of having to take new meds, go in for chest x-rays and pulmonary exams, and all the tsuris involved, may just succeed in making this the third thing.

So advice from any who've gone through it will be gratefully received, as the longest quit period I've ever had was eight months.

i have disasters, you have disasters, we all.....
Well, it appears heads are rolling at FEMA. Still, something has to be done about cronyism. Too many govt agencies are run by political appointees and there is next to no public scrutiny of them or their resumes - until something Really Bad happens. Just how many people ARE there in key departments right now who are not qualified for their jobs - but we'll only know that in case of, say, a terrorist attack???

On the plus side other cities in harm's way are rethinking their own disaster plans. For instance the Bay Area faces earthquakes (duh) and so does L.A. What isn't as widely known is that our water supply around here could be threatened by levee breaks in the Sacramento Delta; pumps would have to be shut down because seawater would get in, and flooding would damage farms in the area. The most direct damage would be to agriculture (rather than rendering an urban area uninhabitable as in New Orleans) but water would be severely rationed for up to a year. THe economic loss would be severe and food prices would go way up.

It *wouldn't* take a big-one quake a la 1906 leveling San Francisco do do this.

I'm wondering: are there plans to evaucate Los Angeles if there are major breaks in the acqueduct system (that crosses many faults) ??? the city might have next to no water so where would you so-cal guys get it from? The bay area does have its own aquifiers and not all the water must be imported although much is.

We should ALL be humble because the vast majority of us face the risk of SOME kind of natural disaster be it earthquake, hurricane or tornado.

Kristin
Thanks, Harlan...of course my point was it's not whether you've heard of a particular concentration camp that matters, it's whether you learned (and internalized) the horror of the tragedy overall....

Frank,

My impression is that New Orleans is being evacuated because those that stay are likely to die a horrible death. To quote the New York Times:

Water testing by state and federal officials has so far not supported the word "toxic." "It's more where you'd characterize it as a 'bacterial soup,' " Mr. Mann said, citing the elevated levels of E. coli. He added that "septic" might also suffice.

I am, as of this week, an O-fficial, staunch, clear-cut, firmly entrenched devotee of the Brit sf series UFO.

Just rent n' run the episode entitled THE PSYCHOBOMBS. And keep your eye (as if we were free to make the choice) on an all but bare actress named Deborah Grant. You guys will see what I mean.

Hey, Frank! Did you know you ain't black? I thought you did.

Duane, Frank was just using the word for the purpose of discussion. Don't get offended.

Todd, I felt there was TOO MUCH coverage of the events of 9/11 over the weekend. If it were the 5th or 10th anniversary, then there might be something to say about it, but not the 4th. The only reason the 4th got so much mention in the news this weekend was to get people to watch all the television "specials" that were on this weekend. The reason there were so many "specials" about 9/11 this weekend was simply because it was the weekend and more people watch television on Sundays than most other days.

Are we back to trusting wicked-pedia for information? C'mon, find somewhere else to get info.

Cranky in Southeast Michigan.

Erstwhile patron?
Steve, Harlan is still our patron here, no? Unless he's been traded for a novelist, three poets and a movie reviewer to be named later.

Harlan and Susan--happy anniversary!

Gonna get myself "shooshed" agin
Sayeth Rick Wyatt: "This is Harlan's little breakfast nook at Webderland. When he's not here, we chat about him and his work."

That in mind I am much relieved to report sighting the following excerpt in that unimpeachable resource, the Wikipedia: "Ellison frequently ran away from home, taking odd jobs — including, by his own account, "a tuna fisherman off the coast of Galveston, itinerant crop-picker down in New Orleans..."

*sigh* I feel much better now having found a real work-related connection between our erstwhile patron and the last few weeks of postings (mine own inclusive). Rick never said WHICH work we are allowed to discuss.
___________________________________________________________

(Topic-al aside)
Harlan: In the audio.com interview with Robin Williams, you refer to people who are Death's Deputies -- things happen to people around them while leaving the DD's themselves relatively unscathed. Given your ... adventuresome ... life so far, to which side of the equation would you post yourself?

Deputy ... or in the orbit of one?

When I was back there in seminary school

There was a person there

Who put forth the proposition

That you can petition the Flying Spaghetti Monster with prayer

Petition the Flying Spaghetti Monster with prayer

Petition the Flying Spaghetti Monster with prayer

YOU CANNOT PETITION THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER WITH PRAYER!!!

Phoenix has taken in about 2000 of the evacuees from N'Orleans (or else that's a total that includes Tucson, AZ). They were first moved rarely used coliseum on the fairgrounds, and now they are beginning to move into temporary housing (and even permanent housing for those choosing to stay).

Here's what's in the new every day, be it teevee, radio or newspaper (and mind you, Phoenix's Arizona Republic is a very liberal leaning newspaper): Interviews with evacuees who are crying with joy over the fact that they have been in our city for X number of days and already found a job. Not only a job, but gainful employment for their skills.

Here's what most of them have said when they were finished talking with excitement over their new jobs.....New Orleans had nothing for them. Nothing.

Frank, your assessment that New Orleans will be rebuilt for the middle class and higher (I won't use the crude terms that you so love to spit out about the diplaced poverty class) is as assinine as always. Please, tell me all about the New Orleans that was not housed in a strip or two of jazz and quaint restaurants and bars and partying. Tell me all about the rest of the city; one of the most poverty stricken cities in our nation. Please tell me about how the privileged are going to rebuilt it and not allow any of it's majority residents return.

Please, continue to make an ass of yourself while the evacuees rebuild their lives, make some important decisions about whether or not to return, and work where they are able (whereas they couldn't, or wouldn't, back in their drenched home).

It's not all bad news and blame out there, folks. People are actually getting a chance to change their lives; some will return, some will not, but Frank's 'nightmare' of the privileged actually rebuilding a city into some conservative, uncaring Disneyland is one of his sillier diatribes.

PS....yesterday was the fourth anniversary of the September 11 attacks. I remember that day. I will always remember that day (I lived in NJ back then, a constant visitor of NYC for work and play). The New York Times practically ignored the day in their Sunday edition. It was disgusting. People mock the NYC tabloids, but at least they had some very thoughtful columns on the anniversary of that tragic and frightening day. The New York Times should be ashamed of itself. One silly article on page 20 about all the mundane things that people didn't get to do on 9/11/01 because a couple of planes hit some buildings. That's it. One silly article, that was already distributed and published by other national newspapers days before the Times ran it. Oh, and a magazine section all about our misguided war and failure to capture OBL.

Let's see how much play The New York Times gives Hurricane Katrina, One Year Later.

Scumbags.

-TODD

Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
Things have been fairly serious and somber on the board lately, so I thought I would interject some humor. The UK Telegraph wrote an article on this website and I thought it was brilliant.

It is a response to intelligent design. Basically, it postulates a theory that a Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) created the world. Who can really argue with that? There is no proof this did not happen. Here is the link, enjoy:

http://www.venganza.org/

Frank, you're not Black and you never will be.

Without DemocracyNow where would we be in a search for truth in media?

Today's show was a barn burner. Amy Goodman went to New Orleans to talk to holdouts there and the police and army presense.

There was the community activist who showed Amy a dead body, that had been there for two weeks,and the police and army refuse to move it. She trys to talk to the New Orleans police, but they refuse to answer questions, like the thugs that they are. Don't believe the media hype, these guys are racist cocksuckers.

There was one gentleman who mentioned that the looting was 50/50 black and white and that the media had lied about it being only black people looting.

It seems Blackwater mercenaries are in New Orleans, 'patrolling.' This is the same private security group that had members killed and hung from that bridge in Iraq.

I will promise you that the rebuilding of New Orleans will not include a place for the poor to come back. This is why they are moving the mostly black poor away to other states. Shuttle the niggers away, so the superior blood can own the city and make it a middle class heaven.

Makes me wanna holla.

One and Two
Harlan and Susan:

Happy anniversary, you two! How sweet to be together so long.

All:

Just got back from Germany and Italy trip. Went to Dachau. I did not know this, but the Rev. Martin Neimoller was at Dachau. I first became aware of Niemoller's famed quote from Harlan:

First they came for the Communists,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time there was no one
left to speak up for me.

by Rev. Martin Niemoller, 1945

Dachau is a surreal, lifeless place without menace, like a toothless combine. There are many memorials there, the most touching of which is the Jewish memorial, made out of black, basaltic rock, descending to cathedral-like back wall, at the very top of which is a man-hole sized hole letting in a stream of light. If you look through the hole in the top, you see a menorah. This memorial affected me more than the camp itself. Of the camp: I expected to be hit with an emotional stomach ball, but that never happened.

There is a Carmelite nunnery attached to the rear of Dachau, next to where the prisoners were used to make coats for the luftwaffe, and next to the brothels where the female prisoners were raped by Nazi's.

Niemoller designed and dedicated a chapel inside Dachau, not part of the nunnery. There is a Christian memorial there, too.

Of the many barracks that used to be there, none remain. Only the footers of the buildings remain, like foot high mausoleums stretching infinitely toward the back of the camp. The two barracks that stand are replicas of the originals, which were wood. The permanent buildings (originals) of Dachau are made of brick and plaster and concrete, and they house the museum and auditorium where they show a movie.

Dachau was the first camp built by the Nazi's.

-Keith

Why do I bother with football? My Chargers lose and it makes me wonder why we even bother with all this sports fanboy jazz. Might as well hoot and holler for somebody who is actually doing something in society, besides making money for themselves, or shilling for shoe companies.

But I do hope they win, next week. hehe.

--------------

Rob, please, I know when my mental faculties have been questioned. I can smell it, like a rat smelling cheese.

But I live, knowing full well that I am more informed then the average man or woman. Not tooting my horn, just stating a fact.

------------

I do think there is a higher purpose then our minor quibling. Kisses.

Clarence "Gatemouth" Brown
Grammy winner 'Gatemouth' Brown dies
Louisiana musician had escaped Katrina

http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/Music/09/11/gatemouthbrown.obit.ap/index.html

Sound of Thunder
Stan: Yes, the special effects were bad, particularly texture. The dinos reminded me of my plastic Gamera and Godzilla, though not quite as realistic. But there are so many other reasons to dislike this film. I hate hate HATE stories that set up unbreakable rules and proceed to break those to advance the story. No, I'm not talking about "don't feed them after midnight," ala "Gremlins" (another film I despise). I'm talking about the rule of paradox, which is a key issue in "Sound of Thunder." If you feel you MUST pay to see this dog (poor Uncle Ray--hope he got a fat paycheck for this one), wait for the two-buck theater. It isn't even worth the $3.95 rental fee. Ugh.

Harlan: I only love that you go back and correct your typos. I do the same thing when I chat online. See you soon!

KRISTIN RUHLE: Thank you for your response and the link. I've looked through it a couple of times and expect to go back several more. Also, I emailed the owner of the site and asked him to consider adding Jakub's World to the list of books about the Holocaust.

I agree, it is terrible to think that some people don't know about the Holocaust - that the terms "survivor" and "fear factor" make them think of mindless television programs.

HARLAN ELLISON: You are welcome, though really the thanks go to Alicia Nitecki and Jack Terry for writing this book which does the best things a book can do (in my mind): inform and make the reader think long after she's put it down. I had also never come across the term "extermination by work" which was the main purpose of this camp.

German Poets and People who quote them for $200, Alex

Who is Gunter Eich?

informationally,
the mite

I am truly embarrassed for not being able to remember this, but to what German poet is the quote, "Be uncomfortable; be sand, not oil, in the machinery of the world"? It has always stuck with me and I can never remember who it is. Any assistance is appreciated.

Thanks for the info Harlan about "Run For the Stars" and the upcoming book releases. I was scrolling farther in amazon and it does have a release date for "Fingerprints in the Sky" in early 2006. Looking forward to the next Rabbit Hole with more info about some of the coming goodies. Roger

End paren ) after "incunabula."

he

On the Rothko aside, make that "as I did..."

he

make that "warehouse."

he

REPLIES TO GOD AND MAN & WOMANS
ROGER GJOVIG: I recorded RUN FOR THE STARS for Blackstone two or three months ago. My audio producer, as always, was Stefan Rudnicki. Though they didn't buy the reprint rights to the gorgeous Ed Emshwiller cover that Science Fiction Adventures magazine gave me when it was first published back in the 1950s (they went with a "generic" cover art scheme endemic to their in-house series, apparently), I am given to understand that it is a decent-looking package...as conveyed to me by Stefan, who is having a meeting with Blackstone on Tuesday, at which he will receive the first copies. So I guess "release date" was in the last month some time. When I get a precise, I'll drop it off here.

CHARLIE IN ST. PETE: Subterranean Press is doing the dual-release single- and boxed-double set of GENTLEMAN JUNKIE and THE DEADLY STREETS, with GAWWWWWJUSSSS fresco-long dust jackets painted by LEO & DIANE DILLON that, when butted-up against each other, form one long reproduction-plus of the original art they did for the first publication (Regency pb, vintage early '60s) of GJ. But we're still in pre-production, so as usual Amazon has jumped the gun. We'll keep you apprised here, if I remember to do so...but if not, Susan will (and probably already has) mentioned it in The Rabbit Hole of HERC, and likely will have (if she hasn't already) gotten Subterranean to offer a discount/direct price for HERC members only.

PAM CROSSLAND & KRISTIN RUHLE: For all my arrogance anent the overflowing wharehouse of minutiae, I am crestfallen beside you, never having heard of Flossenburg. Thank you for teaching me something new. I live for that!

MARK O.: Susan and I met in Glasgow in 1985. The story of our meeting, what the movies call "they met cute," is SO cute, you could get diabetes from it. But as I recall, that anecdote, either in precis or in detail, appeared here long long ago. You might ask the regulars if they recall when, and then consult Mr. Wyatt's compendious archives. I've told it so many times, I am weary of the sound of my own voice.

And I believe that brings us up to date, save for a response to someone (whose post I cannot find) who asked me what I am reading currently, or what it was I read that influened me, or somesuch query. I just finished reading Jack Williamson's STONEHENGE GATE, which I'll be performing as an audio for Blackstone next month; a new book on the old radio programme GANG BUSTERS written by Martin Grams, Jr.; and halfway through 1) PICTURES & TEARS, James Elkins's breathtaking history of "people who have cried in front of paintings" as did when I saw my first Rothko full-size at the Victoria & Albert Museum in London, 2) THE BONUS ARMY by Paul Dickson (WORDS author) and Thomas B., Allen, about the tragedy of the 45,000 WWI vets who marched on D.C. during the core of the Depression in 1932, and 3) FIDDLERS, the last 87th Precinct novel written by Evan Hunter as Ed McBain, shortly before his death.

Those, and the first issue of the new GHOST RIDER series from Marvel, Anina Bennett and Paul Guinan's HEARTBREAKERS MEET BOILERPLATE, and the IDW series' BIGFOOT and HELL HOUSE. The former was not Richard Corben's best work, and the plot was ruthless but not intriguing by Rob Zombie and Steve Niles (neither of whom should lose their day jobs), and the latter visually retelling Matheson's terrific haunted house saga, with just "okay" art, but a pleasant adherence to the original source. I enjoyed the latter, poo-poo the former.

And THAT, if I read the runes correctly, is everything for the moment. (And no, I haven't forgotten that I STILL owe Cindy and a couple of you others a long reply from a year ago...not to mention that I have all the prizes ready to go out--when I get a spare minute--for those of you who entered that contest here to determine who had the largest useless collection of Ellisonian trivia and incunabula.

I'm dancing as fast as I can, folks.

See a bunch of you in less than two weeks in Seattle. We'll pah-tay.

Pant gasp, yr. pal, Harlan

Lee - Understood.

Harlan - Daniel Barenboim conducting the Chicago Symphony Orchestra, Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov's "Tsar Sultan, Op. 57 - Suite from the Opera", the 2000 rerelease on Teldec of the 1993 Erato Disques recording, will be winging its way to you on Monday.

Request for Spillage in re: Anniversary
Happy Anniversary to you and your bride!

I don’t get by here too often, and I am loath to scroll thru a lot of tedious search results, so I have to ask: has the story of how you and Susan met ever been posted? Might I ask where you found such a rare flower? Was there any begging/pleading/cajoling on your part, or would you classify it as more of a sweeping off the feet?

If it’s not too personal, that is.

Mark
giddy with anticipation

FinderDoug:

I got a call back from CSO saying that the Rimsky-Korsakov has gone out of stock and is also out print. That puts me out of the picture as far as getting a copy to Harlan is concerned.

Frank declared that "Ignorance is when you refuse to learn. I have a mind that is as open as space."

Either Frank got his dictionary from Loompa Land or he is ESL. By no definition does "Ignorance" mean purblind or close-minded. It just means lacking in knowledge or training. It doesn't necessarily mean you refuse to learn something. A bigot is ignorant, but an ignorant person is not necessarily a bigot.

As I related on the "dark side of the moon", I have a roommate who is very ignorant about many things. But, conscious of this, she is also inquisitive. She asks questions about MANY topics and prods for facts and information, often before she even begins to formulate a conclusion about an issue. She loves to engage you. I am frequently startled by things she doesn't know in the course of our conversations; but she is making an impressive effort to resolve that. Even now she's in the other room reading Malory.

Frank, I am not trying to be condescending - I admit, a Kodak moment in MY life. Many of us - well, a FEW among us, anyway - are taking in something new everyday; yet, I must say, your semantics and vocabulary are often the strangest I've seen from anyone (for someone who spends at least SOME of his time reading), and far from precise.

...just work on that a little and you'll be FINE, for chrissake.

Anniversaries, the Holocaust and rote learning...
Harlan and Susan, I'm practically ashamed of this board, the way we went and pissed on your wedding anniversary. Lindbergh was a great figure in the history of aviation and the fact that he was less than a saint in other ways doesn't destroy that. One needn't admire the man's political views to respect the love the Ellisons have for each other.

HE gave Susan a gift, she loved it, nuff said.

On the names of camps:

Who is better: somebody who understands, deep down, the horror of the Holocaust (as things like the Holocaust Museum work hard to bring home to visitors...THIS COULD HAVE BEEN YOU) but doesn't know the name of every camp and whether it was a concentration camp (forced labor camp) or pure death camp (set up just to gas people?) Or someone who can recite the name of every camp by heart but doesn't FEEL in their soul how evil the whole thing was?

After all, the Nazis themselves certainly knew the names of their own "facilities." Rote learning alone is useless.

Maybe the most important camp was the one someone you knew, or a relative, suffered/died in. Of course, there are fewer and fewer people with first-hand memories, which

Off the top of my head I could name Dachau, Bergen-Belsen and Buchenwald as concentration camps, and Treblinka, Sobibor and Birkenau (built as an extension to Auschwitz, which was a work camp) as extermination camps. Many of the death-factory facilities were converted from existing labor camps, of course. (Majdanek is an example.) With my trusty google toolbar I found this link

www.jewishgen.org/ForgottenCamps

It has a good bibliography too - doing research is what these people are about. At least that's my impression.

The whole site looks like a great resource for Jews who want to look up relatives living and dead - it is a big genealogy project. (you might want to leave off the last part and go to the site homepage.)

Kristin
(blush) I'd never heard of Flossenburg either so I went back to that site for another look. Located near Bayeruth in Germany, established in 1938, estimate toll of victims 73,000 before liberation April 23th, 1945, by the 2nd U.S. Cavalry.

What's horrible though, is there might be someone out there who never heard of the Holocaust...

Lindbergh, Nazis & PBS, Oh, my!
Harlan,
It would've been better to have bought your lovely wife a bust of Howard Hughes; After all, he did keep his top secret rocket pack out of the hands of the Nazis. I gleened that little factoid from a "based on a true story" movie released in the late Eighties or early Nineties. However, the movie was made by Disney and you know how they like to play fast and loose with the facts. In my heart it'll always be springtime for Hitler and Germany...
Enjoy your Ovaltine,
E.K.

Don't hit me Harlan! Sound of Thunder critique
Okay Harlan, I am sorry I brought it up. Don't hit me yet!
Only said EF was suspected at the time...I never thought he ever was. So be it!

My son just saw SOUND OF THUNDER....He said it was a waste of money...due to the fact the dinosaurs looked amateurishly made.
I wonder what it would of looked like if Speilberg produced it?

This week I read and wrote a review for Jakub's World:A Boy's Story of Loss and Survival in the Holocaust written by Alicia Nitecki and Jack Terry. In a nutshell, the book is about Jakub/Jack Terry's experience in Flossenburg, a concentration camp seldom mentioned.

Most people (well over 50 anyway) can name Auschwitz and Dachau as concentration camps; a few more will remember the names Majdanek, Buchenwald, and Theresienstadt. I had never heard of Flossenburg till I read this book and it was by no means a small camp - there were 91 satellite camps around it. My question for all the wise folk out there is:

What are the consequences of selective memory - do people start to think - Never heard of Flossenburg - nothing really bad could have happened there?

The man says "squeeze in and pipe up", so I will--but I shall merrily refrain from anything political, controversial, or otherwise, and wish both Harlan and Susan a Happy Anniversary, and I raise my glass to you both. All the best!

:)

Relating to Roger's request, amazon indicates "The Deadly Streets" was released on March 1, 2005, but is unavailable. Was it released on March 1, anyone?

Susan and Harlan,

Happy Anniversary!

I was cruising around on amazon today and about once a month I check Harlan's listing on the hope that something new will be listed. Today there is a listing for an audio cd called "Run For The Stars" which it says is to released in September 2005. Harlan, is there any info you can give us about this cd? Any help would be appreciated, inquiring minds would like to know. Thanks, Roger

I'm sorry Susan, please forgive me.

Weren't the internet and movable type invented by time-traveling Nazis? I think I saw something about that on public access.

LEE--Thank you.

--Susan

Here's the deal. This is Harlan's little breakfast nook at Webderland. When he's not here, we chat about him and his work. When he is, we act like we're guests in his home.

So, here we are in Harlan's home. And Harlan walks in pleased as punch on his 19th wedding anniversary, with a beautiful bronze statue of Lindbergh signed by the hero himself. He's giving it to his lovely wife as an expression of just how much he loves her.

We sniff it over, and begin ranting about how Lindbergh was a racist Nazi.

Recalling for a moment the demands of those simple social graces that momma tried to teach us back when we were still young and impressionable, does anyone see anything wrong with this scenario?

Yes, I have looked at, among other things the Scott Berg book on Lindbergh, and sure, he was not a member of the nazi party, but I do believe he was a racist. In those days racism was about as common as rumble seats.

I use a broad view in using the term 'nazi,' if that makes some bristle, then we live in two different bubbles. I do not, and will not ever give racism a pass--even minor racism.

I mentioned the PBS site, because it was close, and handy.

I am quite schooled on politics. That is one area I cannot be tapped.

I do remember that Howard Zinn mentioned Lindbergh's racism as well.

He was a member of the America First Committee. I would guess that you could find a nazi by flexing your shoulders.

Ok, I will concede that he is not a full on nazi, but there are better heros to look up to.

Racism, in my mind is evil. Just calling it ignorance, is glossing over the sharp edges.

Ignorance is when you refuse to learn. I have a mind that is as open as space.

Biographer's have agendas. I do think it wise that people be more skeptical about the entire history of this country.

clarification for Mr. Ellison
Hi Harlan. I beg your pardon for my lack of clarity. Point by point, then, to guard against this tendancy of mine...

Foolscap Convention
http://www.foolscapcon.org/
As I understand, you are to be a guest of honor at this convention.

The other guests of honor are Gabe and Tycho. Mike "Gabe" Krahulik and Jerry "Tycho" Holkins are the co-creators of Penny Arcade, an online comic strip.
http://www.penny-arcade.com/

Penny Arcade is ostensibly a thrice-weekly comic about the video game industry, but the creators may be more widely known for Child's Play (a toy drive which raised $310,000 for children's hospitals last year).
http://www.wsa.org/prnewswire/detail.asp?NewsFeedID=145963

Now why did I assume you knew all of the above?
Well, I generally figure you are omniscient, for starters. On top of that, I've never been to a convention. I assumed they were going to throw the three of you in a room together a la "An Evening of Lively Debate" when you shared the stage with Mssrs. Gaiman and Davis at M.I.T. some years ago.

Judging by your reaction, though, this must not be what is happening.

Sorry about the confusion,
Elijah "Deck the Halls With Boston Charley" Newton

Speaking of Idiots
This quote from Aaron Broussard, President of Jefferson Parrish Louisiana, to CBS News:

“Take whatever idiot they have at the top of whatever agency and give me a better idiot. Give me a caring idiot. Give me a sensitive idiot. Just don’t give me the same idiot.”

Mike

Frank and Rob both need to take a break from the board.

Jimmy Stewart played Lindbergh in THE SPIRIT OF ST. LOUIS (Warner Bros, 1957). Would JIMMY STEWART, of all people, have played a Nazi?

Also, the "Errol Flynn was a Nazi" story has been so thoroughly discredited in so many places by now... sheesh!

To Gods And Monsters...And Frank


Frank, I think I can tell you what happened. You have a tendency to adopt views, highlight the "sizzle" points, then look for information that only reinforces what you've come to accept rather than asking questions (playing your own internal "devils advocate", if you will) to find out if you are missing any pieces. After you saw that AMERICAN EXPERIENCE, you should have dug for more about Lindbergh to verify what you heard or clarify the details. That's what gives you the edge in debating.

Lingbergh 101 (BTW, I saw the PBS show once as well and though they made clear Lingbergh's foolish fraternizing with Nazi officials, some of his simplistic racist views, and his Isolationist views, the documentary never declared him a Nazi)

Let us begin this evening lecture with a few quick definitions:

1) Ignorant: Lacking in knowledge or training

2) Idiot: George Bush

3) Nazi: A member of the National Socialist German Workers' Party which seized control of Germany in 1933, or a person who holds similar views.

4) Isolationist: One who holds to the doctrine that peace and economic advancement can best be achieved by isolating one's country from alliances and commitments with other countries.

Let me open the lecture by establishing that, technically, Charles Lindbergh was an Isolationist, not a Nazi. A Nazi openly supported Hitler's expansionist policy. Lindbergh believed that America should not get involved in the war in Europe. He fraternized with Nazi officials. He himself was not a Nazi. You yourself may draw a thin line in that meaning, but, fucked up and lame though his thinking, this did not make him a Nazi. He believed in American democracy.

You are probably aware that MANY American businessmen in that period sat down with Nazi's in New York to talk about the "wonderful" prospects "when Hitler wins the war". You'd have to call them Nazis just as much, then. They weren't, of course. They were just avaricious fucks, like the ones in Bush's administration, looking after their own interests.

(Even Henry Ford was not technically a Nazi and he REALLY sympathized with the Hitler machine. He did lots of business with Hitler and sought to further his business interests by encouraging French executives to work with German officials overseeing the occupation. A monstrous sympathizer, far worse than Lindbergh)

Lindbergh's visits to Germany actually began with connections to American Army intelligence. His celebrity, they believed, would entice the Germans to show him their aviation accomplishments, thereby giving him access to sites previously inaccessible to Americans. The Army sent an invitation to Lindbergh in 1936 and it was agreed that he would come to Berlin. So, collecting information about German aviation was made part of Lindbergh's agenda.

The following is from historical text:

'On Lindbergh’s last day in Germany, Lindbergh and his wife attended the opening ceremonies of the 1936 Summer Olympics in Berlin as special guests of Hermann Göring and were seated in a special spectator box with Göring and his wife. Truman Smith later claimed that Lindbergh’s special relationship with Göring was a milestone for the American military attaché in Berlin because it gave the Americans access to German Air Ministry they never had before.

The facilities and technology of the German Luftwaffe impressed Lindbergh. He also noted the work ethic of the German people, and exclaimed that there was “a spirit in Germany which I have not seen in any other country. There is certainly great ability, and I am inclined to think more intelligent leadership than is generally recognized. A person would have to be blind not to recognize that they have already built up tremendous strength”. Lindbergh also was impressed by the good discipline, high morals, and restrained press that existed in Germany—things that he believed were lacking in the United States.

On 11 October 1937, Lindbergh and his wife Anne flew on their second trip to Germany. It was an unofficial visit and Lindbergh met with no Third Reich officials, but he did visit airfields and factories in Bremen and Pomerania and once again was impressed with Luftwaffe technology and capabilities. A few months later, Lindbergh was invited to examine the air forces of Czechoslovakia and Russia, but was unimpressed in comparison to what he had seen in Germany. “Germany now has the means of destroying London, Paris and Prague if she wishes to do so”, Lindbergh said. “I am convinced that it is wiser to permit Germany’s eastward expansion than to throw England and France, unprepared, into a war at this time”.

Although Lindbergh believed the German Luftwaffe was unstoppable in Europe, it is not clear to what degree he ever became a Nazi sympathizer per se. “I was far from being in accord with the philosophy, policy, and actions of the Nazi government”, he later wrote. Clearly, to him the Soviet Union and communism posed a much greater threat to Europe and “Western Civilization” as he called it, and a strong Nazi Germany could protect Western Europe from the Russians.

Lindbergh’s next trip to Germany in October 1938 proved to be the most controversial trip. After a day of touring factories in Magdeburg and Dessau, Lindbergh along with the American Ambassador Hugh Wilson attended an official state dinner with Hermann Göring and a number of other Nazi officials. At the dinner on 18 October, Lindbergh and the members of the American embassy were surprised when Göring arrived with a small red leather box in hand. In the box was the Verdienstkreuz Deutscher Adler, or Service Cross of the German Eagle, and it was presented to Lindbergh “by order of the Führer”. Lindbergh thought little of the award, which previously had been given to both Henry Ford and the French Ambassador; he saw it as simply another commendation for his trans-Atlantic flight.


Even after this event, Lindbergh still did not publicly condemn the Nazis or decide to return his medal. Lindbergh still hoped for a battle between Stalin and Hitler while France and Britain might arm. Later in 1938, after the Munich Agreement, Lindbergh held the opinion that Hitler should simply be left alone. After witnessing Kristallnacht and the Nazi occupation of Czechoslovakia, Americans began to be more critical of Lindbergh and some journalists began to criticize his choice to not return his Nazi medal. Later, in late 1938 or early 1939, Lindbergh attempted to broker a deal for a joint Franco-German aircraft—although the plan was doomed to fail from the start. Lindbergh made his final trip to Berlin in January 1939, and soon after decided that since war was imminent, he should better return to the United States.

During the trip across the Atlantic by ship Lindbergh wrote in his diary an entry that now sheds some light onto his views on Jews, which he was careful not to share in public. His diary entry on 10 April 1939 reads “a few Jews add strength and character to our country, but too many create chaos. And we are getting too many. This present immigration will have a reaction”. Not until his 1941 speech in Des Moines/Iowa did Lindbergh utter such words publicly.

After more than three years living outside the United States, Lindbergh sought to steer America away from joining a war in Europe. Although Lindbergh was happy with President Roosevelt’s neutral stance, he didn’t fully trust the president and thought that Roosevelt wanted the Allies to triumph and thus would try to help them. Expressing his usual frustration with the press in the United States, he called his much-awaited return to the United States a “barbaric entry into a civilized country”. Upon his arrival, Lindbergh decided to enlist in the Army Air Force, accepting a Colonel position. Shortly after, Lindbergh met with President Roosevelt for a personal meeting that seemed to go well but Lindbergh left suspicious, nevertheless.

In September 1939, two weeks after the Nazi invasion of Poland, Lindbergh delivered a nationwide radio address urging the United States to stay out of the war. In this speech Lindbergh proclaimed that Nazi victory in Europe was certain and because of this America should stay out and deal with the consequences. Later in the speech, Lindbergh commented “These wars in Europe are not wars in which our civilization is defending itself against some Asiatic intruder”. '

HERE'S TO GODS AND MONSTERS!

Becoming Un-Ignorant
OK, Frank, how about: you write a term paper on Charles Lindbergh? You're never too old to look things up. Cite at least, oh, three or four sources. You may NOT use a television program as a source. If you are caught plagiarizing with cut and paste, you must write your paper on a manual typewriter as penance. (I think all college professors should keep a manual typewriter around for just that.)

I don't know what the average age here is, but it is probably less than Harlan's. Nobody can help when they were born; it is, however, possible to look up things that were "before your time." Cultural "reference points" differ (as iirc some of us were discussing on the other board.)

Kristin
Just a baby at 40

JEEEZUS JUMPIN' KEE-RIST, STAN!!!!!!!!!

That fucking Errol Flynn bullshit again?????

What the hell is WRONG with you people? Am I the only one old enough to REMEMBER any of this shit?!!!!??

Do you batten on decades-old urban legends, feast on rumor and innuendo, swamp yourselves in utterly discredited, blatant flapdoodle...or are you just plain and simple IGNORANT?!?

Wearily,

he

MR. CHURCH:

Nowhere did I call you an idiot.

I called you "ignorant."

Not stupid, not a dolt, not an idiot, not a buffoon, not a man more intent on always proving himself right, even when wrong. No, I merely said you were ignorant.

You could look it up.

I'm sure somewhere, in some volume of incunabula you'll find a description that might include idiot; but I did not call you that. I called you ignorant.

Ignorance is posited in many ways.

One of them is attempting to validate that which one does not know from experience or proper research by reference to tv shows and the websites thereto pertaining.

Bush is an idiot. You are merely ignorant.

Have a nice day.

Harlan Ellison

TO BRIAN
Okay Brian...I stand corrected, like I said I am not that familiar with Chaplin's life. But others in Hollywood at the time were suspected of Nazi sympathizes...Errol Flynn I know was suspected.

Stan, Chaplin was never a supporter of Hitler-- as a viewing of his film _The Great Dictator_ should demonstrate. Chaplin left America because he _wasn't allowed in_, due to accusations of Communist sympathies.

usa
Oh Harlan...Lucky Lindy was in sympathy for the Hitler bunch in the thirties....I think after the world discovered how much of a crazy and loonie s.o.b. Hitler was, that Chuck recanted. The one who never recanted was another Charlie....Chaplin of course and went into self exile because of it (maybe did later on his life...I am not really up on Chaplin's life).
As loonie and crazy that strutting "little corporal" was he did one good thing during his reign of terror....he introduced the Autobahn...the beginnings of our nationwide freeway system. But of late, when I have to spend ten to thirty minutes absolutely not moving due to traffic....I wonder if Eisenhower did us any favors by introducing the freeway system to America.

The Mindless Tyranny Of Our Cut-And-Paste Culture
Ignorance is not bliss, Frank. It's ignorance.

What Harlan is asking you to do is devote a chunk of time and go to a bookstore, library, or some other place where you can get books, obtain a biography or two of said Mr. Charles L, and read about the man.

And while you're reading those, invest some time in studying some cultural or political history to gain some insight into the man and his times.

(Hey, it's an archaic usage now, but you might be surprised to learn that couching statements in terms of race was a pretty common thing in those days.) (Not as common then as it was a few generations earlier; go and read some of Jack London's early works. That will really illuminate the point).

Read those sources and allow the words and the images to filter down through that greatest of all creations, the slow, pondering brain, and thus get a more complete picture of the man.

ANYONE can cut this and paste that and make all sorts of silly nonsensical assertions. I've done it myself. And quite frankly, it does two things for me: 1> It convinces no one of the point I'm trying to make, and 2> provokes others to post their own http://www.ohyeahyou'retheonewho'swrongscumbag.com/an_essay_by_some_jackass_that_knows_even_less_about_the_subject_than_you.html braindead responses. Enough, already!

What he's asking you to do is MAKE IT A HABIT TO READ! Find good books about fascinating people, as well as books that illuminate the times in which they lived, and read them!

And don't think I'm just chiding you here. The fact that I'm sitting here typing out a response to what you posted means I am not following my own advice nearly as much as I should. Hell, reviewing several of my own recent posts on this board is a real wake up call to me about how I spend the few snippets of spare time I find during the day.

Ah, ignorance is bliss, remember?

Sure, there is not one hundred percent certainty of Lindbergh's Nazified air, but the evidence of his statements and actions at the time were well beyond naive assumptions.

Harlan, I take it you trust PBS? They did a documentary on their American Experience program, where they laid bare some of the truths about Charles L.

I take it these statements go beyond naive clucking:

""These wars in Europe are not wars in which our civilization is defending itself against some Asiatic intruder... This is not a question of banding together to defend the white race against foreign invasion"

""racial strength is vital,"

"That our civilization depends on a Western wall of race and arms which can hold back... the infiltration of inferior blood."

And you wonder what Hitler was thinking when he gave this wonder that award.

It is all on the PBS site. Looks pretty clear cut to me.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/lindbergh/sfeature/fallen.html

And, in America at that time Nazi sympathy was very high. It is not that far fetched to think Lindbergh could be swayed by that ideal.

There is no defense for some of the things Lindbergh did or said.

I am not trying to make your day bad Harlan, but when someone I look up to calls me an idiot, it does agitate me.

Congrats on making it through the Bronze Age, and hope this whole Iron Age thing continues to work out. :-)

Reading
I always wanted to know what you like to read. Be it for entertainment or for news info. Who were your favorite authors?

"Love Those Ellisons" indeed. Happy anniversary, kids.

FRANK CHURCH: No, Chas. Lindbergh (with an "h") was not a Nazi.
Tsk tsk, my ignorant friend. Read a biography of him. ANY book including the Brittanica will straighten you out. No one argues that some of his perceptions and public pronouncements pre-WWII, in the wake of his enormous celebrity, were memorably wrongheaded, but in no way could he be called a Nazi.

ELIJAH NEWTON: I wish I knew what the hell you're referencing when you mention some sort of liaison among Foolscap, the convention, Penny Arcade (whatever that is), and me. But, sadly, I sit here with a look of Pogo-like bewilderment on mah phizz.

Yr. pal, Harlan

Jeez, I really like those Ellisons; I do.

Two bits - the first, just adding my voice to the chorus of well-wishers regarding your anniversary. It remains a regret of mine that I did not ask Susan if she would also sign the book you kindly autographed for me. May you both have many more and happy years together.

Secondly, a side note regarding your appearance at Foolscap with the creators of Penny Arcade. I've read their comic since the first year, and must confess I'm a bit curious as to your reaction to being joined with these fellows. Is there a shared background with which I'm not familiar? Was this a speculative joining on the part of the convention organizers? Are you being asked to comment on the evolving nature of comics as they move online? Curious, Mr. Ellison, I am curious... and too geographically removed to attend, myself.

Here's hoping it's like peanut butter and chocolate more than, say, peanut butter and pizza. Provided they don't get tongue-tied just by being around you, I think it will be a neat crew.

Happy happy, joy joy!
Many congratulations, Susan and Harlan, on your 19/20 years together. May the Blue Bird of Happiness continue to flit across the eaves of Ellison Wonderland!

Rob and Paul from across the pond

Happy Anniversary to Harlan and Susan!

I hate being late.
A belated happy anniversary to you and Susan, my dearest Harlan. Yes, you are the studly god of gift-giving, but you can be a colossal pain in the ass from time to time. I still think you and Susan are BOTH lucky.

You and Doug can be whomever you like, but cut Margo a break, huh? I like that kid.

Sorry for the double post. I can't even blame it on painkillers at the moment.

Belated congratulations on the 19th wedding anniversary, Harlan and Susan, best wishes for many more, and all like that. I'd have tendered these sentiments in a timelier fashion but for being laid up with lower back pain (the family curse) and incapable of any activity much more demanding than looking at the pretty pictures in a comic-book book called THE SEVEN SOLDIER SOLDIERS OF VICTORY ARCHIVES. Which, as chance would have it, contains a quote from HE about how much he enjoyed the SSoV in LEADING COMICS back when.

On a grimmer note, a doctor friend who has been doing triage work in New Orleans for the past week describes conditions there as "horrible, just horrible." Says you cannot imagine the stench and misery -- this from a woman who normally presides over an emergency room and thought she had Seen It All.

Belated congratulations on the 19th wedding anniversary, Harlan and Susan, best wishes for many more, and all like that. I'd have tendered these sentiments in a timelier fashion but for being laid up with lower back pain (the family curse) and incapable of any activity much more demanding than looking at the pretty pictures in THE SEVEN SOLDIER SOLDIERS OF VICTORY ARCHIVES. Which, as chance would have it, contains a quote from HE about how much he enjoyed the SSoV in LEADING COMICS back when.

On a grimmer note, a doctor friend who has been doing triage work in New Orleans for the past week describes conditions there as "horrible, just horrible." Says you cannot imagine the stench and misery -- this from a woman who normally presides over an emergency room and thought she had Seen It All.

The first 19 are the hardest
Best wishes for the next 19 years, and the 19 after that, ad infinitum!

Happy Belated Anniversary, Harlan and Susan! May you have many, many more!

ALEX JAY: I couldn't agree more. When the media starts talking about who dropped which ball, they should look to their own house FIRST.

Best to all,
Michael and Alia

Many more years of bliss!

Happy Anniversary Harlan and Susan. As a couple, Nick and Nora got nuthin' on you two. Hope you both had a terrific day.

All my best,
Ray

Steve Evil, I am starting to think you are the sane one here.

------------

Susan, every day must be an adventure. Harlan is like the trick or treat candy with the broken glass. Love has its way, and not even the mouth of hell can divert it. You two have fun today. Can Harlan still get it up? hehe.

I hate to do this, but wasn't Lindberg a nazi?

Lee

Thanks for the great response. Your description fills in what I thought to be the situation. As you have described in the past, it is a grinding career. How do singers do it? It just isn’t that grueling. (And now I’m speaking as someone who only reached full-time bar band status – four hours a night/six-nights a week, but only singing occasional leads and a whole lotta harmony.) It does not require the pure physical effort that you have described. Yes, if you want any kind of career, you have to be careful. You will warm up your voice, you will try to learn to sing correctly, and you will step down when you have a cold or your voice is just getting tired. Don’t follow these rules, and the career you dreamed of will come to a halt (most commonly from vocal nodules). But it is not the complete immersion – physical and mental – that dance seems to require. (Maybe it’s different for Broadway or Opera.) I am still surprised there was a need to change singers for a two-hour gig.

Harlan & Susan

Congratulations. How has Susan put up with Harlan? How does anyone put up with anyone else for nineteen years? No, the answer is not a fifth of Jack every night; it is by finding that right person. Greater love hath no man than this - that a man and woman lay down together, get up in the morning, and still be glad to see each other.

Mike

Sundry
Add another belated Happy Anniverary to the list, Unca Harlan & Auntie Sue!

Frank Church: You can be quite the grump, can't ya? I can sympathize with you on some of your sore points; others hardly seem worth getting bothered about. Saying grace? Sword & sorcery and high fantasy novels? Don't like 'em? Don't read 'em! I'll be the first to admit that there are plenty of crappy ones out there (mostly in the form of trilogies)--but, I'll always have a soft spot for "The Lord of the Rings", and a few others.

Robert Morales post which included the e-mail message from Lisa Moore was truly heart-rending. It hit home the reality of what is happening in Louisiana in a way that nothing else I've read or seen has done. The full incompetence of FEMA and the reasons for it will eventually come to light, as long as we refuse to allow it to be swept under the rug. For now, our efforts must be focused on helping those who need it.

Forever Late to the Party
Happy (Belated) Anniversary you two!

Word of warning, Unca H -- my wife of twenty years advised me this last year that the twentieth is now Tanzanite (new math or somesuch falderall). Yeech.

She also said I could unpack. I told her I'd think about it.

Hope you both had a wonderful evening of togetherness and tenderness.

_________________________________

(postscript to Cookie: Thank you. Memories of what was, as well as what hopefully will be again.)

Congrats!
Harlan and Susan,

Congrats on your anniversary, I wish you many more years of happiness!

Dave Clarke, I saw Neil's devil tomato and will also probably buy some when/if he puts it up for sale, as he indicated. Cannot wait to see what kind of label he comes up with for this. If Dave McKean was not busy finishing up Mirror Mask, I think he could design a perfect one for the devil salsa.

I am perpetually a day late and a dollar short...

Happy Anniversary, Harlan and Susan, with best wishes and high hopes for many more to come.

Oh, and Harlan - the postal service executed their task almost competantly. Thought you'd like to know. And - um, okay. You're the man in the Sanctum Sanctorum with the girasol, I'm Harry Vincent.

Best Anniversary Wishes
Lending my voice to the chorus of well wishers. Happy Anniversary to both Harlan and Susan!

All the best, Susan & Harlan!

Happy 19th to Harlan & Susan Ellison.

To quote a friend's poem:

"There was a man who loved his wife,
Every moment of his life.
She was his reason and his rune,
She lit the sun and hung the moon."
-- Will Guthrie

Chuck

NOLA: Not going to talk about it much; the rage and bile start, and it's hard to get back down.

One quick reflection, though: There have been several articles abounding about how the mainstream media are finally finding their teeth again; that in the face of the Katrina tragedy, they are turning on the masters whose tame lap dogs they have been for so long. Newspeople, it seems, are rediscovering their anger.

And you know what, newsmedia?
FUCK YOU.

Where were you? Where was your pert and pithy anger when the foundation for this was laid, over a period of years? Where were you as my country was torn apart, and the pieces sold? Where were you when accountability needed to be demanded? Where were you when the clarion call was sounded and no answer came?
How DARE you fuss and spit now, when you had the responsibility to demand truth before, and were derelict in your duty? When a direct if minor portion of blame is solely yours for not ringing alarms when the hazards started to stack up high on the ground?

When you were more concerned with pursuing sex scandals, Paris Hilton, and the story of the latest Pretty Dead White Girl of the Month and less concerned with the responsibilities you were so cavalierly abdicating?

The next time you stare grimly into the camera with blowdried teeth and vaselined hair, asking mordantly how such a thing could be allowed to pass ... be sure to bring along a fucking mirror.


ON A HAPPIER NOTE:
Happy fiftieth anniversary, Harlan and Susan!
(What? Nineteen? Oh, I know--but the exhortation stands. Gives you something to shoot for.)

Some Thoughts to Harlan
Harlan...I wish we could live at least another hundred or even two hundred years. I have often thought, what the world would be like in 2100 or 2200 A.D? If all the writing you have done as well as those of Asimov, Bradbury, et al....will be read or will they go to dust...like the way we will go sometime in the near future? Seventy Five or Eighty years is not enough. Those that went before us, did they wish they could have written another short story, another novel? You see....on February 22nd of next year I will be the great six...oh! (60). Time is so short...I suppose I had better get back to my word processor and churn out another short story (that will probably never get published...ha!) Anyway...happy 20th to you and Susan.

Your brother of letters....STAN

The Tendrils of Incompetence

Interestingly, I haven't seen anyone here discuss Michael Brown yet, the head of FEMA (sorry if I missed it anywhere).

"Why is this so much Bush's fault?", a proponent might ask.

Well, we already discussed his cutting FEMA funds, a crucial program staffed to assist in emergency recovery. Along with that fell funding to bring the Louisiana Levees up to date: the levee system's design, I learned, was settled on a quarter of a century ago, before the current numerical system of classifying storms was in widespread use. Apparently, studies had begun recently on strengthening the system to protect against Category 4 and 5 hurricanes, but Federal funding was cut for that. That all has to do directly with the Bush Administration.

And what about Brown? This guy's background, as a well-to-do commissioner of the International Arabian Horse Association, whose job it was to ensure that horse-show judges followed the rules and to investigate allegations against those suspected of cheating, left him with zero qualifications to head any program like FEMA. He knew nothing - NOTHING about assisting those in a natural disaster; he had no knowledge about the economically disadvantaged or the poor.

Thus, while thousands were waiting for help or lying dead after Katrina, Brown - like some deluded dipshit - went on about how well things were going. Apparently, only when the facts began coming in was he forced to come to terms with reality.

Brown, a totally unqualified incompetent, a politicall hack, was appointed by Bush because he was buddies with the President's campaign manager. CRONYISM. The finger, caught in the ceaseless turnstile, points straight back at BUSH.

A cozy little family, this administration and its children, this larvae of heartless, lying, self-serving, detached incompetents only interested in their wealth and corporate America...clearly at everyone else's expense.

I thank you, Conservative voters ALL, for putting into place a dynasty of avaricious filth and fanatacism...guided by an ignorant benighted moron who has brought more embarrassment to this country than any President in recorded history. You've done for the nation more than you're probably willing to face. If you are living in denial I guess I can't blame you.

Well...you get what you pay for.

(And, CINDY...I meant to bring this to your attention way back - when you went on still defending the Iraq war. I would like to hold to you a sliver of logic: Back while Rumsfeld declared that we KNEW for fact where Hussein was hiding the WMDs, we still had the inspectors there. They'd barely arrived. Well, it was supposed to be THEIR job to go see - to CONFIRM - what Rumseld apparently KNEW, so that we could realistically determine where the major war needed to be fought. When, in fact, the most critical focus needed to be in Afghanistan - where, instead, we chose to rely on the country's corrupt warlords in the effort. We just yoinked the inspectors out before they could confirm one damn thing! NOW...Iraq will most likely have a civil war and odds are we will be faced with another fundamentalist Islamic regime; that poses a bigger problem to us than Hussein could ever prove. The CIA had no more verifiable intelligence than Bush has. Clearly, removing Hussein should have been a war for another time...and in what might have been a more multilateral effort. The inspectors were supposed to be able to report to us whether or not that was the case)


...AND, UM...YES...HAVING SAID ALL THAT: SUSAN AND HARLAN...OF COURSE...HAPPY ANNIVERSARY. SORRY ABOUT THE AWKWARD TIMING. UM...WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN..."Hrumph!"

Went out to eat the other day with my wife, Juanita. We dine out about four times per month, mostly because we're too busy, or sometimes just too lazy. Anyway, while we were leaving and I was paying, I glanced down at a photo of the American flag that someone had stuck under the glass counter top. The photo was captioned "American flag in Arizona." Behind the flag the sun was shining, and in the upper left part of the flag's stars I could see that the sun was shining through the flag in such a way as to show a cross-like symbol. Below the photo someone had written "Proof that God is watching over us."

I thought of the time when I was out camping and I put an empty airline-sized bottle of Jack Daniel's on a tree stump, then backed away to do something else. When I turned around to look for the bottle, I couldn't find the fucking thing to save my life. The bottle was perfectly camouflaged. Never did find it.

What does it all mean? Well, sometimes we only see what we want to see, and other times we can't see even if we try to see.

Did y'all see Neil Gaiman's devil-tomato? Is it a tomato that looks like a devil? or is it a devil that just looks like a tomato?

Either way, if he makes salsa out of it and auctions it on eBay, I'm biddin'.

Happy Anniversary Harlan and Susan!!!! (And thank you for reminding us. I discovered this board not long after your last one, so I knew it was in Sept but wasnt sure of the exact date!) I know you have some of the sweetest love between you!!!! I suppose it takes a special person to marry Harlan, but then it takes a special person to BE Harlan, and I don't think most of us would measure up either way. (Do you still have that shirt that says "I am a professional. Do not try this at home."? I'll never forget seeing you wearing it at a convention once.)

I know there is a lot of anger and finger pointing over New Orleans right now. I don't blame the poor and black people for their bitterness; it seems well justified. But all of us can offer our compassion, our thoughts or prayers, and or donations (time or money) to help the victims. It's the best we can do. (My parents, both retired, are thinking about going through their church group to volunteer their help rebuilding homes. That may not be for a while yet though.)


Aww, Cookie, what a cute story about yr kid and the teddy bear! I just go NUTS over teddy bears, and I'm 40! LOL

Kristin

(not),quite, (sure) about, all/my grammar& punctuation marks...
Still considering foolscap but doubtful about whether i can make it....others who are going, please contact me....

Happy Anniversary Unca Harlan. There may yet be hope for us all.


Frank: Whatchya talkin' 'bout? Knights and dragons rule! I've been composing my own epic here in pencil since I was twelve. Wish I could find the hand drawn map. I'm going to sell it to TSR and it will be a best seller and inspire a Role Playing Game. A Live Action Role Playing Game! With duct tape swords!
Yeah! Role the dice!

Congrats, and thanks
Congratulations to Harlan and Susan for nineteen years of keepin' on keepin' on, thanks to Susan for keeping Harlan going, and thanks to Harlan for all the words, some of which have quite literally saved my life on more than one occasion. Hope the next decades are as kind to you both as you deserve (if so, could ya save me a seat for the double coronation? Thanks.)

Best wishes.

Tad

HAPPY ANNIVERSARY, HARLAN and SUSAN!! May you enjoy many many more years together!

__________-
Note: I finally was able to make a coherent artistic gesture regarding The Shit in NOLA. Today I wrote a reflective arrangement of "Do You Know What It Means To Miss New Orleans?" for my college jazz choir. It's just one time through the song, but I didn't want it to be some huge arranging extravaganza. I just wanted to pour out my sadness and love in a short, simple statement. My kids read it tonight and it's going to sound very good. It's a way for all of us in the group to stay mindful of the city and its people. "There's something more, I miss the one I care for more than I miss New Orleans."

I spent the day working on it. Cathartic to an extent, but I'm still pretty ticked off about what's going on at the highest levels of government. New Orleans and Louisiana can demand answers from their own politicians and do with them what they will. I don't vote or pay taxes there so I leave it up to the good voters there to handle it. I *do* want some honest analysis and answers from the Feds because I *do* give them my tax money and vote in Federal elections. I think they dropped the ball this time and so far, I'm not hearing anything credible that makes me want to change my mind.
_____________________
My kids went to Build a Bear Workshop on Tour at the State Fair last weekend. My youngest built a bear with sunglasses and a Harley-Davidson shirt. The "Harley" must have revved his mind in that direction because when he named his bear, he named it Harlan ("Like Harlan Ellison, mom!" he said). He wanted me to tell HE, (so now I did).
__________________
Steve: I loved those photos. Thanks!

OUR ANNIVERSARY

Today is our 19th wedding anniversary. Together 20, wed for 19.

The nineteenth is traditionally bronze.

So I got her a "bronzer" by Guerlain, over which she had been slavering, though it cost a Dauphin's ransom; and from a high-end MastroNet auction a 14" high bronze statue of Chas. A. Lindbergh, in full WIND, SAND AND STARS mufti, with his signature on it: "Charles A. 'Charlie' Lindbergh."

I tell you this not to prove what a good husband I am, but merely to stuff a sock in the mouth of anyone who gets within stuffing range of me and smarmily opines, "How has she PUT UP with him for niiiiiineteeeeen years?"

Yr. pal, Harlan

Mike,

It is possible for a principal dancer to do all shows for short runs, but anything longer than a week and you need to go with varied repertory or redundant casting to avoid problems with chronic fatigue, which leads inevitably to poor performance and, eventually, injury.

To give you an idea of the full schedule of a touring company, one common run format in dance is eight show weeks with matinees on Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday, dark on Sunday night and Monday. Wednesday matinee is often referred to as the “kiddie mat” because schools typically bus in thousands of kids for that show. One way a director has of letting you know that you are not the top dog is by making you do all the kiddie mats. The harder the piece, the clearer the message: kids generally squeal loudly when you are done, then stop clapping after about two seconds no matter how well you did.

For one four month touring season there can be ten to twenty repertory pieces and two to four full length productions. The choreography is learned in about three months of full rehearsal leading up to the tour, with touch-ups and alternate casts being worked in on the road. On a non-matinee day, there is typically a one hour and fifteen minute class in the mornings, followed by a lighting rehearsal for current rep on the first day in a new theatre or by two to three hours of blocking rehearsals (not full out) on other days. The blocking rehearsals are for setting upcoming rep to the local stage marks, or walking alternate casts through an upcoming piece.

Class, rehearsal and performance create three cycles of warm-up and cool-down, with the last cool down happening at about eleven at night. It’s the cycle of warming up and cooling down that is fatiguing and it is very easy to stop going to class and just blast out the shows for a while. You learn after a season or two that this is a bad idea, because you inevitably get a little injury from that, such as a light groin pull or a stone bruise on the ball of your foot. Then the relentlessness of the performing cycle begins to work on that injury and night after night it gets worse as there is no time for complete recovery during the tour.

About six weeks of this, and some people get too hurt to perform. That is when the double casting starts to seem like a really good idea. But by the end of the tour there are holes. Young soloist or corps dancers are called up to fill them. That is when emergency rehearsals begin. These can occasionally be full out right before curtain, on top of the blocking rehearsals from earlier in the day. The overtime pay is no consolation as you spiral down into a throbbing pit of injury and stress and exhaustion, swearing that this is it. Nothing can be worse than this.

Then the season ends, and you are unemployed.

The throbbing of your groin pull begins to subside as the unemployment lady looks at you sympathetically. You are opening a claim for the fifth straight year and though she knows you on a first name basis and your next contract is already signed, she still has to say, “Now, honey, I’m going to have to check these references.”

How do singers do it?


The Wednesday matinee is often referred to as the "kiddie mat" because that is the one that schools often bus thousands of students to see. It is especially difficult to perform matinee and evening back to back with good performance quality in both.

Peter Reeves
Regarding your point #3, which no one else has addressed, to wit:

"3) Why did the Governor abandon the City of New Orleans for the Safety of Baton Rouge, before the Plan was Executed?"

Ummm. Buddy. The Governor of the state of Louisiana lives in Baton Rouge, the capitol, in the house commonly known as the, ah, what's the word GOVERNOR'S MANSION.

Just want things to remain balanced.

Um, Frank...Bobby Short is dead. Died this year, after a legendary career. I know, we can speak ill of the dead around here, but that's usually reserved for the heinous, not the melodious.

New Recruit
Okay -- and to get the forum back to the topic at large:

A friend was in my car yesterday as we were headed back after lunch. I had the cd of Robin Williams' interview of Ellison -- who, sadly, my relatively learned friend was unfamiliar with.

Five minutes into the thing he was hooting with delight at, as he put it, "the most intelligent inane rambling I've ever heard". I promptly lent him the CD and a few books (Strange Wine, Shatterday and the Deathbird).

Once he climbs back out of his hidy hole I expect Ellison will have a new fan, provided my friend doesn't require therapy first.



Oh, and aside to Dave Clarke. Thank you. Glad you enjoyed.

Bush, Saddam, and Iraq

We've each had our say in this forum, and it's time to take it out of here. So I've posted my response to Cindy in the General area of the Webderland Forum boards, for anyone who's interested.

"Everything that was possible was evacuated and, as Steve Dooner points out, was more effective than the evacuation plans, which estimated 200,000 residents left behind."

Yeah, some evacuation plan. Too bad Bush wasn't the author of it: "BUSH'S EVACUATION PLAN LEAVES 200,000 BEHIND!!!"

There is plenty of blame to go around. FEMA is a clown car. But the responsibility for getting the buck STARTED begins with the local authorities. A mayor's job is to GET THINGS DONE, not wait for a federal authority to swoop in and do his job for him. The first responders are his to organize and dispatch.

Save lives first, Mr. Mayor. If toes get stepped on, you can apologize for saving those lives later.

And hey, when it comes to the sick and injured needing help evacuating, I stated it in another thread: Communities band together and help those who can't help themselves. That includes those with no other way to get themselves out than their own two feet. I lived in Manhattan in 1990; I didn't have a car. Had I lived there in 2001, I doubt I'd be sitting around and wait for Big Daddy FEMA to come in and carry me out.

By the way, if you're going to slag Fox News, please don't reference The Nation in the same post. If I could make use of all the resulting irony, I'd have freshly pressed shirts for the rest of my life.

Lies from the Right
OK Mr. Reeves, now I am pissed off. I have been gathering information from as many sources as I can find and I cannot believe the arrogance and outright lies that these Republicans are spouting, many of which you, sirrah, parrot like a good little brown shirt.

I have no idea where you get your information from, although I suspect it is Faux (Fox) News, but here are some facts, with a number of references, that you might want to check out before spouting off again:

* Gov Blanco declared a state of emergency on 8/26
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001054596

* I do not have the quote or reference handy but when discussing the situation and why they did not leave, the Parish Presidents were told Federal aid, "the Calvary" was coming. This is why may of them stayed

* Brown, the head of FEMA, told reporters that the people were being fed one to two meals a day, in shelters, which is an outright lie

* Both Bush and Brown said that they could not anticipate the levees failing, yet there have been numerous articles in the N-O Times-Picayune, Scientific American and the NY Times all detailed that possibility, if not probability that a hurricane would strike New Orleans. In fact, that was one of 3 likely disasters FEMA detailed, with the others being a massive earthquake in CA and a terrorist attack on NYC.

* Everything that was possible was evacuated and, as Steve Dooner points out, was more effective than the evacuation plans, which estimated 200,000 residents left behind. The ones who were left behind were primarily the elderly, the sick, and those too poor to have a car or buy a ticket out of town.

Blaming the victims of this tragedy, such as the Parish Presidents, is repulsive and you ought to be ashamed of yourself. A better question to ask is why federal response was so slow, why resources were not deployed immediately, one of the key examples is the people on a military base in Mississippi playing basketball while across the street refugees had no food or water. This is another great example of the complete lack of sense being used in the federal government now, the article talks about Navy pilots who were disciplined for saving people http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/07/national/nationalspecial/07navy.html?adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1126072863-wH8ewn9+Jn3MhqdEDLWMXA

Then you have Barbara Bush, the new Marie Antoinette, making these comments that the refugees have it pretty good in Texas:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20050906/cm_thenation/120080

The actions of the federal government in their response to this tragedy can only be described as criminal negligence and it is beyond my comprehension how anyone could not recognize this.

To lighten up the moment, Frank Church presents, "things that make me go arrrrrggggghhhh!!!"

Why all these buddy movies, where a goofy white guy is teamed up with a hipper black tough? Please Lord, I do not need to see any more white guys saying "shizzle my nizzle, dizzle."

I do not want to see another tv commercial, using a great song from the past. Nothing more evil then seeing a Clash song or a Ramones song used to sell beer and soda. It would be nice if the artists didn't sell the songs. Pissers.

The news media needs to quit saying that Bush has resolve or that he sticks to his guns; It is not resolve, it is ignorance; it is not sticking to anything, but fanatical selfishness.

Movies should not be given good reviews for good acting alone. Sure, acting is important, but story is the main thrust to any good movie. I can see good acting on tv, better that movies have great writing. I refuse to sit through another snooze fest, just because the actors put in stellar performances.

What is the big deal about Bobby Short? The fucking guy can't sing. He does Cole Porter and it sounds more like cole slaw. Critics need to quit overrating this guy. He is a pudgy hack, and that is that.

All fantasy books involving swords and knights and dragons should be banned. I do want to get medieval with the next hack who writes one of these idiot books.

Praying over food is stupid. God does not care about your digestion. Pray that the poor are eating, and close your fat trap.

I don't care who the next singer of INXS will be. When the lead singer kills himself, that about does it for the band. The fat idiots in the band actually think that they had something to do with the success of the group. Hutchence was the band, like Jim Morrison was the Doors.

Hitting a child is not discipline, it is hate. You spank or hit a child, you might as well tell him or her that you hate them. Violence is acted on because of hitting kids. Discipline is using your noggin. Kids have to much structure, anyway. Let them be independent minds.

Jay Leno is not a 'talk show,' it is a show, where hack actors and other artists hock their newest travesty. Call it the home shopping channel for low culture. If it was about talk, then you would see interesting people on there, not just people like Paris Hilton, who can't even hold a simple sentence together.

-------------------

Great piece about racism by Tim Wise.

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=72&ItemID=8689

You go, Pete Reeves!

Spread that manure more. It's a bit thin in spots!

Why, O why, didn't they fill out form 11/b26-2?!!

Two days before the Hurricane hit, the feds knew about the state of emergency. Then on August 28th, an expedited emergency was declared.

Mayor Nagin evacualted 80% of his population, leaving 100,000 behind. That's true. However, all evacuation plans estimated 200,000 left behind.

Are tough guy, "Go get 'em" conservative-types now demanding that all paper work be properly filled out when a stage 5 hurricane is coming? What's up with that?

Was that true for Clinton during Hurricane Floyd?

Was that true for President Bush's father when he federalized the National Guard during the L.A. Riots?

It couldn't be that the Republican-run federal governmet, wanting to preserve tax cuts for the rich, has become so tight-fisted that it tried to wish away a major disaster to save money? Could it?

Say, when's Harlan's next audio collection coming out?

To lighten up the moment, Frank Church presents, "things that make me go arrrrrggggghhhh!!!"

Why all these buddy movies, where a goofy white guy is teamed up with a hipper black tough? Please Lord, I do not need to see any more white guys saying "shizzle my nizzle, dizzle."

I do not want to see another tv commercial, using a great song from the past. Nothing more evil then seeing a Clash song or a Ramones song used to sell beer and soda. It would be nice if the artists didn't sell the songs. Pissers.

The news media needs to quit saying that Bush has resolve or that he sticks to his guns; It is not resolve, it is ignorance; it is not sticking to anything, but fanatical selfishness.

Movies should not be given good reviews for good acting alone. Sure, acting is important, but story is the main thrust to any good movie. I can see good acting on tv, better that movies have great writing. I refuse to sit through another snooze fest, just because the actors put in stellar performances.

What is the big deal about Bobby Short? The fucking guy can't sing. He does Cole Porter and it sounds more like cole slaw. Critics need to quit overrating this guy. He is a pudgy hack, and that is that.

All fantasy books involving swords and knights and dragons should be banned. I do want to get medieval with the next hack who writes one of these idiot books.

Praying over food is stupid. God does not care about your digestion. Pray that the poor are eating, and close your fat trap.

I don't care who the next singer of INXS will be, when the lead singer kills himself, that about does it for the band. The fat idiots in the band actually think that they had something to do with the success of the group. Hutchence was the band, like Jim Morrison was the Doors.

Countering Steve's Balancing Act
Why Didn't Louisiana Follow its Required Emergency Plan?

1) Why Didn't Louisiana Follow it's Emergency Plan? Why isn't anyone talking about this?

2) Why hasn't anyone mentioned that a Pre-Requisite for a Federal Response BY LAW is that State Law is Executed and the Emergency Plan is Executed FIRST?

3) Why did the Governor abandon the City of New Orleans for the Safety of Baton Rouge, before the Plan was Executed?

4) Why, when the federal Government was acting in accordance with the Stafford Act, did the State of Louisiana, by its Governors acts, delay making requests when being told this storm was going to hit?

5) Why did Mayor Nagin or Governor Blanco, delay while sleeping on it Saturday night, the Mandatory evacuation spelled out in the Louisiana Emergency Plan? Saturday the Mayor said he may order an evacuation tomorrow. (Sunday)

6) Where were the Parish Presidents who were signatories to the Louisiana Emergency Plan, and why did they fail in its Execution to the plan?

7) In the Parish failure to implement, why didn't the State take over as required by the plan?

8) Why weren't the Hospitals nursing homes, etc. evacuated since the plan required them to do so?

9) Why did the Mandatory evacuation only occur AFTER President Bush called, and why did Governor Blanco stress that it was only after President Bush Called to urging the Evacuation order? Was she concerned for the Citizens, or was she grandstanding so she could blame the President if the Storm didn't hit?

10) Why were the Action Plan implementations required not done by the Local and State Government?

It isn't FEMA's job to plan for complete and total incompetence from First Responders, or to replace them immediately when it turns out that they're incompetent. FEMA clearly states it takes up to 96 hours to respond if disaster strikes.

In addition, Mayor Nagin after reviewing the crisis with Gov. Blanco, Bush summoned Nagin for a private chat - where, according to Nagin, Bush explained: "Mr. Mayor, I offered two options to the governor. I said to her I was ready to move today. The governor said she needed 24 hours to make a decision." Interesting....

A Question About Dance
As there is a minor calm in the pavilion right now…

Lee – if you’re out there – I’ve got a question.

My wife and I watched the road tour of Moving’ Out last night, and I found it very interesting that it appears there are two sets of principals for the show. The four principals we saw last night perform Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday night, and Sunday matinee. The other team performs Wednesday, Friday, Saturday matinee, and Sunday night. They are also doing the same thing with the singer. (There is one individual who sings all the Billy Joel songs.)

My question to you...

Is this a normal practice for dancers in a demanding performance? As a musician, I was a little surprised to see the principal singer was changed. While it is two hours of singing (with a 20 minute break/intermission in the middle) that is nothing more than many singers are required to perform. (Whether that be performing in a bar band or being on a one-night stand tour.) In other words, I didn’t see the singer doing anything challenging enough to warrant this approach. However, with no experience in the dance arena, I did perceive this to be a challenging piece (choreographed by Twyla Tharp). With all that in mind, is this a common practice?

Thanks

Mike

YAHOO joins MICROSOFT and rest of a long and sordid line of US based multinationals helping the Chinese governnment extend its surveillence and control over the Internet.

http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=14884

"The companies say they have to abide by local regulations, and point out that since China is set to be the world's biggest internet market, they cannot ignore it."

And what fool would dare suggest that there might be values more important than the god given right to make as much money as possible with no concern for the consequences?

The Road to Dune
Minor Harlan Sighting:

There is a playful, circa 1960s letter from Harlan to Frank Herbert in the recently released _The Road to Dune_. It can be found on pages 290-291.

BBC Radio 4 Doco-Drama broadcast
BBC Radio 4 is broadcasting my doco-drama, Wimmy Road, on Friday 16th September at 1415 (GMT) in the afternoon play slot.

For those who miss it, it can be heard for seven days after the initial broadcast on: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/arts/afternoonplay.shtml

FAQ

Robert:

Thanks for posting Lisa Moore's e-mail. I realize the narrative is second-hand, but it seems as reliable as many of the stories related in the media, and far more compelling. In it are details that speak to the horror and indignity of the situation, that help us to appreciate the extent of the tragedy. Because fuck this repeating itself.

D.

My Goodness, Eric.

Keep up the thoughtless cynicism, why don't you?

Do you actually believe that the American government can be run no better than it is? Not under the New Deal, not under the Great Society, not under anyone at anytime?

If you believe this, you may have ventured out of cynicism and straight into the realm of the ridiculous.

And those of you interested in a balanced discussion, here's a little timeline for you all:

August 26th -Governor Blanco orders a State of Emergency
-Bush stays on vacation

August 28th -Governor Blanco orders an "expidited emergency" in response to an assumed Stage 5 Hurricane.
-Mayor Nagin evacuates 80% of the New Orleans' Population.
-Bush continues his vacation

August 29th -Hurricane Katrina hits
-Bush still on vacation

August 30th -Levees swell and burst
-Bush plays guitar, gets in some golf
-Brown, Chertoff and FEMA fail to take seriously governor's request for fourth straight day.

August 31st -People start dying and drowning
-Bush does a flyby at 2,000 feet

Early September -Karl Rove begins a media campaign designed to convince people its all the local official's fault.
-Some people across America, and even in the Webderland Pavilion, buy it wholesale. There is, apparently, a sucker born every millisecond.

Now balance away. I'm sure this will be good.

Steve Dooner

"Certainly if John Kerry was in office the only thing we'd be rescuing out of New Orleans would be treed cats."

Hopefully, my rejoinder to this dorky presumption will not produce a thread; it's too lame a detour.

Since Kerry was going to use Clinton's former agenda, and since that agenda stayed on top of the funding for things like FEMA, it is easy to figure this would not have been the disaster we've seen. Having made THAT conjecture, I think the situation would be better under almost ANYONE else's watch.

I can offer THIS with certainty: my life was doing better when Clinton was running the show, WHATEVER my misgivings about some of his decisions (like NAFTA).

I'm not a big fan of humanity myself, but I think Eric's was a stupid generalization.

>Better get used to it, until this monster, Bush is gone. <

Somehow I don't think that Bush's departure is going to change things much...humanity being what it is. But it's mighty easy to blame everything on one individual. Simple minds seek simple truths.

Certainly if John Kerry was in office the only thing we'd be rescuing out of New Orleans would be treed cats. Democracy, hell. A government of the people, with thousands of elected and appointed comrades, bullocks. Shared responsiblity, nuts.

We are all just a twisted dream in George Bush's pretzel-choked mind. Pawns on the Halliburton chessboard.

A Sound Of Thunder
I know it's off topic but I know that Harlan and Bradbury are friends and that I can assume that the people on this board are Bradbury fans as well but does anyone know what Bradbury thought of the movie? I saw it last night and it was not as awful as 99% of the reviews I read but they really seemed to deviate from the original story and I am curious if Bradbury stands behind the movie or if he prefers the old Ray Bradbury Theater episode adaptation...

Thanks for that, whatever that was. ;)

Bob Denver
(GASP) "DEATH!" Like, farewell, Maynard....

Marie Antoinette moment
Found the following five paragraphs in my e-mailbox this afternoon. Why do they fail, somehow, to take me by surprise?

* * *

Former first lady and mother to President Bush said Monday that evacuees from New Orleans have found a home in Houston.

"Almost everyone I’ve talked to says we're going to move to Houston," Barbara Bush told NPR.

"What I’m hearing is they all want to stay in Texas. Everyone is so overwhelmed by the hospitality.

"And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway, so this --this is working very well for them."

Editor & Publisher notes the former First Lady's remarks were aired this evening on National Public Radio's "Marketplace" program.

Goodbye Gilligan.

- Actor Bob Denver, 70, of TV's "Gilligan's Island" fame has died, his agent tells The Associated Press.

Steve Barber,


Your post was rather half and half. The first half had so much spin on it that it was making me (the patriotic American) ill, so I hopped off. Then there was the much more reasonable second part. Nice job.

I'm just trying to introduce some contrary opinions, that's all. No, Bush isn't perfect. But neither is Cindy Sheehan.

You probably missed it in your casual glance, but that blogger's website also has links to the sites of fourteen writers most commonly associated with the left, plus a list of six more liberal blogs. There's some good writers there, especially Chris Hitchens, who is sort of left and right.

P.S. Enjoyed your website, love Steve Perry (the singer).

New Orleans
All -
Cookie's note expressing her grief but being unable to express it artistically to everyone on this board got me thinking. I have added a page to my website which you are all invited to view. They ain't necessarily my portfolio shots -- but they ARE the essence of my love of the French Quarter, and also of greater New Orleans. Sadly, I was never able to visit and record those areas outside the city which have been so sadly destroyed as well.

http://mysite.verizon.net/res7n0zi/id8.html

Steve

That was the most horrifying thing I have ever read. Robert, could you somehow contact that woman, so that she could go to the media with that report? If the corporate press won't take it, then have her go to Democracy Now or Air America, anywhere. That kind of hard truth has to see the light of day. I can smell the shit, as you write.

------------

Stan, remember, this is the government of the free market. The people who couldn't leave New Orleans have themselves to blame; that's what they get for not being responsible, or not saving money or playing the stock market game. This is Social Darwinism, shoveled hot and heavy, as a steaming pile of fetid shit. Better get used to it, until this monster, Bush is gone.

This was fowarded to me from Samuel R. Delany - Lisa C. Moore is a friend of his and the former editor of the Lambda Book Report ...

From: Lisa Moore
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 10:13 AM
Subject: a survivor's story: Katrina in New Orleans

i heard from my aunt last night that my cousin Denise made it out of New Orleans; she's at her brother's in Baton Rouge. from what she told me: her mother, a licensed practical nurse, was called in to work on Sunday night at Memorial Hospital (historically known as Baptist Hospital to those of us from N.O.). Denise decided to stay with her mother, her niece and grandniece (who is 2 years old); she figured they'd be safe at the hospital. they went to Baptist, and had to wait hours to be assigned a room to sleep in; after they were finally assigned a room,two white nurses suddenly arrived after the cut-off time (time to be assigned a room), and Denise and her family were booted out; their room was given up to the new nurses. Denise was furious, and rather than stay at Baptist, decided to walk home (several blocks away )to ride out the storm at her mother's apartment. her mother stayed at the hospital.

she described it as the scariest time in her life. 3 of the rooms in the apartment (there are only 4) caved in. ceilings caved in, walls caved in. she huddled under a mattress in the hall. she thought she would die from either the storm or a heart attack. after the storm passed, she went back to Baptist to seek shelter (this was Monday). it was also scary at Baptist; the electricity was out, they were running on generators, there was no air conditioning. Tuesday the levees broke, and water began rising. they moved patients upstairs, saw boats pass by on what used to be streets. they were told that they would be evacuated, that buses were coming. then they were told they would have to walk to the nearest intersection, Napoleon and S. Claiborne, to await the buses. they waded out in hip-deep water, only to stand at the intersection, on the neutral ground (what y'all call the median) for 3 1/2 hours. the buses came and took them to the Ernest Morial Convention Center. (yes, the convention center you've all seen on TV.)

Denise said she thought she was in hell. they were there for 2 days, with no water, no food. no shelter. Denise, her mother (63 years old), her niece (21 years old), and 2-year-old grandniece. when they arrived, there were already thousands of people there. they were told that buses were coming. police drove by, windows rolled up, thumbs up signs. national guard trucks rolled by, completely empty, soldiers with guns cocked and aimed at them. nobody stopped to drop off water. a helicopter dropped a load of water, but all the bottles exploded on impact due to the height of the helicopter.

the first day (Wednesday) 4 people died next to her. the second day (Thursday) 6 people died next to her. Denise told me the people around her all thought they had been sent there to die. again, nobody stopped. the only buses that came were full; they dropped off more and more people, but nobody was being picked up and taken away. they found out that those being dropped off had been rescued from rooftops and attics; they got off the buses delirious from lack of water and food. completely dehydrated. the crowd tried to keep them all in one area; Denise said the new arrivals had mostly lost their minds. they had gone crazy.

inside the convention center, the place was one huge bathroom. in order to shit, you had to stand in other people's shit. the floors were black and slick with shit. most people stayed outside because the smell was so bad. but outside wasn't much better: between the heat, the humidity, the lack of water, the old and very young dying from dehydration... and there was no place to lay down, not even room on the sidewalk. they slept outside Wednesday night, under an overpass.

Denise said yes, there were young men with guns there.but they organized the crowd. they went to Canal Street and "looted," and brought back food and water for the old people and the babies, because nobody had eaten in days. when the police rolled down windows and yelled out "the buses are coming," the young men with guns organized the crowd in order: old people in front, women and children next, men in the back. just so that when the buses came, there would be priorities of who got out first.

Denise said the fights she saw between the young men with guns were fist fights. she saw them put their guns down and fight rather than shoot up the crowd. but she said that there were a handful of people shot in the convention center; their bodies were left inside, along with other dead babies and old people.

Denise said the people thought there were being sent there to die. lots of people being dropped off, nobody being picked up. cops passing by, speeding off. national guard rolling by with guns aimed at them. and yes, a few men shot at the police, because at a certain point all the people thought the cops were coming to hurt them, to kill them all. she saw-> Duane
- Wednesday, September 7 2005 12:2:13

"Everything that was possible was evacuated and, as Steve Dooner points out, was more effective than the evacuation plans, which estimated 200,000 residents left behind."

Yeah, some evacuation plan. Too bad Bush wasn't the author of it: "BUSH'S EVACUATION PLAN LEAVES 200,000 BEHIND!!!"

There is plenty of blame to go around. FEMA is a clown car. But the responsibility for getting the buck STARTED begins with the local authorities. A mayor's job is to GET THINGS DONE, not wait for a federal authority to swoop in and do his job for him. The first responders are his to organize and dispatch.

Save lives first, Mr. Mayor. If toes get stepped on, you can apologize for saving those lives later.

And hey, when it comes to the sick and injured needing help evacuating, I stated it in another thread: Communities band together and help those who can't help themselves. That includes those with no other way to get themselves out than their own two feet. I lived in Manhattan in 1990; I didn't have a car. Had I lived there in 2001, I doubt I'd be sitting around and wait for Big Daddy FEMA to come in and carry me out.

By the way, if you're going to slag Fox News, please don't reference The Nation in the same post. If I could make use of all the resulting irony, I'd have freshly pressed shirts for the rest of my life.

Lies from the Right
OK Mr. Reeves, now I am pissed off. I have been gathering information from as many sources as I can find and I cannot believe the arrogance and outright lies that these Republicans are spouting, many of which you, sirrah, parrot like a good little brown shirt.

I have no idea where you get your information from, although I suspect it is Faux (Fox) News, but here are some facts, with a number of references, that you might want to check out before spouting off again:

* Gov Blanco declared a state of emergency on 8/26
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001054596

* I do not have the quote or reference handy but when discussing the situation and why they did not leave, the Parish Presidents were told Federal aid, "the Calvary" was coming. This is why may of them stayed

* Brown, the head of FEMA, told reporters that the people were being fed one to two meals a day, in shelters, which is an outright lie

* Both Bush and Brown said that they could not anticipate the levees failing, yet there have been numerous articles in the N-O Times-Picayune, Scientific American and the NY Times all detailed that possibility, if not probability that a hurricane would strike New Orleans. In fact, that was one of 3 likely disasters FEMA detailed, with the others being a massive earthquake in CA and a terrorist attack on NYC.

* Everything that was possible was evacuated and, as Steve Dooner points out, was more effective than the evacuation plans, which estimated 200,000 residents left behind. The ones who were left behind were primarily the elderly, the sick, and those too poor to have a car or buy a ticket out of town.

Blaming the victims of this tragedy, such as the Parish Presidents, is repulsive and you ought to be ashamed of yourself. A better question to ask is why federal response was so slow, why resources were not deployed immediately, one of the key examples is the people on a military base in Mississippi playing basketball while across the street refugees had no food or water. This is another great example of the complete lack of sense being used in the federal government now, the article talks about Navy pilots who were disciplined for saving people http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/07/national/nationalspecial/07navy.html?adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1126072863-wH8ewn9+Jn3MhqdEDLWMXA

Then you have Barbara Bush, the new Marie Antoinette, making these comments that the refugees have it pretty good in Texas:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20050906/cm_thenation/120080

The actions of the federal government in their response to this tragedy can only be described as criminal negligence and it is beyond my comprehension how anyone could not recognize this.

To lighten up the moment, Frank Church presents, "things that make me go arrrrrggggghhhh!!!"

Why all these buddy movies, where a goofy white guy is teamed up with a hipper black tough? Please Lord, I do not need to see any more white guys saying "shizzle my nizzle, dizzle."

I do not want to see another tv commercial, using a great song from the past. Nothing more evil then seeing a Clash song or a Ramones song used to sell beer and soda. It would be nice if the artists didn't sell the songs. Pissers.

The news media needs to quit saying that Bush has resolve or that he sticks to his guns; It is not resolve, it is ignorance; it is not sticking to anything, but fanatical selfishness.

Movies should not be given good reviews for good acting alone. Sure, acting is important, but story is the main thrust to any good movie. I can see good acting on tv, better that movies have great writing. I refuse to sit through another snooze fest, just because the actors put in stellar performances.

What is the big deal about Bobby Short? The fucking guy can't sing. He does Cole Porter and it sounds more like cole slaw. Critics need to quit overrating this guy. He is a pudgy hack, and that is that.

All fantasy books involving swords and knights and dragons should be banned. I do want to get medieval with the next hack who writes one of these idiot books.

Praying over food is stupid. God does not care about your digestion. Pray that the poor are eating, and close your fat trap.

I don't care who the next singer of INXS will be. When the lead singer kills himself, that about does it for the band. The fat idiots in the band actually think that they had something to do with the success of the group. Hutchence was the band, like Jim Morrison was the Doors.

Hitting a child is not discipline, it is hate. You spank or hit a child, you might as well tell him or her that you hate them. Violence is acted on because of hitting kids. Discipline is using your noggin. Kids have to much structure, anyway. Let them be independent minds.

Jay Leno is not a 'talk show,' it is a show, where hack actors and other artists hock their newest travesty. Call it the home shopping channel for low culture. If it was about talk, then you would see interesting people on there, not just people like Paris Hilton, who can't even hold a simple sentence together.

-------------------

Great piece about racism by Tim Wise.

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=72&ItemID=8689

You go, Pete Reeves!

Spread that manure more. It's a bit thin in spots!

Why, O why, didn't they fill out form 11/b26-2?!!

Two days before the Hurricane hit, the feds knew about the state of emergency. Then on August 28th, an expedited emergency was declared.

Mayor Nagin evacualted 80% of his population, leaving 100,000 behind. That's true. However, all evacuation plans estimated 200,000 left behind.

Are tough guy, "Go get 'em" conservative-types now demanding that all paper work be properly filled out when a stage 5 hurricane is coming? What's up with that?

Was that true for Clinton during Hurricane Floyd?

Was that true for President Bush's father when he federalized the National Guard during the L.A. Riots?

It couldn't be that the Republican-run federal governmet, wanting to preserve tax cuts for the rich, has become so tight-fisted that it tried to wish away a major disaster to save money? Could it?

Say, when's Harlan's next audio collection coming out?

To lighten up the moment, Frank Church presents, "things that make me go arrrrrggggghhhh!!!"

Why all these buddy movies, where a goofy white guy is teamed up with a hipper black tough? Please Lord, I do not need to see any more white guys saying "shizzle my nizzle, dizzle."

I do not want to see another tv commercial, using a great song from the past. Nothing more evil then seeing a Clash song or a Ramones song used to sell beer and soda. It would be nice if the artists didn't sell the songs. Pissers.

The news media needs to quit saying that Bush has resolve or that he sticks to his guns; It is not resolve, it is ignorance; it is not sticking to anything, but fanatical selfishness.

Movies should not be given good reviews for good acting alone. Sure, acting is important, but story is the main thrust to any good movie. I can see good acting on tv, better that movies have great writing. I refuse to sit through another snooze fest, just because the actors put in stellar performances.

What is the big deal about Bobby Short? The fucking guy can't sing. He does Cole Porter and it sounds more like cole slaw. Critics need to quit overrating this guy. He is a pudgy hack, and that is that.

All fantasy books involving swords and knights and dragons should be banned. I do want to get medieval with the next hack who writes one of these idiot books.

Praying over food is stupid. God does not care about your digestion. Pray that the poor are eating, and close your fat trap.

I don't care who the next singer of INXS will be, when the lead singer kills himself, that about does it for the band. The fat idiots in the band actually think that they had something to do with the success of the group. Hutchence was the band, like Jim Morrison was the Doors.

Countering Steve's Balancing Act
Why Didn't Louisiana Follow its Required Emergency Plan?

1) Why Didn't Louisiana Follow it's Emergency Plan? Why isn't anyone talking about this?

2) Why hasn't anyone mentioned that a Pre-Requisite for a Federal Response BY LAW is that State Law is Executed and the Emergency Plan is Executed FIRST?

3) Why did the Governor abandon the City of New Orleans for the Safety of Baton Rouge, before the Plan was Executed?

4) Why, when the federal Government was acting in accordance with the Stafford Act, did the State of Louisiana, by its Governors acts, delay making requests when being told this storm was going to hit?

5) Why did Mayor Nagin or Governor Blanco, delay while sleeping on it Saturday night, the Mandatory evacuation spelled out in the Louisiana Emergency Plan? Saturday the Mayor said he may order an evacuation tomorrow. (Sunday)

6) Where were the Parish Presidents who were signatories to the Louisiana Emergency Plan, and why did they fail in its Execution to the plan?

7) In the Parish failure to implement, why didn't the State take over as required by the plan?

8) Why weren't the Hospitals nursing homes, etc. evacuated since the plan required them to do so?

9) Why did the Mandatory evacuation only occur AFTER President Bush called, and why did Governor Blanco stress that it was only after President Bush Called to urging the Evacuation order? Was she concerned for the Citizens, or was she grandstanding so she could blame the President if the Storm didn't hit?

10) Why were the Action Plan implementations required not done by the Local and State Government?

It isn't FEMA's job to plan for complete and total incompetence from First Responders, or to replace them immediately when it turns out that they're incompetent. FEMA clearly states it takes up to 96 hours to respond if disaster strikes.

In addition, Mayor Nagin after reviewing the crisis with Gov. Blanco, Bush summoned Nagin for a private chat - where, according to Nagin, Bush explained: "Mr. Mayor, I offered two options to the governor. I said to her I was ready to move today. The governor said she needed 24 hours to make a decision." Interesting....

A Question About Dance
As there is a minor calm in the pavilion right now…

Lee – if you’re out there – I’ve got a question.

My wife and I watched the road tour of Moving’ Out last night, and I found it very interesting that it appears there are two sets of principals for the show. The four principals we saw last night perform Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday night, and Sunday matinee. The other team performs Wednesday, Friday, Saturday matinee, and Sunday night. They are also doing the same thing with the singer. (There is one individual who sings all the Billy Joel songs.)

My question to you...

Is this a normal practice for dancers in a demanding performance? As a musician, I was a little surprised to see the principal singer was changed. While it is two hours of singing (with a 20 minute break/intermission in the middle) that is nothing more than many singers are required to perform. (Whether that be performing in a bar band or being on a one-night stand tour.) In other words, I didn’t see the singer doing anything challenging enough to warrant this approach. However, with no experience in the dance arena, I did perceive this to be a challenging piece (choreographed by Twyla Tharp). With all that in mind, is this a common practice?

Thanks

Mike

YAHOO joins MICROSOFT and rest of a long and sordid line of US based multinationals helping the Chinese governnment extend its surveillence and control over the Internet.

http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=14884

"The companies say they have to abide by local regulations, and point out that since China is set to be the world's biggest internet market, they cannot ignore it."

And what fool would dare suggest that there might be values more important than the god given right to make as much money as possible with no concern for the consequences?

The Road to Dune
Minor Harlan Sighting:

There is a playful, circa 1960s letter from Harlan to Frank Herbert in the recently released _The Road to Dune_. It can be found on pages 290-291.

BBC Radio 4 Doco-Drama broadcast
BBC Radio 4 is broadcasting my doco-drama, Wimmy Road, on Friday 16th September at 1415 (GMT) in the afternoon play slot.

For those who miss it, it can be heard for seven days after the initial broadcast on: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/arts/afternoonplay.shtml

FAQ

Robert:

Thanks for posting Lisa Moore's e-mail. I realize the narrative is second-hand, but it seems as reliable as many of the stories related in the media, and far more compelling. In it are details that speak to the horror and indignity of the situation, that help us to appreciate the extent of the tragedy. Because fuck this repeating itself.

D.

My Goodness, Eric.

Keep up the thoughtless cynicism, why don't you?

Do you actually believe that the American government can be run no better than it is? Not under the New Deal, not under the Great Society, not under anyone at anytime?

If you believe this, you may have ventured out of cynicism and straight into the realm of the ridiculous.

And those of you interested in a balanced discussion, here's a little timeline for you all:

August 26th -Governor Blanco orders a State of Emergency
-Bush stays on vacation

August 28th -Governor Blanco orders an "expidited emergency" in response to an assumed Stage 5 Hurricane.
-Mayor Nagin evacuates 80% of the New Orleans' Population.
-Bush continues his vacation

August 29th -Hurricane Katrina hits
-Bush still on vacation

August 30th -Levees swell and burst
-Bush plays guitar, gets in some golf
-Brown, Chertoff and FEMA fail to take seriously governor's request for fourth straight day.

August 31st -People start dying and drowning
-Bush does a flyby at 2,000 feet

Early September -Karl Rove begins a media campaign designed to convince people its all the local official's fault.
-Some people across America, and even in the Webderland Pavilion, buy it wholesale. There is, apparently, a sucker born every millisecond.

Now balance away. I'm sure this will be good.

Steve Dooner

"Certainly if John Kerry was in office the only thing we'd be rescuing out of New Orleans would be treed cats."

Hopefully, my rejoinder to this dorky presumption will not produce a thread; it's too lame a detour.

Since Kerry was going to use Clinton's former agenda, and since that agenda stayed on top of the funding for things like FEMA, it is easy to figure this would not have been the disaster we've seen. Having made THAT conjecture, I think the situation would be better under almost ANYONE else's watch.

I can offer THIS with certainty: my life was doing better when Clinton was running the show, WHATEVER my misgivings about some of his decisions (like NAFTA).

I'm not a big fan of humanity myself, but I think Eric's was a stupid generalization.

>Better get used to it, until this monster, Bush is gone. <

Somehow I don't think that Bush's departure is going to change things much...humanity being what it is. But it's mighty easy to blame everything on one individual. Simple minds seek simple truths.

Certainly if John Kerry was in office the only thing we'd be rescuing out of New Orleans would be treed cats. Democracy, hell. A government of the people, with thousands of elected and appointed comrades, bullocks. Shared responsiblity, nuts.

We are all just a twisted dream in George Bush's pretzel-choked mind. Pawns on the Halliburton chessboard.

A Sound Of Thunder
I know it's off topic but I know that Harlan and Bradbury are friends and that I can assume that the people on this board are Bradbury fans as well but does anyone know what Bradbury thought of the movie? I saw it last night and it was not as awful as 99% of the reviews I read but they really seemed to deviate from the original story and I am curious if Bradbury stands behind the movie or if he prefers the old Ray Bradbury Theater episode adaptation...

Thanks for that, whatever that was. ;)

Bob Denver
(GASP) "DEATH!" Like, farewell, Maynard....

Marie Antoinette moment
Found the following five paragraphs in my e-mailbox this afternoon. Why do they fail, somehow, to take me by surprise?

* * *

Former first lady and mother to President Bush said Monday that evacuees from New Orleans have found a home in Houston.

"Almost everyone I’ve talked to says we're going to move to Houston," Barbara Bush told NPR.

"What I’m hearing is they all want to stay in Texas. Everyone is so overwhelmed by the hospitality.

"And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway, so this --this is working very well for them."

Editor & Publisher notes the former First Lady's remarks were aired this evening on National Public Radio's "Marketplace" program.

Goodbye Gilligan.

- Actor Bob Denver, 70, of TV's "Gilligan's Island" fame has died, his agent tells The Associated Press.

Steve Barber,


Your post was rather half and half. The first half had so much spin on it that it was making me (the patriotic American) ill, so I hopped off. Then there was the much more reasonable second part. Nice job.

I'm just trying to introduce some contrary opinions, that's all. No, Bush isn't perfect. But neither is Cindy Sheehan.

You probably missed it in your casual glance, but that blogger's website also has links to the sites of fourteen writers most commonly associated with the left, plus a list of six more liberal blogs. There's some good writers there, especially Chris Hitchens, who is sort of left and right.

P.S. Enjoyed your website, love Steve Perry (the singer).

New Orleans
All -
Cookie's note expressing her grief but being unable to express it artistically to everyone on this board got me thinking. I have added a page to my website which you are all invited to view. They ain't necessarily my portfolio shots -- but they ARE the essence of my love of the French Quarter, and also of greater New Orleans. Sadly, I was never able to visit and record those areas outside the city which have been so sadly destroyed as well.

http://mysite.verizon.net/res7n0zi/id8.html

Steve

That was the most horrifying thing I have ever read. Robert, could you somehow contact that woman, so that she could go to the media with that report? If the corporate press won't take it, then have her go to Democracy Now or Air America, anywhere. That kind of hard truth has to see the light of day. I can smell the shit, as you write.

------------

Stan, remember, this is the government of the free market. The people who couldn't leave New Orleans have themselves to blame; that's what they get for not being responsible, or not saving money or playing the stock market game. This is Social Darwinism, shoveled hot and heavy, as a steaming pile of fetid shit. Better get used to it, until this monster, Bush is gone.

This was fowarded to me from Samuel R. Delany - Lisa C. Moore is a friend of his and the former editor of the Lambda Book Report ...

From: Lisa Moore
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 10:13 AM
Subject: a survivor's story: Katrina in New Orleans

i heard from my aunt last night that my cousin Denise made it out of New Orleans; she's at her brother's in Baton Rouge. from what she told me: her mother, a licensed practical nurse, was called in to work on Sunday night at Memorial Hospital (historically known as Baptist Hospital to those of us from N.O.). Denise decided to stay with her mother, her niece and grandniece (who is 2 years old); she figured they'd be safe at the hospital. they went to Baptist, and had to wait hours to be assigned a room to sleep in; after they were finally assigned a room,two white nurses suddenly arrived after the cut-off time (time to be assigned a room), and Denise and her family were booted out; their room was given up to the new nurses. Denise was furious, and rather than stay at Baptist, decided to walk home (several blocks away )to ride out the storm at her mother's apartment. her mother stayed at the hospital.

she described it as the scariest time in her life. 3 of the rooms in the apartment (there are only 4) caved in. ceilings caved in, walls caved in. she huddled under a mattress in the hall. she thought she would die from either the storm or a heart attack. after the storm passed, she went back to Baptist to seek shelter (this was Monday). it was also scary at Baptist; the electricity was out, they were running on generators, there was no air conditioning. Tuesday the levees broke, and water began rising. they moved patients upstairs, saw boats pass by on what used to be streets. they were told that they would be evacuated, that buses were coming. then they were told they would have to walk to the nearest intersection, Napoleon and S. Claiborne, to await the buses. they waded out in hip-deep water, only to stand at the intersection, on the neutral ground (what y'all call the median) for 3 1/2 hours. the buses came and took them to the Ernest Morial Convention Center. (yes, the convention center you've all seen on TV.)

Denise said she thought she was in hell. they were there for 2 days, with no water, no food. no shelter. Denise, her mother (63 years old), her niece (21 years old), and 2-year-old grandniece. when they arrived, there were already thousands of people there. they were told that buses were coming. police drove by, windows rolled up, thumbs up signs. national guard trucks rolled by, completely empty, soldiers with guns cocked and aimed at them. nobody stopped to drop off water. a helicopter dropped a load of water, but all the bottles exploded on impact due to the height of the helicopter.

the first day (Wednesday) 4 people died next to her. the second day (Thursday) 6 people died next to her. Denise told me the people around her all thought they had been sent there to die. again, nobody stopped. the only buses that came were full; they dropped off more and more people, but nobody was being picked up and taken away. they found out that those being dropped off had been rescued from rooftops and attics; they got off the buses delirious from lack of water and food. completely dehydrated. the crowd tried to keep them all in one area; Denise said the new arrivals had mostly lost their minds. they had gone crazy.

inside the convention center, the place was one huge bathroom. in order to shit, you had to stand in other people's shit. the floors were black and slick with shit. most people stayed outside because the smell was so bad. but outside wasn't much better: between the heat, the humidity, the lack of water, the old and very young dying from dehydration... and there was no place to lay down, not even room on the sidewalk. they slept outside Wednesday night, under an overpass.

Denise said yes, there were young men with guns there.but they organized the crowd. they went to Canal Street and "looted," and brought back food and water for the old people and the babies, because nobody had eaten in days. when the police rolled down windows and yelled out "the buses are coming," the young men with guns organized the crowd in order: old people in front, women and children next, men in the back. just so that when the buses came, there would be priorities of who got out first.

Denise said the fights she saw between the young men with guns were fist fights. she saw them put their guns down and fight rather than shoot up the crowd. but she said that there were a handful of people shot in the convention center; their bodies were left inside, along with other dead babies and old people.

Denise said the people thought there were being sent there to die. lots of people being dropped off, nobody being picked up. cops passing by, speeding off. national guard rolling by with guns aimed at them. and yes, a few men shot at the police, because at a certain point all the people thought the cops were coming to hurt them, to kill them all. she saw a young man who had stolen a car speed past, cops in pursuit; he crashed the car, got out and ran, and the cops shot him in the back. in front of the whole crowd. she saw many groups of people decide that they were going to walk across the bridge to the west bank, and those same groups would return, saying that they were met at the top of the bridge by armed police ordering them to turn around, that they weren't allowed to leave.

so they all believed they were sent there to die.

Denise's niece found a pay phone, and kept trying to call her mother's boyfriend in Baton Rouge, and finally got through and told him where they were. the boyfriend, and Denise's brother, drove down from Baton Rouge and came and got them. they had to bribe a few cops, and talk a few into letting them into the city ("come on, man, my 2-year-old niece is at the Convention Center!"), then they took back roads to get to them.

after arriving at my other cousin's apartment in Baton Rouge, they saw the images on TV, and couldn't believe how the media was portraying the people of New Orleans. she kept repeating to me on the phone last night: make sure you tell everybody that they left us there to die. nobody came. those young men with guns were protecting us. if it wasn't for them, we wouldn't have had the little water and food they had found.

that's Denise Moore's story.

Lisa C. Moore

This is the fourth time I've tried to write something about New Orleans and the fourth time that I just can't put into words what grief I feel. There's all kinds of music, but I can't sing to you here. "Do You Know What It Means to Miss New Orleans?" I've missed it my whole life and now I'll miss it forever. I'd sing a little-known tune called "Mobile," but printing the lyric (which I learned from a Clancy Hayes recording) would probably violate the letter of copyright law. If you want to look it up, the first line is "They saw a swallow building his nest...". I found exactly one Internet posting of it.

This is a dissonant unnerving chord. It can only become meaningful if it can be creatively resolved. New Orleans will never be the same, but it will rise again.

Back again...(long)
after a week camping in the NV desert with my leftist/religionist "Burner" friend John/Jonnyjet at Burning Man. It's indescribable: different things to different people, including ritual, spiritual experience, monster-size folk art exhibit, madhouse, orgy....John's "thing" is sitting in front of a van, camping in a tepee, and giving away books (classic literature/philosophy, plus some "trashy" sf like Dr Who novelizations etc which were thrown on the pyre if not given away!) we had the "451 Bookmobile" (as in a certain Bradbury story) if it were me i would have had the things recycled/pulped maybe, not burned, but it's part of their culture.

The people you meet are really friendly, if weird. Ultra-weird - just this big release for one week a year. Fake-fur costumes, *men* in long hippie skirts, total nudity if one preferred (about 1 percent went around nude maybe and i think they were more likely fulltime nudists) BICYCLES all over - (festooned with fake-fur, fake flowers and glowsticks and electroluminescent wire at night) and 40,000 people; too big to take in all at once....you can't even see everything. But then Worldcon is bigger than it used to be too.

OMG I don't know what I can add about the horror of the hurricane. Unimaginable - but this was PREDICTED by scientists as a disaster scenario. (Imagine being Cassandra in a situation like this...) It was KNOWN those levees could go, that thousands were at risk, that a whole city could be left uninhabitable....and to one helping of Mother Nature of course we add 100 helpings of human stupidity!!! And Kanye West's words...they were bleeped in the California feed but broadcast on NPR and other outlets: "George W Bush does not care about black people."

Well, I'd say more "poor people," but the economic disparity is indeed drawn along racial lines. THat's a larger issue that goes back decades, of course.

John seemed almost overjoyed. Understand: I am liberal (detest Dubya) but I don't buy into the ultra-left anarchist thing (he reads a lot of Noam Chomsky and stuff about the Spanish Civil War) Something between, "Now they KNOW It's dangerous to live there" and "Whoopee, the revolution's come, Bush will be thrown out of office for this!" (Fat chance! you wish) I dunno, I can't see disasters as anything but horrible.

Most of us live in harm's way. I know the Bay Area is at risk of a Big One. John also gloats about living in San Jose (which has its own aquifiers) instead of Los Angeles (which is dependent on a vulnerable aqueduct system that crosses many faults.) OR even San Francisco where Hetch Hetchy needs a lot of seismic reinforcement....He says, "There's only enough natural water there for 100 households. When the aqueducts break they'll all have to GET OUT OF THERE!" (Not to mention the loss of life from a quake itself.)

The NO disaster makes me pessimistic about avoiding others. We're not preparing fast enough and not devoting enough resources to improving infrastructure and averting INEVITABLE "natural" catastrophes. The earth will shake and the wind will blow, but we determine its impact upon us.

Harlan: I went to the Real Dukes of Dixieland page (www.thedukesofdixieland.com). Deano (I think that IS Antonio Dean) is safe. in case you don't remember - he is the one who made the CD I gave to you (even though Finderdoug got you the LP of the same recordings soon after.) You might want to drop the guy a thank-you/take-care note yourself if you haven't already.


Been reading: THE END OF FAITH by Sam Harris - should probably take this to the other board, but for Harlan and all atheists/rationalists out there I'd recommend it. A very powerful indictment of even "moderate" religion. Harris is both a philosopher (Stanford professor) and neuroscientist (working on his PhD.) Oddly enough it was a book John got from HIS parents...and it disses Noam Chomsky too....far-leftism (or far rightism) is a secular religion of sorts.

Gotta get to dinner - lots to catch up on here.

Kristin

The Supremes u.s.w.
Yes, there's a precedent for naming a Chief Justice who hasn't been a Justice before. In fact, many Justices, including Chief Justices, weren't even judges when they were named. Chief Justice Earl Warren was the Governor of California before being named Chief by Eisenhower, for example. Eisenhower thought Warren a conservative. Warren is virtually the template for the "you never know how they'll come out, once they're approved by the Senate" cliche we hear every time anyone expresses concern about a Justice's apparent biases.

And maybe that's why Presidents tend to stick more to practicing lawyers and judges now.

Am I the only person who finds Bush's haste to name Roberts to Renquist's position more than a little unseemly? He wasn't my favorite Justice, heaven knows, but isn't a moment or two or mourning called for, especially from an idealogical ally like GWB? Or are we all too worn out by the tragedy in New Orleans, and numb to such things?

"We had all better wakeup from our dreams of invincibility...we are not invincible and if we do not do something...as a nation....to correct this by setting aside our political, ethnic and stubborn differences and indifference....it will not matter if we have a Constitution, a Bill of Rights or even a political structure...this nation will be in deep shit...terrible shit and it will affect us all."

Bold words, but, I'm afraid, blindly Idealistic and not rooted in reality. Strategy is formulated by political policy. It's where assesment and decision are made. It's what led to FETA being cut, so that we could have a war in Iraq (Bush having pulled out inspectors before they could confirm ANYTHING) and still keep our wealthy contingent happy with deep tax cuts despite such urgent times, leading to the disaster (thereby displaying our national "weaknesses" to enemies by ANY definition, specifically, shooting ourselves in the foot). The only process by which we imbed ourselves or extract ourselves from "deep shit" as a nation is through political policy. It is therefore simplistic and naive and specious to argue, "forget the politics". Many of those who voted for Bush, many of those who didn't vote at ALL, DID forget the politics. Now look where we are. As if we weren't predicting outcomes like this in 2001.

Now, compounding the situation, we've 3 new conservative justices appointed. 3 new justices to help administer the kind of dirty Conservative agenda that has benefitted the rich at the expense of the poor, like those in N.O., stygmatizing those of lesser economic advantage as useless, lazy leeches, leading to the indifference we saw finally erupt in N.O. at its max. That's the pattern: allow class rifts to widen, producing indifference and detachment from one another (hence, "the 2 Americas"), and you eventually, get things like mass riots, hate and retribution, and dysfunctional criminal justice system,absolved white collar crimes...or massive tragedies on the scale we just saw in Louisiana.

It's fine to put up a banner to say, "let's stop being political". But we got INTO this mess by the political process, and it's the only tool that's going to get us out. Policy: that's what will find the solutions to deal with terrorism, OR bring us to our knees by miscalculation. It is the inherent policy of the Republican party to represent the interests of the wealthy, assume the private sector can handle everything (and I've noticed lately how bad services in the private sector have become with businesses that seem to be doing so well they no longer care), leave those at the bottom to essentially fend for themselves (or, ostensibly, leaving the churches to do that job; you tell me how THEY'D have handled the N.O. situation). What you've seen is the RESULT of Conservative policy. So, if you vote Republican, and you don't like what you'reted him as nominee for Chief Justice. Is this normal? Is there precedent for nominating a person for Chief Justice of the Supreme Court who has not yet served on that Court? This whole situation seems strange to me. I can't wait to see if Georgie is going to name ANOTHER conservative, white male for O'Conner's seat, or if he's going to at least try to give the appearance of having some sensitivity.

Thanky kindly
Chuck, I am grateful for the welcome and shall endeavor to prove myself worthy of it. Harlan, the joke is up to your usual high standards, rating a BWAH-HA! on my Yuk-O-Meter. Probably kept me from bursting an all-important blood vessel as I contemplated, on the one hand, scenes of devastation and horror from the Gulf Coast and, on the other, the miserable excuses being advanced for the miserable failures of George W. Bush, FEMA, Homeland Security, etc. Despicable spinmeisters are already in overdrive trying, as the memorable phrase goes, to "put a shine on the turd." It's almost enough to make me, an atheist, hope there's a Hell, even I'd probably have to spend eternity dealing with telemarketers and searching in vain for something worth reading in an infinite pile of back issues of PEOPLE Magazine and books by Ann Coulter; I figure I'd still rate a berth in a higher circle of perdition than Certain Parties. I don't just mean the human monster(s) who conceived the pop-up, either.

My 2 Cents (or, 1/150th of a gallon of gasoline)
Dave - You present a very right-wing blogger as a launching point for a balanced opinion.

A casual glance to the right side column of this blogger's website gives you such balance as "The Left’s Campaign of Lies and Distortion Knows No Shame", "Cindy Sheehan: Clueless in Crawford", and the ultra-balanced essay topics of "Conservative Hipster"; "Conservative Life"; "Dissecting Leftism"; and "Exile From Hillary's Village".

The article itself is nothing less than an attempt to deflect any responsiblity from the President and lay it at the feet of the unpatriotic, incompetent and all-encompassingly evil "Democrats". Bush isn't to blame, he's a wondrous and godlike leader.

As a patriotic American, I may be sick.

Most of all, I'm bothered by the immediate wave of fending away blame -- and this goes for all sides, not just FEMA. I shudder to think what would have happened had this been a terrorist attack -- a biological attack on Chicago, the fireballing of San Diego, or poisonous gas let loose on the subways of Manhattan. Or a tsunami hitting the eastern seaboard. Or Yellowstone erupting. Or, or, or.

The truth of the matter is that thousands of people were left to suffer and die while bureacratic wheels struggled to life. The states' and federal response teams were woefully inadequate and disorganized. The world's most powerful nation dropped to its knees by handwringing, paperwork and internal arguing about who's at fault. Thousands die and hundreds of thousands suffer as a result.

In the Navy it's the Captain who ultimately pays the price -- and in this country it's the President and Governors who are ultimately in charge.

Embarrassing, humiliating, petty and downright unforgivable. America is lessened in the process.

http://mensnewsdaily.com/blog/malven/

Are these things true? I didn't hear about any of this on the Katrina coverage of MSNBC or CNN or FOX.

Some of the information in that piece(and the information in the articles from page links next to the piece)is very interesting and valuable, at least as a launching point for those who wish have a balanced opinion.

STAN IN BEAVERTON:

Amen, brother.

Harlan

I can't stop weeping this weekend.
The tragedy in New Orleans and Mississippi weighs heavily on me.
Natural disasters cannot be avoided, merely ameliorated.
I feel our government has failed the people of New Orleans and Mississippi.
I feel our government has failed us all.

I grew up reading Superman comics and watching the Superman television show.
"Truth, Justice, and the American Way" means something to me.
Is the American Way still a viable ideal to strive for?
Or have I been living in a fantasy world all my life?

Jim Davis wrote:
"spend money like Paris Hilton in the condom aisle of her local drugstore"

Thanks for the laugh, Jim. It helped.

IN DEEP
TO STEVE....It doesn't matter anymore. The only reality you,I and the rest of this country must know is....Katrina has taken us out of the sewer and dumped us all in a hole of deep shit.
I have made it quite clear that I am conservative....and a card carrying Republican. But of late, I getting further away from hard line conservatisim and leaning more to middle of the road in my political views...I will stay Republican, because that is the only way I can vote in both of the electioneering process in this country. But if push comes to shove and we keep sinking in this shithole that all elected, appointed and self-proclaiming bureaucrats have put us all in these days....I may be Republican but I will always be ready to vote for the ones I believe will keep us American...keep us safe....and keep us free. What has happened in the recent past few days, is the perfect blueprint for our enemies, within and beyond our borders to exercise more terrorism. What has happened in the South and especially to New Orleans will show them that we are vunerable...and in our most active state....the circus in Washington, in our state capitols and in our political machinery in our cities and towns. We had all better wakeup from our dreams of invincibility...we are not invincible and if we do not do something...as a nation....to correct this by setting aside our political, ethnic and stubborn differences and indifference....it will not matter if we have a Constitution, a Bill of Rights or even a political structure...this nation will be in deep shit...terrible shit and it will affect us all.

Well, this is probably going to look like sucking up, etc. but Steven Utley, you can have the couch or whatever. Come freely, go safely. And leave some of the joy you bring here to us.

Besides, there are too many people getting reality checks these days.

Chuck

REPLY TO STEVEN UTLEY

Hey, old friend:

So this large brown bear, and this small pink'n'white bunny rabbit, pause together in the forest to, uh, relieve themselves. And as they stand there, side-by-side, the large brown bear clears his throat awkwardly, and in a Sheldon Leonard cum Ring Lardner voice he sez to the rabbit, "Uh, parm me, sir, I uh do not wish to intrude upon your toilette, but may I impose upon you to inquire...er...when you, uh, 'do your business,' do you find that, ahem, that uh...'poop' sticks to yer fur?" The rabbit is dumbfounded by the impertinence of this query, and in a piping voice of outrage replies, "NO! Of course not, absolutely!"

"That is splendid, jus' splendid," sez the bear, picks up the rabbit, and wipes his ass with him.

For old times, Steve,

Buck up, it'll soon be over.

Yr. pal, Harlan

Alan,
Sorry!
kiss,
:)
Cindy

The Dining Pavilion has become practically my last refuge. Perhaps I'm just becoming cantankerous(er) as I get older (though I'm not a patch on Harlan), but during the past week I've disgustedly bid adieu to two message boards I had till recently enjoyed frequenting. Last week I found myself with bruised fanboy sensibilities on my conscience. Today, it was the almost gleeful vigilante mentality too many other posters exhibited toward looters in New Orleans that put me off; looting, I said, was a worrisome consequence of catastrophe, but I was (am) much more worried by the short-sightedness, fuck-knuckled incompetence, and casual disregard of public officials, etc., etc.; I was advised to get a reality check, etc., etc., etc. Well, anyway, here I am. You folks are all I've got left. Anybody sleeping on the sofa?

"What Harlan said. I'd also point out that most of the musicians listed, hardly millionares or household names, probably ARE teachers, librarians, or single parents working two jobs to keep their kids fed. Being a musician and being a working stiff are not mutually exclusive conditions."

I know these people aren't rich or household names. I never said they were. Nor did I ever say that their income was part of the issue.

I didn't mean to be out of line, Harlan and the superfans who post here, I just wanted to suggest that every single tale of survival should be considered a bright spot. And I didn't type that message clearly. I hope that clears that up and we can forget about it.

On another note: did you know that both United Airlines and Delta left their employees behind during the evac? Together the 2 companies flew out 8 planes...all empty.

Southwest Airlines flew out their employees. And they offered seats to UA and Delta workers as well; but those seats weren't free.....$50 a pop.

I wonder why there was no national evacuation program, with buses and trains getting people out in an orderly fashion. Why this free-for-all that left old people and poor people to fend for themselves?

This is what happens when most of the National Guard are shipped off to Iraq. . .

At least my friend Matt and his family are safe.

-Steve E.

"Careful, Todd. The next step here is to suggest people take a bit of responsibility for themselves. In that way lies serious castigation, by many here who equate a call for self-reliance with a non-caring attitude towards those who suffer.

Blame is fun, especially blaming entities that one has no control over. It takes away the expectation that one should actually do something...rather than just pose down on a chat board."

You know, Eric, the reason so many here have problems with you is that you make these straw man arguments, while indulging in this self-pitying attitude of "It's brutal to be the only truth-teller on this board." As far as I'm aware, no one has said that people shouldn't take responsibility for themselves. Indeed, you could say that everyone in N.O. who survived Katrina DID, from the thousands who made the dangerous trek to the Superdome, to the eighteen-year old kid who comandeered a bus and drove a hundred folks to safety in Houston, to the "looters" who took the initiative and grabbed what they needed from local stores, to all the refugees of this goddamned mess who are going to have to work like hell to rebuild their lives. (Of course, if you're still making the argument that the approximately 100,000 N.O. residents who didn't own a car should've evacuated by foot, well, grab a map and see where they would've ended up with the time they had: the town of Slidell, which was pulverized. I rest my case.)

All I'm saying is that the politicians in charge of preparing N.O. for a disaster like this should've taken some responsibility themselves--and I'm not only talking about the Bush administration. A fuck-up this bad takes more than the malfeasance of that merry band of nitwit solipsists currently occupying the White House. Federal, state and local officals all had a failure of nerve, foresight and imagination spanning over DECADES, and there's barely a damned one of them who can hold their head up high today. Shame on them all.

The only good thing to come out of this? Maybe officials will finally realize that an ounce of prevention outweighs a pound of cure, and work like hummingbirds on crystal meth to complete disaster preparedness across the country, be it San Francisco (number 3 on that FEMA list of impending calamities), the DHS (which failed its first test bigtime), or wherever. And when New Orleans is rebuilt--and mark my words, it will be--I plan to go down there and spend money like Paris Hilton in the condom aisle of her local drugstore. I hope everyone reading this does the same.

NATHAN: What Harlan said. I'd also point out that most of the musicians listed, hardly millionares or household names, probably ARE teachers, librarians, or single parents working two jobs to keep their kids fed. Being a musician and being a working stiff are not mutually exclusive conditions. Also, I thought it showed the importantance of music to New Orleans, and how vital it is to the nation's culture that the jazz, blues, rock, zydeco and hip-hop of this great city survives another day. Again, no one's saying that a musician's life is any more important than a non-musician's; but with a catastrophe this large, there's a cultural dimension to New Orlean's loss that deserves notice, as well as the more obvious physical one. (By the way, it looks like Fats Domino is among the missing again. He was photographed being rescued from a rooftop on Monday, but hasn't been heard from since. Here's hoping The Fat Man made it out of New Orleans alive.)

And to end on a lighter note, here's something I saw spray-painted on a N.O. home:

LOOTERS BEWARE

I HAVE A SHOTGUN

A CLAWHAMMER

AND A UGLY WOMAN

Selah, folks. Keep safe and dry.

Robert Morales

Hilarious. A much-needed spate of laughter (and I did guffaw loudly.)

Mike

>Let's have a bit of local responsibility and stop blaming everything on the Fed<

Careful, Todd. The next step here is to suggest people take a bit of responsibility for themselves. In that way lies serious castigation, by many here who equate a call for self-reliance with a non-caring attitude towards those who suffer.

Blame is fun, especially blaming entities that one has no control over. It takes away the expectation that one should actually do something...rather than just pose down on a chat board.

Harlan - in the Masters of Fantasy documentary that aired on the SCIFI Channel, the opening shot of your episode showed you typing on an Olympia Standard SG model. Out of curiosity, was that one of the typewriters that Robert Bloch gave you?

Taking a light-hearted diversion from the justly somber postings of this week, I am

Your Friend,
Mark W.

Found Poppy Online
Harlan requested word of Poppy. She has an online journal here.

http://www.livejournal.com/users/docbrite/

So, he should email her, if he knows how to do that.

A legal excerpt here:

Thursday, September 1st, 2005
5:12 pm
P.S.
I'm still here at the wireless place trying to handle as much business as I can, and had thought to thank everyone who sent donations to the Cats fund, but quickly realized that I would be here all night. So thank you all, a million times thanks. I don't have the intestinal fortitude to look at those pictures right now, but if you want to donate, go to my website and click on the Cats link.

I can't eat anything but Saltines. I have lost 12 pounds since Sunday.

Hopefully-apocryphal tale from New Orleans: A woman's husband died on the bridge while they were trying to evacuate. Several policemen passed her by as she tried to get help. The one who finally stopped told her, "You gonna have to move this dead body before it starts to smell."

I really could have done without hearing that even if it's not true.

{Edit: Lest anyone misunderstood my earlier post, I only meant I would refund payments for eBay purchases, since I have no idea if the items still exist or whether I will ever be able to send them. We are incredibly grateful for your donations and happy to accept them.]
4:35 pm
Hell
Or the closest thing I have ever known.

No word on our house or cats. The situation in New Orleans is dire, what's left of us. People are trying to help with the animals, and God bless them, but I don't know if any of them will be able to get in -- we hear they're letting almost no one in -- and I've already given up so much of my hope. Last night I had the first dream of being home, of seeing their faces. Thank God for our nurse friend who lives near my mother; if not for the array of pharmaceuticals she has been handing out, I believe I would have run outside and grabbed one of those live wires the PSAs are always telling you not to touch.

We're currently without power; I'm writing this at a wireless cafe in Jackson, where we came to make a supply run. I can't possibly answer the volume of e-mail I've received, so I will have to hope everyone is reading this. If you have purchased anything from my outstanding eBay auctions, please know that I have no idea whether the items still exist and no way of sending them to you. If you have paid via Paypal, I will refund your money ASAP. If you sent a check, please stop payment. If you sent a money order, I will attempt to return it to you if and when I can.

Please pray for us.

Harlan...

I actually LIKE Stephen Boyd...within his limits.

He was, after all, a splendid scum-bag as Messala in BEN-HUR, and I liked his defiant presence on the doomed lifeboat in the Tyrone Power vehicle ABANDON SHIP (aka, SOULS AT SEA). I also thought his affable square jaw aligned nicely with Raquel Welch's figure in FANTASTIC VOYAGE.

And, hey, he was better than a stoic contract player like, say, John Gavin (Sam Loomis in PSYCHO and Ceasar in SPARTACUS).

Needless to say, of course, this is a different caliber from the material you had ready for THE OSCAR, and whoever was comatose enough to have missed a casting opportunity like Steve Mc Queen and Peter Falk...well, I can SEE why you got into the habit of brutalizing CEOs.

...jeezus, you played POOL with DR. ZHIVAGO?????

Duane---I think you don't understand. THERE ARE NO RESOURCES LEFT IN NEW ORLEANS. It's all under water. Police cars cannot go anywhere because the roads are under water. Electricity is out, maybe for weeks. Clean water is not available. There are still people who need rescuing. There are still bodies to be found and properly cared for. The task must be akin to trying to shovel snow during an avalanche.

Todd---The building of the levees is the responsibility of the federal government. Yhe U. S. Army Corps of Engineers must do the planning and the work. Their funding has been slashed. Even if New Orleans raised a tax to help pay for the work, there wouldn't be any additional work performed, because the federal government controls what they work on. The money that New Orleans could have raised probably would have been spent in Iraq.

Cindy---Love ya like a sister, but the length of your post made my head explode.

Above and among the fray
Sometimes I just want to hang my head and wail. Two items worth reading:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/04/opinion/04rice.html?ei=5090&en=ce2f33f8719dba9c&ex=1283486400&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article310186.ece

When the President appears to suck ass, don't count on the homegrown news to tell you so. The death toll will undoubtably dwarf the 911 numbers, I just hope they are not forgotten just because they have brown skin, made less than $20,000 a year, or (shudder) may have voted Democratic. And yes, they could have been musicians too, with all the above traits.

Frank

that refugee diatribe is the single dumbest thing you've ever posted here.

thimk,
Neal

105 years later and, sadly, human beings haven't changed much.

The Galveston Hurricane of 1900
Looters found despoiling the dead were summarily executed by the militia - stood against the nearest wall or pile of debris and shot without the hindrance of a trial. The same brutal justice was delivered to amateur photographers. “Word received from Galveston today indicates that Kodak fiends are being shot down like thieves. Two, it is stated, were killed yesterday while taking pictures of nude female bodies.”

— Dallas News, September 14, 1900.

NATHAN:

Stop it. You're out of line, way out of line.

No one said any one group is more deserving of survival than any other. No one said there isn't precisely as much compassion and aid due working mothers than 80-year-old jazzmen. No one wailed for one group to the exclusion of any other.

It was a simple exposition of a ray of light.

Back off. Your post is imprudent.

Harlan

Do you notice, they are calling the people stuck in New Orleans, "refugees." Isn't that a term for people who are not citizens of the country of origin? Doesn't the media see this error of judgement? I never heard the term refugee used after a hurricane. The subtle racism is this is obvious.

I give it up to Kanye West, who took a chance on MSNBC last night and blurted out, "President Bush doesn't care about black people." Kanye, not a big fan of your rapping, but good going. First he is critical of the homophobia in the black community and now this. Nothing that helps us more than honest artists, who are bold enough to speak truth.

-------

Rich, are you saying the story isn't true? Can you prove it? No, I didn't see anything in the media about the shoot to kill order.

--------------

Cindy, you and the pro-war people have been made to eat dust, you must realize this by now? First, the war was illegal, against international law and the Constitutional call for a war resolution. Even if the war was morally justified, just this fact makes the war immoral.

Because of lack of body armor and vehicle armor and small troop deployment and overall planning many soldiers died, that may have been saved. No excuse for this, not to mention the dead and dying civilians.

Bush lied about the reasons for war, based on the Downing Street Minutes. And the war itself was fought so badly that military people resigned in protest.

Bush doesn't care about democracy or freedom, he wants to have hegemony in the middle east and control of the oil. His love of freedom here is obvious; this is the most secretive President in history.

The Muslim state that is the new Iraq, where woman will have less rights (even under Saddam) and civil war is almost a given.

Cindy, dove, you better come to our side, we are on the side of the angels.

"A few bright spots

From www.gumbopages.com, a list of New Orleans musicians confirmed to be safe....."

Do these people somehow matter more becuase they play an instrument? Hundreds, maybe thousands dead...but hey atleast the musicians got out alive.

Its kind of sick.

Where's the list of teachers and librarians, or single moms who worked 2 jobs to keep their kids fed? I just hate it when at times of disaster people worry a little bit more about how those in the entertainment field are doing.

Cindy,

My bad...

I was not implying that you (or Sue, for that matter) were smearing Mrs. Sheehan. What I should have said was;
"The right wing propaganda machine's smearing of Cindy Sheehan..."

Sorry 'bout that.

-Andrew

A few bright spots

From www.gumbopages.com, a list of New Orleans musicians confirmed to be safe: Steve Allen, Theresa Andersson, James "Satchmo of the Ghetto" Andrews, Troy "Trombone Shorty" Andrews, Marcia Ball, Harold Battiste, Russell Batiste, Better Than Ezra, Terrance Blanchard, Eddie Bo (plus sister Veronica and his band), Bonerama, John Boutté, Clarence "Gatemouth" Brown, Henry Butler, Jon Cleary, Cowboy Mouth, Davell Crawford, Dash Rip Rock, Dirty Dozen Brass Band, Fats Domino, Snooks Eaglin (and family of 12, now homeless), Jack Fine (of the Palmetto Bug Stompers), Derrick Freeman, Galactic, Tim Green, John "Papa" Gros, Corey Harris, Leigh Harris, Clarence "Frogman" Henry, Corey Henry, The Iguanas, Benny Jones Sr., Kirk Joseph, Tim Laughlin, Bryan Lee, Lil' Rascals Brass Band, Eric Lindell, Jason Marsalis, Irvin Mayfield, Tom McDermott, Humberto "Pupi" Menez (and aunt Caridad Delatorre), The Neville Brothers, Charmaine Neville, Ivan Neville, Anders Osborne, Dave Pirner, George Porter Jr., The Radiators, Rebirth Brass Band (all members), Marcus Roberts, Coco Robicheaux, Biff Rose, Wanda Rouzan, Kermit Ruffins, Mark Samuels (Pres., Basin Street Records), Ben Sandmel, Mem Shannon and the Membership, Derek Shezbie, Michael Skinkus, Brian Stoltz, Bill Summers, Irma Thomas, Allen Toussaint, Dr. Michael White.

(Still missing: Antoinette K-Doe, Troy Andrews and James Andrews and their families, and Alex Chilton.)

HARLAN: When you speak to Poppy again (and who knows when that'll be), be sure to tell her the restaurant Marisol is undamaged, and its chef and owner Pete Vasquez appears to be okay, too. He's in New Orleans, and his home phone still works, so she should give him a ring, if she hasn't done so already. Also, Thomas Roche recently spoke to O'Neil & Debb De Noux, and they're okay and staying in Baton Rouge. (Go to: http://www.livejournal.com/users/thomasroche/112608.html)

POTUS and FEMA
***Cindy*** You're right. That was a really sloppy sentence. I should have been much more clear. It was - and remains - the President of the United States of America that I was accusing of being insensitive and sociopathic. I also called him a dry drunk and a mental feeb but those were other posts. Clearly your mileage varies.

As for Saddam's removal being ample justification for the spilling of so much blood, that's all well and good as long as we both understand that was never the pretext for saddling up in the first place. Now, in the guise of democracy building, we have set the stage for a truly epic civil war. Of course, that doesn't matter because what Iraqi's do to Iraqi's under the freedom [well, the *men* are "free" anyway] of their own constitution is all on them. You are far more comfortable with a kind of "ends justify the means" form of imperialistic military intervention then I will ever be. This puts me at odds with about half of America. I can accept that without liking it.

***************************************************************

I spent much of yesterday peppering various friends and lists with links to news items and news sources that they may not have come across. If anybody would like 30 more links to ruin their holiday weekend with let me know via e-mail. I'm sure I can still fuel your outrage if you're running low. But since a good friend has just told me to shut up or get a blog I will just subject you to this one.

After 24 hours of spiralling down to a level where I didn't think ANYTHING could still set off my "you have got to be kidding me, this is some sick joke" meter I was just handed this from a blog posted to by economics doctorate and world class novelist China Mieville -

http://leninology.blogspot.com/2005/09/politics-of-weather-3-shyness-of.html

Apparently FEMA farmed out [read privatized] the job of disaster management and recovery to IEM, Inc., the Baton Rouge-based emergency management and homeland security consultant.

A task that IEM no longer seems to be crowing about on their homepage.

And now I am going to go puke into a bucket.

- Barney

WRITER URBAN LEGENDS
I got this from Elizabeth Hand, who got them from Gail Sisolak:

The Writer With A Manuscript In His Hand
This happened to a friend of a guy I knew: He and his girlfriend were out parking, and they were getting real cuddly when the radio came on and there was a story about how a local man had written a book and was trying to get it published. Well, the girl got scared and wanted to go home, but the guy wanted to keep going with what they were doing and they had a big fight, and he peeled out of there and drove her home, and when he opened the door a manuscript was stuck right through the door handle!

The Writer Who Got A New Carpet
My uncle used to know this writer who got a new carpet installed. The writer went out while it was being put in place. Well, carpet installer found a strange lump under the wall-to-wall when he'd got it all tacked down, so he smashed it flat with his hammer. Later the writer found his canary was still in its cage but his manuscript was missing.

The Writer in The Bathtub
I heard this from a guy who worked right in the emergency room. A writer went down to Tiajuana, and he had a bit too much to drink and left the bar with this sexy girl. The next morning he woke up back in his hotel, hurting all over, in a bathtub full of ice. There was a note written on the mirror in lipstick: Call An Agent! And he found his book was being printed by PublishAmerica.

The Writer Who Worked On His Book Too Long
An editor told me about this really well known writer who had gotten writer's block, and in order to make up for it he wrote a really long book. But by the time he'd finished it tarantulas had nested inside his manuscript so when he picked it up they all came out and bit him and he died, and his widow had to return the advance.

The Writer Who Got A Phone Call From His Agent
A guy posted a story on the internet about a writer he'd met, and one night when the writer was home alone he got a call from his agent who said, "I've got a deal for your book for a a nice six-figure advance! Now all you have to do is write it." The writer was really happy about that, so he went to open a beer to celebrate, and while he was drinking it, the phone rang, and it was his agent! And his agent said, "Why aren't you writing your book?" And the writer said, "I'm writing it right now!" And he went and locked the doors, and pulled the curtains, and decided to watch some TV to relax, when the phone rang, and it was his agent saying "Why aren't you writing your book?" And the writer said, "I am!" and he was really scared, so he called the police, and they said "We traced your line. Get out of there right now! No one's called your house - you're talking to yourself again."

The Writer Who Used Poor Man's Copyright
There was a story in the newspaper about this writer who wrote a book, and when he'd finished he mailed it to himself and never opened the envelope. And about a year later a really famous writer had a book published that used the exact same plot, so the writer took the sealed envelope to court, and he won and got a lot of money.

And finally this one, which Elizabeth Hand goo yourself again."

The Writer Who Used Poor Man's Copyright
There was a story in the newspaper about this writer who wrote a book, and when he'd finished he mailed it to himself and never opened the envelope. And about a year later a really famous writer had a book published that used the exact same plot, so the writer took the sealed envelope to court, and he won and got a lot of money.

And finally this one, which Elizabeth Hand got from her sister, Kathleen Taggersell ...

The Writer with the Good Idea Book
A friend told me about a lady she knew who joined as many book clubs as she could. The women told everyone she was a writer, and they all gave her really good ideas for the books they thought they would write themselves one day. Well, this lady took all of their ideas and published a book called “Really Good Book Themes.” It was a New York Times bestseller. It was so successful that she did it all over again, but this time the name of the book is “Really Good Book Titles.” Like, one of the best lead titles was suggested to her by a former nun – “Nun of This, Nun of That.” I have heard there are other really good titles in the book, too. She was given an advance of over $1 million for this book

An episode of Columbo featuring Falk, Robert Culp, Patrick McGoohan AND Harlan Ellison? I'd trade my NMIB original Underoos collection to see that and consider a mortgage on my soul to be able to watch the production (pre-to-post) on PPV.

Columbo / Bush
Rob wrote: "IMAGINE...one of those 70's episodes co-starring Harlan as one of those nefarious, erratic, scheming adversaries for the legendary Lieutenant. How ez it is seeing our host in writhing KNOTS as Falk pesters the shit ougtta him over and over - like he's so used to in real life - about his shoes, where he bought his glasses, what kind of paper he types on, etc."

I must say you have a wonderful imagination, in fact they should do that episode NOW, and Harlan should chose or advise the writer. In real life, Harlan and Columbo would get along well, but if Harlan played an evil, more calculating version of himself who's a horror writer and busy trying to get work done, and if a part of Harlan's mansion (or a reconstruction of same) could be used for shooting (instead of the usual rented villas), what a treat that would be. It's also easy to imagine scenarios in which someone like Harlan would want to kill particular people, and given his intellectual capabilities there would have to be some mindplay going on between him and Columbo.

Peter Falk rules, and I'm glad to hear Harlan thinks so too.

Cindy wrote: "You're right. I'm certain the Germans thought we were oppressive bullies too."

No, we thought that about the Bush government, we know very well how one opinion can prevail even if people differ. The political opposition here (which is probably going to win the current elections) actually would have taken part in the military intervention out of principle if ordered to do so by the UN. They still say Schroeder damaged US-German relations and undercut UN authority. Bush and his staff have ceased dealing with our current government any more than necessary because they expect the opposition to win anyway.

Darryl wrote;
"I'm rambling, because I am crushed. Part of my soul is missing."

I am so sorry, Darryl. Words fail here. I hope and pray that you find your relative. I know her age is daunting under these circumstances but I haven't met too many of those old southern ladies who aren't boot tough under that sweet, " have anuthuh dumplin' dawlin'" graciousness. I hope and will pray that you find her all right and in short order. I feel bound and helpless and wish there could be some way for me to do something to assist you.

Cindy


Ezra Lb. wrote,
"4.Cindy, why is it that the soldiers and their families feel such a bond with a man whose idea of a war wound is a
charley horse from biking (Bush) and feel such an aversion to a man (Kerry) who actually had the experience of having bullets whistle by his head in combat? "

From what soldiers are telling me-- they respect Bush
because he didn't back down the way the U.N. did to Sadaam. More than one has said that Bush restored a measure of belief that the U.S. could and would follow through when necessary.

The U.N. BEGGED Sadaam to let their inspectors in FOR TWELVE YEARS. He told them to fuck off and they pretty much did. Bush gave him three months to comply with the U.N. which I thought was more than reasonable. Then he did what he said he was going to do.

Then you wrote;
"and feel such an aversion to a man (Kerry) who actually had the experience of having bullets whistle by his head in combat?. "

According to the soldiers I talked to including some serving currently in Iraq and one who was an infantry man from the Viet Nam war-- they don't believe Kerry ever had any actual bullets
whistle by his head in combat. OH-- and when they used the name "Kerry" it was invariably prefaced with the word, " that" followed by " pussy".

Heyy don't kill the messenger!
:)
Cindy


Jay Smith,
Chimpy McFlightsuit made me laugh my ass off.
:)
yer pal,
Cindy

Barney wrote,
"*Cindy*** While it's reasonable to counter one mother's grief against that of another as a way of answering those charges of misdirection and sociopath level insensitivity, at the point
where this discussion devolves into dueling mothers and the ways they handle their loss - and the effectiveness of their media handlers and their outlets - I think we have entered into
the "all reason fled" arena."

I don't understand what you're saying. Could you re-phrase it please? I got lost between charges of misdirection and sociopath level insensitivity. Who is being insensitive and what is the misdirection you refer to? Seriously, I'm not being a smart ass--I'm just not following you.


Then you wrote," As for not caring why we entered into this military enterprise, I have to say I'm sad to see anyone take such a tact."

I must not have spoken plainly on this one.

I wasn't taking any tack on this at all, neither was I trying to sidestep any discussion. I think the fact is we are there--in Iraq NOW. At this point ANY initial reason we had for wading into it is moot. Our focus should now be the people we have liberated from a blood thirsty killer ( who clearly gave less thought to what cravat to wear with his dress uniform than he gave to slaughtering innocent human beings) -- are still
alive and in need of our protection until they can handle it on their own.

Cindy


Which brings us to Rich who wrote."Hypocrisy, plain and simple. I guarantee you, Cindy, that you wouldn't have said that if it
was Clinton or Gore that got us into this mess."

You callin' me a hypocrite, Rich? :) If you had put money on that guarantee you'd have lost your ass. I would have and DO feel the same. I was grateful that Clinton did it. SOMEBODY needed to end the rape and murder. All of the men and boys
slaughtered, lying in mass graves--the women raped by hordes of soldiers. It was INSANE to allow it to continue unchallenged.
Sit down just a sec,Rich-- I'm fixin' to surprise you. I recognize and willingly admit that Clinton did a LOT of things right. He just did a couple of things wrong-- the one was admittedly petty ( lying to us about something inconsequential) I guess it pissed me off worse than it actually should have because I felt stupid for believing him. It shouldn't have been a federal case. That Clinton is an extraordinary person becomes more and more evident as time passes. Seeing him as he is and not through the spin haze of either side has helped. He did a great job, for the most part as president... but I did find a number of the pardons he handed out right before he left office to be shocking and unconscionable. That aside; I don't mind telling you that his eloquence would have been balm this morning. My boy Bush just shouldn't talk when he's chokin'. All I could think was, " Okay darlin', now just shut the fuck up and get that HELICOPTER--SITTING--on--the-GROUND BEHIND you
up in the AIR already and DISPATCH IT TO THOSE who are DYING AT THIS MOMENT while y'all are using it for BACKGROUND.It wasn't just Bush though, I had the same reaction last night watching the Senate's interminable bullshit. The honorable Senator Reid (from Nevada, I think) was expounding on the human toll and the
tragedy-- droning ON and ON, telling us what we had all SEEN FOR OURSELVES. All I could think of was, " Shut UP, stop
pontificating and call for a vote!! This is ridiculous-- we KNOW how bad it is-- the WHOLE WORLD knows those people are DYING down there FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, SHUT UP AND TAKE SOME FUCKING ACTION.

Cindy



Gore, remains a non-issue.
Cindy


Nathan wrote,"Plus there is something unnerving about a forced revolution. The Iraqi people didn't ask us for aid in their liberation. We told them they were going to be liberated...on
our terms, our rules"

An invitation isn't a prerequisite for a rope when somebody's sunk to his chin in quicksand.

Cindy


And Andrew;"Smearing Cindy (my new hero) Sheehan, instead of discussing her message, is one of the most disgusting events in recent memory."

Are you saying I smeared Mrs.Sheehan? I didn't. My friend Sue, however, put it on her. Sue has the right and the spine to say what she thinks.

I'll discuss! I interpret Sheehan's message to mean; "cut and run" and " we've lost enough lives over there, we should get out." I can understand that idea, having sons of my own. But what about the Iraqis who are grateful for our help and in dire need of our continued assistance for a while longer? Should we pitch them to the wolves again? You want to talk about what happened to them the LAST time we came in and didn't do what we said we were going to do?

Then you wrote;" What better support can we give our soldiers and sailors, than to give them a pat on the back and tell them it's time to come home?"


The soldiers from my home town have told me their mission is to secure Iraq for the Iraqi people. They have said that to be sent home before they are allowed to accomplish that goal
is to negate the sacrifice of their brothers and sisters in arms. They chafe at the notion of cutting and running and say it would be as if those they lost died for nothing.

Cindy


David wrote,
"You have a lovely story to justify our war on Iraq. Unfortunately, it’s only a story, and it happens to be the government’s story. "

Noo it's MY take.

Then;"1. Sadaam was our “friend” for much of the time
he was oppressing and killing his citizens. At best, we didn’t care what he did for many years; at worst, we sold him weapons to help him do it."

Yes, you are right about that.It's tragic.

"2. If you take a longer view than merely what was happening in the past 10-15 years—let’s say that stretch, plus the next 15—our “protection of the innocent” may well end up killing more of them than would have died had we left Iraq alone..."

But would you leave them alone, thinking they were better off, even knowing what Sadaam was doing to them? The knowledge of the Iraqis he tortured and butchered, the images of the dead
Kurds lying in the streets should have been enough for us to do something. We shouldn't have waited and we damned sure didn't owe him a three month heads up.


Then,
". . not just because we are killing some inadvertently, and we are breeding more opposition and hatred within and attracting many more troublemakers to the area from elsewhere; but our lack of interest in coming to some sort of terms with belligerent neighbors like Iran and Syria means they will likely end up continuing to destabilize whatever government
gets placed in Iraq."

Do you consider Sadaam to have been a stabilizing force?

"Even without such uncooperative neighbors, Iraq may not be fit or willing to mount a democracy. More than a century ago, John Stuart Mill wrote an acute argument that concluded that perhaps
intervening in a civil war, or even a nakedly oppressive foreign government’s affairs, may inevitably be a mistake, because if a people is not ready or willing to take control for
themselves, then they are probably not ready to self-govern after the shots die off . . . if they ever do."

I am glad that John Stuart Mill's words were not a decisive factor in our (also late-but effective) intervention in Hitler's government affairs.

"3. There are plenty of other “butcheries”

David!
Don't you like my wording? I thought it fit the fact.

"we did nothing about—Biafra and Pakistan in the 1960s, Cambodia in the early 1970s, Ethiopia in the 1980s, Rwanda in the mid 1990s, Sudan in the past few years; and that’s just a selection of the ones that were worse than Saddam in terms of
sheer numbers of atrocities and deaths—because they were committed by our “friends”

There is no worse or lesser here, they are all unspeakable evils. I wish we could have done something then and I wish we could do more now.

"Thus, it becomes hard to avoid the conclusion that it has not been so much about “saving the innocent”—though that’s the cover story the government sells to Americans to make giving up
their hard-earned dollars and children to this lousy war—but about oil: who has it, who needs it, who wants to get better control over it."

All government spin aside; I am telling you what I believe. In my heart, the end ( no more Iraqis living and dying in mortal fear of Sadaam, no more Kurds being gassed in the streets by the bloody bastard) is the ultimate justification of the means--the war.

"4. What we tell ourselves is goodly “policing the world” may come off as oppressive bullying to others. Certainly many of our intelligent European allies that share our values seem to
think so; how do you think it comes across to folks who have a different religion, different values, different understandings of what constitutes a moral life, on the far side of the globe?"

You're right. I'm certain the Germans thought we were oppressive bullies too.


"Finally, if we hadn't been sending so much money, personnel, and supplies (especially our National Guard units, whose primary responsibility is order and security at home), I
think it is inarguable that things would not be in such a mess in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, and Texas today."

We could not have averted Katrina and the wheels of bureaucracy would still be just as caked with mud and just as slow to turn.


"That’s only the latest in a long line of reasons I disapprove of this war. Please note that I was careful always to say “our
government” in this post; much as Bush and his team disgust me, I count preceding administrations as sharing some of the
culpability for this mess."

I appreciate that, David and I agree with all of it... err except the part about Bush being disgusting. I don't see
that at all, but he does exasperate me at times.

Cindy


Harlan,
That was funny as hell.

:)
Cindy

PETER FALK

I was in love with him as an actor from the moment I saw him in Richard Alan Simmons's "The Price of Tomatoes" on the original Dick Powell Theater. As Abe Reles he was so mesmerizing in MURDER, INC. that when I was hired to write what became the abomination THE OSCAR, I wrote it with Steve McQueen and Peter Falk in the lead roles. So the imbeciles cast two no-talents, Stephen Boyd and Tony Bennett in his ONLY (thank gawd) non-singing dramatic role.

In later years, Peter and I became friends. He was my partner when we shot pool against Leo Durocher and Omar Sharif.

I have a very warm place in my heart for him.

Apropos of nuttin' much, just hangin' in here.

Yr. pal, Harlan

While everyone blames the Fed government on the busting dykes (not the Busty Dykes) in N'Orleans, where is the outcry for action by the state and local government? The city is a tourist destination.....they couldn't hike the hotel tax and some other taxes for a few years to build better dykes?? They had to wait around for the Fed government to hand them the money, and then do nothing when it wasn't in the bank?

I live in a city that raised sales tax by a miniscule percentage for a set period of time in order to build much needed highways over the past two decades. Phoenix identified a future need, and though I am a Republican and I'm supposed to loathe all taxes, I think it was a great idea. The time limit expired last year (though the election voted in that the tax continue for further, albeit controversial, improvements). If we can raise our taxes a quarter of a penny to build a desperately needed highway system, could N'Orleans or Louisiana do the same to hire some Dutch engineers to come in and teach 'em all about indestructible dykes?

Let's have a bit of local responsibility and stop blaming everything on the Fed.

-TODD (who swore off political discussion on this board about 10 months ago, but just had to comment)

"I don't want to say my career is in the toilet, but I think I know all my readers personally."

I hope one day I can even say THAT much!

(BTW, since we've been talking about it here, it struck me as I was just watching an old classic COLUMBO episode. One, of a matter fact, with Harlan's friend Robert Culp. Imagine! IMAGINE...one of those 70's episodes co-starring Harlan as one of those nefarious, erratic, scheming adversaries for the legendary Lieutenant. How ez it is seeing our host in writhing KNOTS as Falk pesters the shit ougtta him over and over - like he's so used to in real life - about his shoes, where he bought his glasses, what kind of paper he types on, etc. I mean just LOOK at the spit fly!! Yeah, that would have been TIMELESS.

Oh, well. Another knock-out 'What If?' for the files.

I MET Falk once in Westwood. He was actually wearing a gray, apparently moth-eaten sweater. We talked at a corner in front of the Village theater about a movie he'd just come out of and candidly disliked. I just wished I'd had the wherewithal to tell him what a fan I'd always been and how I'd grown up watching his stuff. I really didn't stress it enough. Ah, well)

You're the Mayor, Nagin. Act like it.
I have a difficult time sympathizing with Mayor Nagin. HE IS THE MAYOR! It's HIS CITY!

The resources of the City of New Orleans are his to mobilize and direct. You might have seen a photo on drudgereport of a hundred N.O. city school buses sitting uselessly in five feet of water. Why didn't he mobilize people qualified to drive those buses and get them into the French Quarter to evacuate the population? Why didn't he contact the local relief agencies and the Salvation Army (among others) to meet up with those buses up on higher ground and prepare relief stations with water, shelter and food? Why didn't he coordinate with Police and Fire to get the elderly and sick out of the danger zone?

Of course he can't do everything. But a few days of real leadership before and after the hurricane would have made life easier for the thousands of people who elected him Mayor.

from the mayor of new orleans

ya'll need to read this:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/09/02/nagin.transcript/index.html

As usual, Frank has the link right, but the facts wrong. So not only does he double-post, but he does so with a spelling error and implied conspiracy theories of people hushing up the report.

By the way, Frankie Churchomsky, martial law was declared around Tuesday it's just that no one knew what the fuck they were doing so it wasn't til yesterday afternoon or so before they could actually enforce it.

Sorry about the double posting, but this is shocking. It seems there is a 'shoot to kill' order on looters.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,16473259%255E661,00.html

No doubt, this isn't being reported here yet.

Marshall law is here.

Caitlin called me. She's okay. If ANYONE is in touch with either Poppy Z. Brite or O'Neil De Noux, PLEASEPLEASEPLEASE ask either/both to call me for assistance. Or, just to check in.

And here, just to give you a moment's respite, is a small funny:

Day before yesterday, my producer on MASTERS OF SF, Keith Addis, and the series' pre-production story consultant, the excellent novelist Michael Cassutt, who worked on the 1985-86 Twilight Zone after I left, came over for a confabulation. Michael got here first, and we talked about the current state of publishing. Michael was ruminating on the size of his book sales, and he said (great quote):

"I don't want to say my career is in the toilet, but I think I know all my readers personally."

Yr. pal, Harlan

Hey, what about Anne Rice?

cover story

Cindy:

You have a lovely story to justify our war on Iraq. Unfortunately, it’s only a story, and it happens to be the government’s story. I found it suspect going in, and it’s only become more suspect over time. Briefly, here are a couple reasons:

1. Saddam was our “friend” for much of the time he was oppressing and killing his citizens. At best, we didn’t care what he did for many years; at worst, we sold him weapons to help him do it.

2. If you take a longer view than merely what was happening in the past 10-15 years—let’s say that stretch, plus the next 15—our “protection of the innocent” may well end up killing more of them than would have died had we left Iraq alone . . . not just because we are killing some inadvertently, and we are breeding more opposition and hatred within and attracting many more troublemakers to the area from elsewhere; but our lack of interest in coming to some sort of terms with belligerent neighbors like Iran and Syria means they will likely end up continuing to destabilize whatever government gets placed in Iraq.

Even without such uncooperative neighbors, Iraq may not be fit or willing to mount a democracy. More than a century ago, John Stuart Mill wrote an acute argument that concluded that perhaps intervening in a civil war, or even a nakedly oppressive foreign government’s affairs, may inevitably be a mistake, because if a people is not ready or willing to take control for themselves, then they are probably not ready to self-govern after the shots die off . . . if they ever do.

3. There are plenty of other “butcheries” we did nothing about—Biafra and Pakistan in the 1960s, Cambodia in the early 1970s, Ethiopia in the 1980s, Rwanda in the mid 1990s, Sudan in the past few years; and that’s just a selection of the ones that were worse than Saddam in terms of sheer numbers of atrocities and deaths—because they were committed by our “friends” or we didn’t care enough to do anything. (See Samantha Power's Pulitzer-winning account, _"A Problem from Hell": America and the Age of Genocide_.)

Thus, it becomes hard to avoid the conclusion that it has not been so much about “saving the innocent”—though that’s the cover story the government sells to Americans to make giving up their hard-earned dollars and children to this lousy war—but about oil: who has it, who needs it, who wants to get better control over it.

4. What we tell ourselves is goodly “policing the world” may come off as oppressive bullying to others. Certainly many of our intelligent European allies that share our values seem to think so; how do you think it comes across to folks who have a different religion, different values, different understandings of what constitutes a moral life, on the far side of the globe?

A lot of American companies are making big money off us and the Iraqis by supposedly helping them out. That’s no different from any war; read any history and you’ll find there are always scavenging profiteers that congregate whenever the government loosens the situation with a little war. (The Kennedys’ late patriarch and the Bush ancestors might be counted among them - see Kevin Phillips' book, _American Dynasty: aristocracy, fortune, and the politics of deceit in the House of Bush_ on the latter). To me, they are little different from the despicable looters in New Orleans this week. The only thing I haven’t been able to discern is whether—to what extent—their interests may actually DRIVE American foreign policy and the prosecution of distant wars.

Finally, if we hadn’t been sending so much money, personnel, and supplies (especially our National Guard units, whose primary responsibility is order and security at home), I think it is inarguable that things would not be in such a mess in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, and Texas today.

That’s only the latest in a long line of reasons I disapprove of this war. Please note that I was careful always to say “our government” in this post; much as Bush and his team disgust me, I count preceding administrations as sharing some of the culpability for this mess.

FEMA and the Prez. / I am now a carpetbagger. / Charity
Yesterday a friend of mine wrote that he "almost" felt sorry for Shrub, standing between Daddy and Clinton, talking about [mostly] gas prices. Didn't understand why he wasn't spending more time talking about relief, just kept harping on oil. My response;

Of course he did. OF COURSE he did. He has to speak to his "base", and rich oil is what he is going to have left once his Republican buddies realize his coat tails are on fire.

FEMA is totally crippled and he made it so. He's a fucking
white-knuckle drunk. Today he's being beligerant about the feeble
response. This is what drunks do. Yell at the wife 'cause there are no batteries in the house for the flashlight when the lights go out. And FEMA is the beaten down wife with no pin money and nothing to do but stand there and take the fucking beating.

I know these people. They're not larger than life. They're the same moral cripples who played cards in my living room and drank away their future when I was a kid. Now they get to live in the White House and misappropriate the federal budget instead.

All this in the land of Faulkner and Tennesee Williams. Go figure.

***************************************************************

I BECOME A CARPETBAGGER

Took my jeep in to get inspected today. Hope they keep it for three weeks. Brought my bike along. After giving the keys and paerwork to the manager I took my bike out of the back and got on. The guy looked like I pulled a matter transporter out of my ass. He told me in 6 years I was the first person to do this. I believe him.

Gas prices are all over the map. Almost .90 cents difference from pump to pump. Screw 'em. I have a 21 speed and a backpack. Boy did this morning's ride feel great.

Got home and my neighbor up the street was having a porch sale. She was selling her daughter's computer. HP desktop. Pentium 4. 80gb hard drive. Speakers w. a sub-woofer. Keyboard. Wireless mouse. 9 months old. Norton 2005. Reset to factory settings. Cost her about a grand.

Asking $200.00

Sold.

She said thanks, this would buy her 5 tanks of gas. I looked at her mini-van and told her that it probably would buy 4 tanks of gas if things don't get worse.

I guess this is that trickle down economy I've been hearing about for years.

***************************************************************

For anybody planning to give money to organizations other than the Red Cross I have two trains of thought I'd like to share. If you're planning on making a donation, see if you can give it to or through a corporation that's doing matching or double/triple matching. LUTRON in my area is donating 2/1. Other local industries may be doing something similar. Might as well see if you can double your money while doing what are government can hardly be bothered with.

As for non- Red Cross or FEMA donations, pick wisely. I just found out the #3 charity site ON THE FEMA WEBSITE is Pat Robertson's Operation Blessing. So much for separating church and state.

While I don't have any STRONG feelings about this, I'd sure feel alot better in a "truth in advertising" sort of way if Robertson's name could be found on this website. I hit four pages and saw no mention of Pat Robertson's name.

On the one hand I believe Pat Robertson is a snake-oil weasel fucker. That's just my opinion of course. On the other hand I don't know if the weasel fucking extends to this particular arm of his organization. If the church is the last standing piece of infrastructure after the United States government abandons you, then I guess you go to the church and argue theology after the babies and old people have a roof over their heads.

The fact that I have to qualify the parameters of my rage in this manner makes me even more angry.

- Barney Dannelke

Indulge me, please
I sit in front of my computer with teary eyes, watching a remarkably optimistic feed from WWL-TV in New Orleans.

My city's in ruins. I grew up in Baton Rouge, and spent many a weekend in New Orleans. Many weeks in the summer, when school was out. I can't put my mind around the pictures I'm seeing.

People are saying that the city shouldn't even be rebuilt (and make no mistake, rebuilding is what is going to be needed. After weeks or months of sitting in a 90+ degree primordial soup, mold alone will force most single family dwellings to be condemned).

I don't know what to say. My kind friends ask me about N.O., and I tell them my relatives are safe, except for one from whom we haven't heard. She's stubborn, and in her nineties, and her house is under 15 feet of water.

I find it difficult to talk about without crying. We visited only two months ago. I had a muffuletta from Central Grocery, pralines, a strawberry daiquiri, crawfish, fried shrimp po-boy. I didn't have a begniet at Cafe du Monde. I regret that. I stood outside of Preservation Hall with my sons as we walked down Bourbon Street. We went to the Aquarium of the Americas (what is happening with the animals there and at the Audubon Zoo)?

There was magic in this city. I hope it returns.

I'm rambling, because I am crushed. Part of my soul is missing.

Did you all know that Bush was playing golf on Tuesday? Yea, while Rome was burning Bush played a round, singing the banjo number from Deliverance.

Cheney is still on vacation in Wyoming; Condoleeza 'aunt tomasina' Rice just got off vacation, possibly to oversee the cotton crop.

The right wing radio trash are saying that the reason the people of New Orleans did not leave is because of their allegiance to the 'nanny state.' Yea, I just saw a baby dying on CNN, I'm sure that welfare scum deserved it.

Did I mention, I really hate these people.

Why Harlan is wisely trademarked -
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/06C28694-2A0A-4BB4-B6BF-3D1AB20E3363.htm

So Bush is heading to the area. Wonderful. He won't go to the worst areas, so he'll linger in the areas where work is actually being done. He'll commandeer vehicles, police... just to shake a few hands and have his picture taken.

I hope someone tears him a new asshole. I hope the Mayor of N'Orleans does. All this talk in the four years since 9/11 - how we're workng to prevent and prepare from attacks that might come without warning and here we are. We had 5-7 days warning and conditions that are identical to a wide spread dirty bomb/chemical attack in an urban center.

I've gone from sad to angry. Our actions today represent a road map for future terrorist actions. As I write this CNN is now talking about the same thing.

FOUR YEARS. What the hell happened?

G. Dubyah: "I love the SMELL o'MIASMA in the MORNIN'"

After absorbing more fully over the last day the horrific proportions of the Katrina disaster, I’ve come to appreciate this our wise President for his astuteness and quick actions. Emblematic of what so much of the country has inherited steadily since 2001, Orleans afloats in polluted waters, refuse, offal, corpses, and low-income "nobodies", who were left without any early means to get out of the city (y’know, things like busses and choppers flying overhead to inform them about what to do), looting the stores in desperate need of supplies (no, I’m not referring to the ARMED looters, an element that ALWAYS accompanies disasters a city is SUPPOSED to be prepared for)

And I sit here feeling SO proud of the man so many seemed happy to vote for; a man with brains and scruples. A man who, it seems, had the common sense to CUT the flood funding to Orleans, even when warned earnestly about the inevitable flooding risks from a hurricane about 4 years ago, so he could pour money into the Iraq war and STILL keep his rich friends happy with his tax breaks (I wonder how much could have come from that top 1% in such urgent times that would not have been taken away from those who really needed it. I guess I shouldn’t let it bug me. We ARE talking about lazy, useless, low-income leeches).

Having absorbed all this news today, I feel proud that the good people of this nation had the vigilance to place into the White House a MAN who KNOWS his JOB. What did he call it? Oh, yes: "restoring DIGNITY to the White House". Thank you. We’ve inherited things that will stay with us for some years: the bullshit in Iraq, which will attach itself to our problems like toenail fungus (not because we shouldn’t have dealt with Hussein but because of the arrogance, and presuming naively we’d be greeted by open arms of a Post War), and now THIS horror which will, among other things, fire diseases throughout the region from rotting corpses in all that water and sewage.

Not enough National Guardsmen to help; not enough National Guard helicopters. At least, once Bush understood this was no longer Mister Rogers’ Neighborhood, he decided that it was time to end his vacation, get another day of work in, and deficit spend another 50 billion for a region he helped screw into oblivion.

MMMMMmmmmmmm. SMELL them vapors. Get to know 'em as your friends because they're gonna be here for a long time.

Galen
Apologies for the unintended personal affront. I evidently painted with too broad a brush -- I was aiming at a select group of individuals and any muddying of large groups was not the message I had hoped to convey. I have a deep love of New Orleans. I was, and am, distressed at the magnitude of the disaster -- made significantly worse by shocking ineptitude on the part of our government.

I meant, via irony, to describe the frustration of being so far removed from any ability to help, while others lobbed judgemental condemnation to the effect that the city deserved this fate. This is why, I guess, I am a photographer and not a writer.

My sensitivity to the issue is simply, really. Californians have also been the subject of precisely this form of condemnation each and every time we watch our cities leveled, our canyons burned, or our neighborhoods in riot. Somehow we, too, deserve our fate.

So while I stand by my original suggestion of opportunism by a very "specific and select group of religious organizations" -- some of them evangelical (small "e") -- I am as saddened as you that my prediction was so quickly proven correct.

(And I will also point out to everyone that my wrist was dutifully slapped for yesterday's second posting, with appropriate contrition on my part.)

Steve B

Heartbroken and Speechless, this is all I can say:

St. James Infirmary Blues
(Traditional)

"I went down to St. James Infirmary,
Saw my baby there.
Set down on a long white table,
So sweet, so cold, so fair.

Let her go, let her go, God bless her,
Wherever she may be,
She can look this wide world over,
She'll never find a sweet man like me.

When I die, want you to dress me in straight leg shoes,
Box back coat and a Stetson hat,
Put a 20 dollar gold piece on my watch chain,
So the boys'll know I died standing pat.

Now you've heard my sad story,
Boy hand me another shot of that booze;
If anyone should ask you,
Tell 'em I got those St. James Infirmary blues."

I hope you all know what it means to miss New Orleans.

Steve Dooner

THIS FROM POPPY Z BRITE

this was on Caitlin R. Kiernan's blog today:

I just received the following e-mail from Poppy (care of Bill Schafer):

"Chris and I are stranded with my mother in XXXXXXX MS. We have no idea when we'll be able to get home or if we have any home left to get to. We're currently without power or cell phone service. We came into Jackson today to get supplies and I do not have regular Internet access...And if you ever say any kind of prayers, please say some for us."

I've edited out exact locations and phone numbers, but otherwise, that's what she said. That's what we know. She's okay, and I for one have breathed a great sigh of relief.

http://www.worldtribune.com/worldtribune/05/front2453615.183333333.html

Senior Kuwaiti Official: "Katrina is a Wind of Torment and Evil from Allah Sent to This American Empire"

Perhaps Michael Marcavage should move to Kuwait?

Caitlin Kiernan posted the following on her blog. This is some sick and scary stone age crappola from Michael Marcavage, director of Repent America, (http://www.repentamerica.com/pr_hurricanekatrina.html). Take a gander...

"Although the loss of lives is deeply saddening, this act of God destroyed a wicked city. From 'Girls Gone Wild' to 'Southern Decadence,' New Orleans was a city that had its doors wide open to the public celebration of sin. From the devastation may a city full of righteousness emerge, We must help and pray for those ravaged by this disaster, but let us not forget that the citizens of New Orleans tolerated and welcomed the wickedness in their city for so long. May this act of God cause us all to think about what we tolerate in our city limits, and bring us trembling before the throne of Almighty God."

Methinks Mr. Marcavage is also a gander, i.e., a simpleton.

Brad's Post on Auterism

No one who knows anything about Japanese film could prefer Kurosawa to Mizoguchi and Ozu?

Simply to clarify...I've done a couple of years worth of study of Japanese film, met Donald Richie, read his book as well as many others...and I WILDLY prefer Kurosawa. Not that I don't love the other two (especially Ozu), but your statement seems pretty over the top, bordering on snide.

I would also argue that while Coppola's star may have faded rather significantly, leaving Only a handful of Excellent Films behind, Altman remains one of the most important American directors of the last half century...and as the French film scholars who came up with the auteur theory all would have told you, American directors were their favorites...

And, yes, dear lord, please, the amply measured talent and thought of Resnais over the self-consciously cutesy of Godard. Any day of the week.

Now, that said, I'm sure we all have a different list than Harlan. That was probably the point he was initially making with the very obviously sarcastic "Just take the list and remember I'm never wrong, and shut up."

(Y'know, If I remember correctly, Resnais is the source for the derisive term "smart-aleck auteurs"...)

Katrina - share some good news
CNN has published this initial list of corporate donations and assistance to the effort.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/31/news/fortune500/firms_hurricane/index.htm

It's a start. You can help too... Jim published a great list, I've loaded it on the other site also.

We can each of us do something positive, large or small... Whatever you can do, this is a time we all have the opportunity to show the better angels of our nature and our compassion.

_Slate_ hails Ray Bradbury, sorta; Harlan's benediction from Dorothy Parker is mentioned in passing.

http://www.slate.com/id/2125476/

HARLAN

Poppy's alive, and doing as well as can be expected. She just posted to her blog from Jackson, Mississippi, where she's picking up supplies: http://www.livejournal.com/users/docbrite/

I just saw the Barber of Mississippi getting all hot under the collar that a CNN reporter had the balls to suggest that the federal Govt. was doing a bad job helping the hurricane survivors. After the reporter said the Govt. had days to get some kind of plan together (actually they have had years ) as they saw the cat.5 hurricane closing in Barber got pissed and said that it was only cat.1 and they only had a few hours of warning that it was up to cat.5 . BULLSHIT . Perhaps he was out golfing with Shrub as the hurricane moved in.

Ezra Lb.
A few gunshots were fired so now we can all throw up our hands and say we tried to save them but they shot at us.That is just so unheard of in the U.S.A. I can't beleive it. Actual gunshots. I guess we will just have to evacuate Iraq as the poor oppressed warriors have shot at the troops.

I have been watching the news on TV and of the busses moving people into the Astro Dome I cant see a single military vehicle.
The people in the Super Dome and Convention Center have been left to rot and fend for themselves.

Keep your head in the sand and keep saying they are doing everything they can ( maybe mentally but not physically )and Shrub can always send a prayer.

Chuck:

Regarding your closing comment, I saw a bumper sticker locally that read "There's a Terrorist Behind Every Bush."

A Convenient Place.

Eric wrote:

"This canard from the left is as tired and inaccurate as the canards about secret weapons from the right."

I don't know, the facts are not all in. But I do remember a statement made by Peter Arnett about Vietnam. He felt the Johnson administration escalated the war in Vietnam because they felt it was a convenient place to fight the war on communism.

I have long felt that Iraq was seen as a convenient place to fight the "War on Terror." (Which is like declaring war on flanking manuvers.) In Iraq, the US would have a quick, easy victory that would look good on television. The war in Afganistan would be a long, dreary slog without much chance for photo ops.

The people who planned the Iraq operation went in with a number of happy horseshit assumptions about the aftermath of the invasion -- that it would be like Paris in 1944. We'd win, the bad guys would die and all would be sunshine and roses, the end. Administration officials like John Ashcroft (our very own Robert MacNamara) were so wedded to this vision of postwar Iraq that they ignored the warnings from their own military that the occupation of Iraq would be more involved and difficult that they assumed.

Even after reports came in from the field that things were getting hot and that looting was rampant, Ashcroft, Wolfowitz, etc refused to admit their earlier assumptions were wrong. As a result, the heavy equipment that would have saved lives, armored personnel carriers, LAV's, armor kits for Humvees were not in place when needed. The sending of this equipment and the ordering of up-armoring kits for "soft-skinned" vehicles was extremely tardy. People died because of this.

They died because the arrogance, the hubris, the micromanagement that came from Ashcroft, who crossed off units the general staff said were needed for Iraq in the first place, saying, in effect, "You don't need this. You don't need this. And what do you need this for?"

All so we could have a chapter in the "War on Terror" that had a nice, satisfying finish like an action movie.

It's what I've felt for quite some time: Behind every successful politician is a trail of bodies.

Chuck

Someone on the board, Nathan, I believe, wrote that Bush admitted that the reason we are in Iraq is primarily for its oil reserves. I'd like to know the source of that admittion, where, when and what was said, if possible. I've always suspected this
was a primary motivating factor especially given certain policy
papers for the Project for a New American Century written by current administration officials nearly a decade prior to the invasion. Unfortunately and not surprisingly, if you go to their website, those particular policy papers are no longer available.

Thanks in advance.

Steve B
Steve, I replied to your post because I was offended by its content, not because I disagreed with the likelihood of its prediction. We could all follow your lead and post our own cynical conjectures as to who might do what next that would make us want to vomit.

In the immediate aftermath of this disaster, why air such a pointedly negative conjecture?

With your post of the day you chose to focus on the sad certainty that some would take advantage of this tragedy for their own purposes, targeting evangelicals as your specific bull’s eye – calling them “self-styled” is an equivocation, don’t you think? Others will rush to target their predictions against a race or social class or political party. Each will eventually be able to google a news item or see a video on CNN that validates for them that they were right – small egotistical victory though that would be.

My disagreement is with the timing, negative focus and specificity of your post in light of the tragedy and on-going humanitarian efforts. I do concede that your prediction is validated. You were right, and it makes me want to vomit.

Respectfully,

Galen

PS My wife just called in excitement to tell how she was able to help a family from New Orleans by expediting a refund for unused camp insurance. The family had run out of money in their escape and the refund was needed to purchase food. A small deed, I know, but worthy of recognition. My words above just shrivel next to the smallest act of compassion.

So many threads, so little time. A terrible burden having an opinion about everything. What to do what to do? Hmmmmm…chronologically perhaps.

1.Frank I just heard on the news that federal rescue teams attempting to evacuate the Superdome had to withdraw after they came under GUNFIRE from some of those poor oppressed class warriors you praise so much.
2.Brad, being a FAN rather than a STUDENT of film keeps me from wasting my time trying to decide if one director is more “important” than another.
3.Barney, dammit, now you tell me there’s a better bio of Twain when I’m about a third of the way through the Kaplan.
4.Cindy, why is it that the soldiers and their families feel such a bond with a man whose idea of a war wound is a charley horse from biking (Bush) and feel such an aversion to a man (Kerry) who actually had the experience of having bullets whistle by his head in combat?.

"I've seen no oil benefit from Iraq. And none of us ever will. "

We weren't meant to. They'd still gouge us even if the insurgents weren't blowing everything up.

Bush Meets Swamp
Frank,

I'd much rather Chimpy McFlightsuit keep his nose out of things. He can give orders and sign checks from Washington and let FEMA and other organizations do their job without tying up their police, EMS , utility vehicles, offices, phones and generators for a giant photo-op. He had an "emotional" fly-over on Air Force One and cut his vacation short (rolls eyes) to metaphorically roll up his sleeves, and that's great. But as far as I can tell, the Governors of Ole Miss and Lousie-Anna are on top of things - they just need more manpower, supplies and cash, not some useless figurehead with nothing to do but wander around looking somber.

This is a job for real people with real skills. If he wants to use a power saw, he can go back to his deadwood in Crawford.

Todd, if you think Bush is doing a good job mobilizing help to the flood victims then you're beyond help.

Bush went to a speech about World War 2 when he could have been in Mississippi mobilizing a massive effort to help the mostly black victims of the flood. Sewage and dead bodies float in the rivers of standing water, while Bush is not doing much of anything; and I don't care if the guy was Noam Chomsky, this President aint doing shit.

The people should all be in shelters by now, and why are they worrying about the looting, when the real job should be getting all the people to a safe spot. The insurance should cover any loss at the stores.

The standing water with sewage and chemical spillage, will create a Congo like atmosphere here in America, if we do not act now. Too bad all our resources are being wasted in Iraq.

There are stories that the levee could have been fixed as early as 2003, but Bush did not want to heed FEMA's warnings and askings for help with the fortification. No, Bush wanted to use all the money to build up the Iraqi war. FEMA's budget got cut and now look at the results.

Republican or democrat, liberal or anarchist, no American should abide this red neck son of a bitch.

THIS IS AN EMERGENCY, SEND HELP NOWWWW!!!

Auteurism
"We're not discussing here those six directors worldwide who are the best, the six whose individual voices - whether you like their films or not - set them apart from all other directors who are merely craftspersons of greater or lesser ability...I'll let you have that list of the six directors. Just take the list and remember I'm never wrong, and shut up. They are: Kurosawa, Altman, Coppola, Resnais, Bunuel, Kubrick, and Fellini"

It's an odd list. Nobody who knows anything about Japanese cinema could possibly prefer Kurosawa to Mizoguchi or Ozu. But this piece was published in 1980 and only deals with living directors, so that's fair enough. Renoir died in 1979. Kiarostami was not generally known outside Iran at this time. But Bresson was very much alive, and Angelopoulos is still with us. Altman and Coppola probably seemed much more interesting in 1980 than they do today - even their best work from the 70s now looks pretty dull when compared with the masterpieces shot during that decade by Hellman and Cassavetes. But does anyone believe that Resnais is a more important director than Godard or Rivette? Does anyone really think that Garrel, Pialat, Chabrol, Truffaut, Akerman, Marker, Ruiz, Straub, Satyajit Ray, Eustache, Oshima, Ferreri, Bertolucci, Bellocchio, Leone, Jancso, Tarkovsky, Olmi, Herzog, Wenders, Fassbinder and Erice were "just craftspersons of greater or lesser ability"?

These things are relative, but I don't think any of us in the United States have been paying "top dollar" for gas, lately, or indeed, hardly ever. But watching a local Hess station attendent change the sign this morning from $2.69 to $2.99 at 1AM - when, presumably he will encounter less outrage and perhaps feel less shame - I thought to myself that we are all about to get a taste of what "top dollar" really feels like. And yes, I know California and many other places pay higher prices than PA all the time.

There was an interesting 3 page article about the "peak oil" school of thought by Peter Maas in last weekends New York Times magazine that raised some ghost hackles on the back of my neck. If we know as little about the true Saudi oil reserves as that article intimates then we could be in for a brand new world of consumer hurt.

***Cindy*** While it's reasonable to counter one mother's grief against that of another as a way of answering those charges of misdirection and sociopath level insensitivity, at the point where this discussion devolves into dueling mothers and the ways they handle their loss - and the effectiveness of their media handlers and their outlets - I think we have entered into the "all reason fled" arena.

As for not caring why we entered into this military enterprise, I have to say I'm sad to see anyone take such a tact. The reason a government as powerful as ours does anything, particularly with our military should be important to its citizens. In fact, thinking about how and when and to what degree a civilisation uses its military is often seen in Western culture as a primary DUTY of its citizens. To walk away from this line of questioning is to give government ultimate power and a rein so free as to be useless and dangerous.

To decide the reasons after the fact is the potential job of historians and should be anathema to its citizens.

************************************************************

Speaking of history, I'm currently reading [as opposed to wading through, as with the recent Kaplan bio] the new MARK TWAIN: A LIFE by Ron Powers.

http://tinyurl.com/dvl4l

This is the same Powers who wrote "Dangerous Water: A Biography of the Boy Who Became Mark Twain" which tells the story of Clemens in fascinating detail up until his 15th birthday. I have always thought of this as the boring or tedious part of many biographies but Powers showed me how wrong I was, and how much a thoughtful person could get out of material often glossed over. Plus, this fellow has a light, breezy style that makes me insane with jealousy. He is the anti-Kaplan. How someone can put so much on the page and not bog the reader down is a wonder and a mystery to me.

So, if you're only going to read one 625 page Twain biography this year - this is the one.

- Barney Dannelke

The only message the insurgents are getting is that we aren't leaving anytime soon. Hence, the insurgency. If anything, us being there is playing right into the hands of the insurgents as it gives them a target for their chaos. Not a literal target as they're killing more Iraqis than Americans, but a symbolic one and helps direct anger away from them and towards the Americans for being there in the first place, thus causing the bombings and death and destruction that has become apparently so commonplace that we've redirected our attention to a grieving mom outside Crawford, TX.

"I could not care less what the motivating force was behind our declaration of war against Saddam---"

Hypocrisy, plain and simple. I guarantee you, Cindy, that you wouldn't have said that if it was Clinton or Gore that got us into this mess. By the way, you may want to post this one next time you're on freerepublic.com:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/6/18/161016/461

And for those sticklers who demand sources:

http://www.democrats.org/pdfs/gop_kosovo.pdf

>And now, as Bush admits, its about the oil fields.<

Yeah, right. Filled up your car, lately? Katrina be damned, we've been paying top dollar for gas for the past year...I've seen no oil benefit from Iraq. And none of us ever will.

This canard from the left is as tired and inaccurate as the canards about secret weapons from the right.

"I worry that Sheehan's message could be counter productive. I believe she is inadvertently sending a clear message to the
insurgients that they are on the right track. "

The insurgency began to swell in number and effectiveness before she started her crusade. They got on the track they are on before Sheehan entered the scene. Her words do not make bombs more explosive, bullets more deadly, nor are her words responsible for the ethnic/religious tensions that divide Iraq.

"We MUST protect the innocent people of our world."

Protecting the innocent was not the mission. The mission was to find weapons. It was a self serving war...to protect ourselves from an imaginary arsenal. And now, as Bush admits, its about the oil fields.

Plus there is something unnerving about a forced revolution. The Iraqi people didn't ask us for aid in their liberation. We told them they were going to be liberated...on our terms, our rules.

Galen
Rick, et al. -
Forgive me the second post, but earlier today Galen took offense at my comments regarding evangelicals. Again, my direct quote was "self-styled".

Galen's comment: "My old evangelical preacher - who would rather die than utter such a callous phrase as you suggest - used to have a phrase for the type of feeling I am having. He called it "sanctified pride."

Keep sittin' in that comfortable chair banging out wry prejudices, Steve. The rest of us have work to do."

I recognize that, Galen, and accept it at face value. Now, please read the following and tell me where I'm wrong:

http://www.ekklesia.co.uk/content/news_syndication/article_050831.shtml


I did not criticize evangelicals, I criticized "self-styled" evangelicals.

Galen, you owe me an apology.

Steve B

Cindy,

It's odd that the "global traffic cop" scenario comes to the fore here. Wasn't Dubya the guy who, during the 2000 campaign, railed against "nation building"?

This is a president who does not care about anyone but himself. Telling the American People that "it's hard work..." and asking us to make sacrifices to clean up his mess. Meanwhile, back at "Whitehouse West", TX (population 1), our Commander in Chimp is busy workin' hard...on a 35 (okay, 33) day vacation. Last time I looked, bike riding and entertaining the press corp weren't on my "honey do" lists. And when was the last time any of us had as many vacations as the Shrub? Some sacrifice, eh?

Don't get me wrong, I do believe that there is a time and a place for military action (just not Iraq) and that those young men and women we've sent into harm's way need our support. Not this partisan bickering that has our nation so polarized that we can't tell which among us need the lithium. Smearing Cindy (my new hero) Sheehan, instead of discussing her message, is one of the most disgusting events in recent memory.

What better support can we give or soldiers and sailors, than to give them a pat on the back and tell them it's time to come home?

C'mon Cindy, we love you dearly, but ya' gotta stop drinkin' the koolaid.

VR/
Andrew

Jim Davis,
Thank you for that list.
Cindy


Hey Frank,
How ya doin'?

I'm sorry it's taken so long for me to respond but I've been hip deep in alligators here. For what it's worth;I don't consider myself qualified to comment,on Cindy Sheehan's behavior; I have three healthy sons and three healthy daughters. I do have a dear friend who can answer. Sue Wood,is a single mother whose eldest son,Matt, worked at the only grocery store in town to contribute financially to his family. Matt joined the Marines about a year and a half ago-- despite my mom-ly protestations about any branch of the armed forces that would be first on any scene and last to leave. He would smile good
naturedly and nod and indicate plainly that he had no intention of listening. His mind was made up, you see, no one could have disuaded him. That's what I tell myself. Matt was injured and burned in a incident when an RPG hit the Humvee he was driving. He drove to safety then ran around to the back of the vehicle and pulled his buddies out one by one. His Crew Chief died and one of the other Marines had to have a leg amputated. Matt spent time in the hospital. Later, during his funeral, one of the officers spoke. He said, "Matt couldn't wait to get out of the hospital, he was anxious to get back out on patrol with his buddies." He went on to say that after Matthew's release from the hospital he never went any place without an officer or two in tow. He said, " Puckett liked being seen with officers and we liked being seen with a real hero." The ink on Matt's medical release papers was still wet when he went back out on patrol with his buddies. Two officers came to his mother's tiny government housing apartment around two a.m.last September to give her the news about her oldest boy. I can't even get my mind around the scene.They told Sue that Matt's Humvee had hit a mine and he was killed.

Matt told Sue he believed in the war. He said he majority of the people where he was stationed welcomed and appreciated the American troops. He said their mission is important and they should not stop until the people who had been liberated were able to fend for themselves. He also told Sue, " If anybody asks you what they can do for me-- tell them not to vote for Kerry."
Sue told that at Matt's funeral and took a lot of fire for it in the local newspaper, the editor accused her publicly of "politicizing " her son's death. Sue had only wanted to convey her dead son's wishes to the crowd that filled the Mason High School football stadium to overflowing.

As I said before I don't feel I have the right to criticize a mother whose son lost his life for freedom's sake in service of my Country. But Sue has the right-- she has every right. Here, you can find what she said;
http://www.sanangelostandardtimes.com/sast/news_local/article/0,1897,SAST_4956_4032109,00.html

If the link doesn't work you can go to the San Angelo Standard Times website and type Sue Ann Wood in the search box.


I worry that Sheehan's message could be counter productive. I believe she is inadvertently sending a clear message to the
insurgients that they are on the right track.

In my own opinion; we are the most powerful nation on this earth. I could not care less what the motivating force
was behind our declaration of war against Sadaam-- I am only glad we went and that we are there. I wish we had enough money and enough troops to take it to every blood thirsty tyrant who inflicts pain and injustice on innocent people. While the historic arguement that we have problems aplenty at home is true-- we are the world's foremost superpower. Those to whom much has been given much shall be required. We must be the world's police-- nobody else wants the job and clearly, somebody has to do it. Did we not learn anything from our delayed entry into Nazi Germany? We MUST protect the innocent people of our world.

It's Kitty Genovese all over again-- we must not, as a nation, stand at the window and listen to the screams, doing nothing to stop the butchery.

Cindy

Thought I'd try to spin a new thread here.

It was early on in the days I first hung out here that Harlan learned what a determined asp I can be in an argument; pertaining to his famous/infamous piece of long ago about the AUTEUR, I challenged him through long nights on parts of his argument. I was outside his house after midnight tossing pebbles at his window to get his attention; I disguised myself as a CandyGram Delivery boy to get him to open the door. But he wouldn't budge, and held fast to his position...while I had to insist I had one helluva point.

Then my own girlfriend took the low end and agreed with him about everything. And therein lies his tactic. This guy wins over the women, leaving you in your tattered Sub-4s to wonder just what the hell happened. Yeah, the bastard takes your women. For the first time ever I learned to respect Harlan Ellison.

Fastforward to today. It's come to my attention that - it SEEMS to me - however well-intentioned, many vocalize Harlan's sentiment about the Auteur Theory, particularly the unfair barriers it often poses to writers. Problem is, they know nada about the legitimate definition of the auteur, nor the variables of the debate. So, they misunderstand Harlan's argument - at least part of it - and, if someone like myself refers to those rare directorial talents who'd really achieved art with their own visions as AUTEURS, he gets FRIED. Why? Because these people take the argument to the most shallow level, failing to make the obvious distinction between individualistic directors who busted their asses to get their visions on the screen and the "hired hands" lucky enough to get a script a studio wants them to do.

This differs from the issue of the Auteur Theory, a role copped by ALL directors whether they have the talent or not; was once someone else's vision is taken apart and bastardized so that THESE guys can call it THEIR vision.

So, as I did on the "other side", I'm gonna paste Harlan's OWN comments on the subject (adding my own)for clarity...because unlike some here, he makes the logical DISTINCTIONS:

I first asked a bit of a trick question. WHICH of these are auteurs? Coppola, Altman, or Kubrick? (hint: ALL of them had collaborators in the writing process)

The ever-sageful responses:

"None of the above"
"Altman doesn't even come close"

HARLAN ELLISON's comment about the AUTEURS (referring strictly to directors still living and working at the time he made the statement):

"...the invidious nature of the industry...insufferable because of the auteur theory and the considerable clout directors now possess. We're not discussing here those six directors worldwide who are the best, the six whose individual voices - whether you like their films or not - set them apart from all other directors who are merely craftspersons of greater or lesser ability...I'll let you have that list of the six directors. Just take the list and remember I'm never wrong, and shut up. They are: Kurosawa, Altman, Coppola, Resnais, Bunuel, Kubrick, and Fellini"

"What's that?" "That's SEVEN, not six?" "Well, jeezus, nobody's perfect."

With VERY little tweaking, all but some minor quibbles, that aligns strongly with my own sentiments. You look deeply into someone's track record, not by your own shallow, poorly informed, one-dimensional take on a symantic.

Yes indeed: directors as Harlan listed, and others since like Scorcese, others long before like Hitchcock, Lang, Billy Wilder, Chaplin, and Eisenstein (despite Harlan's excluding him from his choices, one HAS to include BERGMAN, even though he never clicked for me personally either; no matter how you slice it, Bergman can hardly be dispensed with as a "mere craftsman"; that was among my minor quibbles with his original argument), stand out in very clear ways from those he corralled as the "craftspersons", or as what I often think of as "the hired hands". It is the latter, the herd, as it were, who often undermine the original intended value of the term "auteur" (which rose out of a condition that was opposite today's: the director - even those with vast gifts and personal visions - had NADA to say) by monopolizing credit at the expense of someone else's efforts, participation, and perhaps even voice and vision.

So for anyone who still can't detect a pattern here, just break from your obdurate fixation on the semantics and assess the KIND of investment an artist makes throughout his whole career.

Just TAKE that, and remember I'm NEVER wrong, and SHUT up.

Saying, "I don't like classical music." is a lot like saying, "I don't like fiction." You're declaiming at a level so general that what you're saying can't have any meaning. From Saint-Saëns' "Carnival of the Animals" to Webern's "Five Sacred Songs"; from the polonaises of Chopin to Debussy's "Little Negro"; from the smoking hot "Carmen" to "The Pirates of Penzance"; from the crystalline counterpoints of Bach's "Art of the Fugue" to the dreamy longing of the second movement in Beethoven's 7th; and, oh yeah, Mozart; the field is vast indeed and there is with absolute certainty something for everyone within its scope.

To miss Classical Music is to miss one of the few unequivocally good things that we humans have ever done, and I feel a genuine and non-snarky sense of regret for anyone that has talked themselves out of exploring it.

"Waiting with anticipation...?"

How about "Anticipating".

Ye 'ole Editor.....-TODD

Katrina
I'm waiting with anticipation for Frank Church's next missive, blaming the Bush Administration on seeding the clouds to produce Katrina and knock Cindy Sheehan and the Iraq War off the front pages.

All jokes aside (or was it a joke.........), the destruction Katrina wreaked is stunning. Biloxi had built itself up as quite the tourist attraction for those into casinos, and their business has effectively washed away. New Orleans is being abandoned for a few months.....ABANDONED! Shades of many a science fiction / horror movie depicting a bleak future.

As with the California fault lines, there has always been that sense of impending disaster with how New Orleans was situated by the sea. It's been quite the interesting, and scary 'future' that this new millennium has already brought us.

-TODD

Oboy
So, we suffered a little damage during the hurricane, when it passed directly over us last Thursday. Not much, considering what other people further along its path have had to deal with, just a couple of days without power and a little leak through the back wall that wet and warped our nice wooden flooring.

We want to get in touch with our management company, to get the crack in the foundations repaired. Problem is, the management company has changed hands so many times, of late, that we don't even know where it is. (We send in the payments, but rarely bother contacting them for repairs and whatnot). Today Judi manages to track down the number, and finds that service has been interrupted.

Then she checks the area code.

Our management company is in New Orleans.

Steve B wrote,
"As I sit here in my comfortable (though rather warm) and dry Southern California family room, watching the destruction and human tragedy in the Crescent City, I have to wonder how long it will be before some self-styled evangelical preacher announces this is God's wrath upon the new Gomorrah..."

And I am wondering how many dollars will be given by evangelical's to lend aid to the survivors of this disaster. How many will offer prayers? How many will volunteer their time to sort through the stinking rubbage, hand-out food stores and haul sandbags? And let's not even dare to think of the "self-styled" youth groups who will band together to pour foundations and raise walls for new homes in the impoverished sections of this city.

My old evangelical preacher - who would rather die than utter such a callous phrase as you suggest - used to have a phrase for the type of feeling I am having. He called it "sanctified pride."

Keep sittin' in that comfortable chair banging out wry prejudices, Steve. The rest of us have work to do.

HARLAN

I'm sure you already know this, but if you don't: Caitlin Kiernan has posted on her blog (http://www.livejournal.com/users/greygirlbeast/154691.html) that she's been unable to get in touch with Poppy, as phones, both landline and cell, are down in southern Mississippi. Wish I had better news, but that's all I know for now.

EVERYONE: If you're a fan of Poppy Brite's work, or you just want to help someone whose home has likely been destroyed by Katrina, there's a PayPal section on her website for donations: http://poppyzbrite.com/cats.html. Usually, it's for the care and feeding of her many pets, but her needs will be greater in the weeks and months ahead, so help if you can.

God forbid I should be defending Frank Church here, but I don't think there's any contradiction in using "serious" music (i.e. music that rewards close listening) as background. I may get more out of (using last night's bedtime listening as an example) Bobby Hutcherson's "Dialogue" when I plug in the headphones, lie down, and shut my eyes, but that doesn't mean I can't enjoy it while I'm cooking dinner or sweeping the floors. Whether or not you can concentrate on your reading while you listen to music is for you alone to say; if you can, more power to you, and I fail to see that it constitutes any sort of insult to music or musicians.

demanding music

I'm totally with Julian on this one.

I could offer a snarky comment about it being disrespectful to the music, the musicians, or the composer to do something else while "listening" to music, but the truth of the matter is, I simply can't do it.

That goes for fairly simple poppy stuff as well as the Gentle Giant, Stravinsky, Bobs, Ravel, Bartok, Bobby McFerrin, Take Six, and other material I love most. (And yeah, Julian, I've owned a few Rush and UK albums.)

My wife is regularly irritated when we dine in public places and my attention is drawn away from her scintillating talk to whatever's being piped in by the management. But I can't help it. I would just as soon dine with NO music playing ANYWHERE. More often than not, I can identify a tune by just the rhythm track of bass and percussion.

If I were painting a room or gardening, I suppose it would be possible, but "reading or working" in the sense of writing? No way. I recall being able to study in college a little to the calmest, quietest stuff -- say, Jean Michel-Jarre's "Oxygene" or Kitaro -- but nothing else.

Music of almost any kind demands my attention.

Open Topics
As I sit here in my comfortable (though rather warm) and dry Southern California family room, watching the destruction and human tragedy in the Crescent City, I have to wonder how long it will be before some self-styled evangelical preacher announces this is God's wrath upon the new Gomorrah...
______________________________________________________________

Also: Before anyone takes Jonathan McIntosh's accusations of Roald Dahl's supposed racism to an extreme, you need to note that McIntosh is a known provocateur who stages deliberately inflammatory photographic exhibitions around Boston. He writes as much to get you incensed as to make a valid point. I'm not saying that this is a bad thing, but consider the motives of the author as well as the points he's making.

Steve B

Appreciation of Classical Music
Shed not a tear for me, for it has been a great life and continues to be so, but one aspect I would regret if I were prone to such a thing is that I do not appreciate classical music (should such a generic beast exist).

Frank set me off a bit when he wrote, "Harlan seems to enjoy the more demanding classical music, as do I. Nothing quite like it when you are reading or working." I can't understand this at all. If it's demanding then it shouldn't be what you listen to while working or reading!

I say this having grown up in a home with every radio set to one classical station (or another, but one at a time) so that my father could be surrounded with what I can only call "his" music wherever he should wander. The result was my great desire to listen to anything different - and to learn to ignore background classical music. I learned well. I can ignore background classical music better than anyone I know. I like Prokofiev too, Frank, but only when my attention is solely focused on it. If it's demanding I like it, and I appreciate live performances for the technical aspects and the artistry, flawed or not.

I suppose listening while working is ergonomically correct; it sets a proper mood if well chosen for the task at hand, establishes a pace, and allows for those oh so important mental tides that flow between concentration on work and appreciation for a particular passage - tides that can strengthen and aid momentum. If only it were so for me ... but it is not.

Thankfully I worked at the NYPL Donnell Media center following my college years, and was introduced to a huge range of music by my fellow library staff and patrons, but still - "classical" music eludes me. I like it, but I cannot put the energy into learning enough about it to really know it or appreciate it because my "ignore" mechanism kicks in.

Finally, this brings back the memory of a Village Voice article, probably from 1985, called "Rush is the best band in the world". In it the reviewer was discussing another band (Featuring Eddie Jobson on Violin and Piano/Keyboards). I believe this is an exact quote, "What UK fails to understand is that it's not merely difficult to rock in 9/4 time, it's impossible." I did like UK. I do like demanding music. I think I'll go grab some Vinyl now. I feel better. :)

Posting here as more people'll see it on this side than the other:

http://movies.yahoo.com/feature/goodnightandgoodluck.html

Nothing to get too frantic about, just the trailer for a movie. Looks pretty good. I think there's some type of subtext or something in it, but not sure if it's relevant to today or not. I just hope they add color to it before it hits theaters.

I have not lost my marbles completely... (just mostly)
Susan,

I absolutely have NOT forgot the check. But... you made mention of a special deal on hardback... and new Rabbit Hole. Left my distracted pea brain confused. Thus, I am waiting for said Rabbit Hole to clarify what is the situation and will dispatch said check for some order on some book forthwith. I think.

Thanks for the eternal patience you must possess to deal with flaky folks like me!
Peg

CALLING HARLAN
HEY SUSAN (or HARLAN if you read this first): I've gotta hit the road right now, but I wanted to send a written request (sort of a warning flare) asking if tomorrow would be okay to call Harlan and talk about Geo. Martin. Fifteen or twenty minutes of recollections and musing (about working in TV together, about his writing) would be all I need. If that'll work, just type in Yes, Dorman -- you Fuckin' Nuhdz! -- and I'll have the recorder ready when I call (and if you tell me _when_ you'd prefer to talk -- morning or afternoon -- I can accomodate -- as long as it isn't between 2pm and 2:45 p.m. CST, when I'll be picking up the kid from school).
With thanks and fealty,
I remain the Honorary Jew (who feels guilty about damn near everything), Dorman

Though Katrina degraded to a Category 4 before hitting land east of New Orleans, it still did an incredible amount of damage. The Gulfport-Biloxi area of Mississippi is decimated, and water is pouring into N.O. from a 200-foot breach in its levee. Thousands are homeless, and without food, electricity or potable water. If you want to help, here are some places to go:

(Specify donations for victims of Hurricane Katrina.)

* American Red Cross, 1-800-435-7669, P.O. Box 37243, Washington, D.C. 20013. On the Web at www.redcross.org

* Catholic Charities USA, 1-800-919-9338, Hurricane Katrina, PO Box 25168, Alexandria, VA 22313-9788. On the Web at www.catholiccharitiesusa.org

* Christian Contractors Association, 1-800-278-7703, 2009 South Broad St., Brooksville, FL 34604. On the Web at www.ccaministry.org

* Church World Service, 1-800-297-1516, P.O Box 968, Elkhart, IN, 46515. On the Web at www.churchworldservice.org

* Convoy of Hope, 1-800-988-0664 or 417 823-8998, 330 S Patterson, Springfield, MO 65802. On the Web at www.convoyofhope.org

* Emergency Animal Rescue Services the disaster rescue program of United Animal Nations, (916) 429-2457, PO Box 188890, Sacramento, CA 95818. On the Web at www.uan.org

* Episcopal Relief and Development/U.S. Hurricane Relief Fund, 1-800-334-7626, ext. 5129, PO Box 12043, Newark, NJ, 07101-5043. On the Web at www.er-d.org

* Lutheran Disaster Response, 1-800-638-3522, 8765 W Higgins Road, Chicago, IL 60631. On the Web at www.elca.org

* Mennonite Disaster Service, 717 859-2210, 1018 Main St. Akron, PA 17501. On the Web at www.mds.mennonite.net

* Presbyterian Church, 1-800-872-3283, Att. PCUSA, Individual Remittance Processing, P.O. Box 643700, Pittsburgh, PA 15624-3700. Write on check: #000169. On the Web at www.pcusa.org

* Salvation Army, 1-800-725-2769, Salvation Army Headquarters, PO Box 269, Alexandria, VA 22313 with a note "Katrina Disaster relief." On the Web at www.salvationarmyusa.org

* Southern Baptist Disaster Relief, 770 410-6133, PO Box 116543, Atlanta, GA 30368. On the Web at www.namb.net/dr Make checks payable to: NAMB.

* United Methodist Committee on Relief, 1-800-554-8583, 475 Riverside Drive, Room 330, New York, NY 10115. Use advance #982410. On the web at www.umcor.org

*FEMA Charity tips: http://www.fema.gov/rrr/help2.shtm

*National Voluntary Organizations Active in Disaster: http://www.nvoad.org/

Patrick & Teresa Nielsen Hayden have an excellent page of Katrina links at http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/006666.html#006666

And, of course, Poppy Z. Brite's blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/docbrite/

Though I grew up in the Northeast, I've spent the last fifteen years in Florida, and consider myself an honorary Southerner. My heart is sick at the suffering along the Gulf coast today, mostly among people who had no other choice but to stay and rough it out. Please, help if you can, because the ramifications of Katrina are still playing out, and will be worse than anything we can imagine.

SUPPOSEDLY, Dahl had a shade of anti-Semitic. But there are some Joes here with better information about that than I have (Dooner? Ellison?).

I wonder if any of his racial views can be read in any subtle way in the Oompa Loompas (put the critters ta work with no pay, etc). The original Wonka film is an adult movie that PRETENDS to be a children's outing. There's lotsa subtext in there, and given its humanistic messages (blatantly aimed at the adult world) it's hard to imagine Dahl ultimately being THAT simple and shallow (check out his passages in 36 HOURS about what living in the concentration camps did to human beings, where survival is in its last extremity).

From Publishers Weekly:

Roald Dahl: "An RAF fighter pilot, war hero, art collector, philanthropist and doting father, he was also, by his account, a wartime British spy who snooped on Americans in Washington, D.C., a bully, an anti-Semite, a vain, cantankerous alcoholic given to cruelty and outbursts."
Copyright 1994 Reed Business Information, Inc.

According to this article, the new Charlie And The Chocolate Factory film is racist. It also talks about how Roald Dahl had to edit the first version of his book, because of calls that it was racist.

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=30&ItemID=8609

So, would you say this is just pc or does he make a good point?

----------

Harlan seems to enjoy the more demanding classical music, as do I. Nothing quite like it when you are reading or working.

Prokofiev is one of my faves.

--------------

We should expect Bush to politicize the hurricane any day. Crime lords never change.

Eric I think Andre Codrescu gave Colleen permission to copy.

By all means necessary
FinderDoug!

By all means, we should hang out sometime. Heck, we've already met in NYC and Cleveland, may as well meet up sometime in our own forest. I'm in Germany starting this Friday (I'm going to finally visit Dachau on this trip, since my friends live about an hour West of Munich), and then on Monday the whatever, I'm flying to Rome for the remainder of the week. I'm back in town on the evening of September 10th. Let's try to plan on something late that week.

The reason I say "finally" visit Dachau is because I've been to Germany 2 times already, and have either failed (not-likely considering my tenacity) or avoided (very likely considering my avoidance of emotional situations) seeking out socially and historically important locations. I'm afraid I'm going to be overwhelmed.

An internal debate is raging on whether or not I should take my camera.

So, yes! Let's do dinner after I get back.

-Keith

Balakirev
Harlan,

Not that they actually have the CD (it's not on their website), but you might want place a phone call to the folks running http://www.russiandvd.com. They have what looks like the previous CD in the catalog (SUCD 10-00152), so they may know something about the rest of the collection.

What makes the hunt difficult is that I'm not sure whether the CD goes by the name of the first track (The King Lear overture), or if it falls under "Anthology of Russian Symphony Music" (my guess is that the cd in question is Vol. 6). None of the web sites I've searched come close to having a complete set of the latter, and obviously no one is having much luck with the former.

Still, give russiandvd a try, maybe they will point you further in the right direction...

RussianDVD.com
phone: (800)-901-5543 (ORDERS ONLY)
phone: (718)-934-5048

Julian

C-A-I-T-L-I-N
She is fine, and she spells her name with an "apostrophe thingie" over the second "I".

see here:

http://www.caitlinrkiernan.com/journal.html

dig it,
Neal

Well, since no-one ran with it on the Forum, I'll try it here:

Colleen, where did you get permission to copy the Balakirev? Sorry to pry, but unauthorized copying of licensed work is a big no-no around here, so you need to qualify when you use a freighted word like "copy."

New Orleans
??????Any word on Andre Codrescu?

Thank you
Harlan,

Thank you for your generous offer to assist me with the typewriter problem via phone. I never imagined that you'd ask me to call you, and the fact that you did so is much appreciated. And more than a little cool.

Thanks again.

Rick

Superdome
Frank, the roof has already buckled in places. The Mayor says the 8K or so people inside are not in serious danger, however. There's a few more hours left before the immediate danger is over.

I fear for Orleans, I do. It seems the wind and rain will not be as bad as reported, thank God. But this does bode bad for the future.

They really built the Superdome well, eh? Groan.

I did notice the class structure element in who could leave town and who could not. The Dome crowd seems to be mostly African American. Classism and racism lives.

------------

Our Cindy, give me your take on Cindy Sheehan?

Harlan, before your search request, I had not heard of Mily Balakirev. In my net search I found plenty of info on him and cds of his music. Looks like I'll need to add to my classical library. As for the Melodyia label, I did find the following: Fantasy (10 inch r.1962 (live at comp) for 10 pounds).

David

COLLEEN: Thank you.

P.A.: Thankyou thankyou thankyou thankyou.........

Relieved, Yr. pal, Harlan

Brothers Grimm
I did check it out. I love Grimm's Fairytales. I also love Terry Gilliam's work. However, "The Brothers Grimm" ranks somewhere below "Jabberwocky" for me. Slow beginning; terrible CGI; requires incredible leaps of faith to accept the plot; hamhanded references to the fairytales; AWFUL performances from everyone (except perhaps Heath Ledger), and after all that -- at least forty-five minutes spent waiting for it to reach its painfully obvious whiz-bang ending. You could see touches of Gilliam's whimsy in it, but they were far overpowered by the Need For Action and slavish devotion to a storyline that wasn't so hot in the first place. Too bad.

But a lot of people, most with children, left happy and smiling, so good news for Terry Gilliam. For my own purposes, I hope he chooses a product and team better suited to him next time.

Post ing on behalf of Jim Davis
Harlan: According to TJ Crowley's livejournal:

www.livejournal.com/users/tjcrowley

Poppy Z. Brite has evacuated New Orleans to her mother's house. She should be reasonably safe there. She will be updating her blog from there, if you want to stay posted on her whereabouts and well-being.

PAB

Balakirev recording
Harlan:
I have a copy of the Balakirev recording-it's not for sale, but I do have permission to make a copy-will do that and send to you c/o of HERC.
Cheers,
Colleen

Films (oops)
FILMS (hit the wrong key -- I wont resurface for a month, promise): you guys gotta check out "The Brothers Grimm." I only love everything Gilliam does (even "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas," which a lotta folks around here seem to hate). Me and the kid enjoyed the hell out of it. --DTS

Friends, Hurricanes and Films
HERE"S HOPING DeNoux, Brite and Kiernan get out of New Orleans; and I hope Nevada Barr -- another writer friend whose phone number I'm trying to find again -- also gets out. I was in Corpus Christi for Ceilia (back when the internet was just twinkle in Al Gore's eye), and that storm was a category 3, I believe. The eye passed directly over us; every last fence in our new neighborhood toppled like a row of dominoes; the arches which made up the doorway in the the house across the street from us lifted up and slammed back down; small trees were uprooted; nails were loosened from boards and driven into the sides of houses -- and other objects -- like arrows into targets; the sound of the winds outside were a once in the a lifetime experience. Our streets and yards were flooded for days, and it took a long time to restore the power. Athough the city is at sea level, we weren't right on the coast -- inland at least 10 15 miles -- and we weren't situated in veritable soup bowl like New Orleans. A category five will do much worse.

The Balakirev may turn out to be a rare CD.

I've done some poking around, and the only available Svetlanov/USSR Symphony version of "King Lear" that I could find is on vinyl (Melodiya C1021323005). By FinderDoug's account, this is one of the three pieces on the CD in question, but the CD itself remains MIA.

LEE --- DOUG --- ET AL:

Bless you both for your efforts re the Rimsky-Korsakov, and I await its appearance from whomever with bated breath. I will, of course, reciprocate to the 10th power for this largesse, but ...

In truth, the Rimsky-Korsakov was an "oh, yeah, by the way, I'm also looking for..." which was never a location problem. It was an also-ran sidebar to my REAL STUMPER OF A NEED, which is the Balakirov on Melodiya. I've tried everything, and not even the post on this board by someone (whose name, I apologize, I cannot remember) advising me that Melodiya sometimes googles-up under a spelling different by one letter, well, not even that helped.

So if any one (or more) of you have nothing to do, would you use your e.smarts to find me a place where I can just simply BUY that one myself? I really don't need any of you to front the purchase, just a Chingachgook to point me in the correct direction.

Yr. pal, Harlan

RICK: I apologize for the double post, but this is in reply to Harlan, and I think it's appropriate given the urgency of the situation.

HARLAN: Thanks, man. I should've known that you'd be on top of things. I hope Poppy heeds the warnings, and hauls ass out of there with her husband Chris and as many cats as they can stuff in the car. As for Caitlin, as far as I'm aware, she lives in Atlanta, so she should be okay, though she'll get a drenching from the remnants of Katrina.

*sigh* A Cat 5 on New Orleans. They say Katrina is stronger than Andrew was, and I remember how horrible the devastation was in Homestead in '92. The worst thing is, that section of Louisiana and the Gulf coast is one of the poorest areas in the country, so many residents there don't even OWN a car. They'll have little choice but to ride it out. I don't even want to turn on the news tomorrow, as I dread that it will be like watching a multi-channel snuff film. Those poor fucking people.

PAUL MOUNTS: Yep, that was indeed MISS LONELYHEARTS, by Nathanael West (one of my favorite authors).

REPLY TO JIM DAVIS

way ahead of you, pal. Yesterday I called my friend O'Neil De Noux, ex-police detective and superior mystery writer, and begged him to a) get the hell out of there with deb and the kids, b) get in the car and drive here to stay as long as necessary till Nwalins was back aboveflood, and c) call both Poppy Z. Brite and Caitlan Kiernan, and offer them the same immediate sanctuary here at Ellison Wonderland. He was very surprised I got through, since the lines are choked, but he promised he'd find a way to pass the urgent on to Poppy and Caitlan. So far, nothing more.

Worried, like you; yr. pal, Harlan

LOVE LIFE GOIN' NOWHERE FAST? TURN TA HARLAN...

"You get a FEMALE cassowary (an ibis will do in an emergency)..."

A female. Gotcha. Gotcha. Don't go TOO fast, now. I'm writing this down with a worn quill. Goats were my alternate preference, speaking for myself, but if it's a damn heron I should go with - well, I'll try that out.

"and get her excited by three-fingering her clitoris..."

Right. Right. Right. 3 fingers.

"till she orgasms..."

Oh. How does she do that? Well, never mind - I'm sure she'll tell me.

"thus producing a thin amber fluid"

...a thin...fluid. Does this come out of her or ME? Well, never mind - I'm sure she'll tell me.

"which you then suck out with a bendee-straw"

With a STRRR-AAAAWWWW. No TONGUE action, eh? What would an ibis have to say about that? Well, never mind - I'm sure it will tell me.

"and apply directly to your friend's anus."

My friend's a-NUSSSS. Gotcha. Gotcha. Don't do it to a stranger. Maybe that's where I went wrong LAST time.

OK. I got it all down and I'm OFF on my NEXT date. Not knowing how to handle women, maybe this advice will lead to a successful evening for once.

AND I'll make sure THIS time I bring a FRIEND along. Maybe I'll bring some BACK STREET BOYS music with me.

Miss Lonelyhearts by Nathanael West!

Dear Unca Harlan, Help Me, Help Me

I am sixteen years old now and I dont know what to do and would appreciate it if you could tell what to do. When I was a little girl it was not so bad because I got used to the kids on the block makeing fun of me, but now I would like to have boy friends like the other girls and go out on Saturday nites, but no boy will take me becuase I was born without a nose--although I am a good dancer and have a nice shape and my father buys me pretty clothes.

I sit and look at myself all day and cry. I have a big hole in the middle of my face that scares people even myself so I cant blame the boys for not wanting to take me out. My mother loves me, but she crys terrible when she looks at me. What did I do to deserve such a terrible bad fate?

Sincerely yours,
Desperate

(NEVER complain about the questions you get--it could always be worse. And a shiny new penny to the first person who guesses the source of the quote above.)

In all seriousness: Harlan, if you haven't done so already, get on the horn, call your buddy Poppy Z. Brite, and tell her to get the hell out of New Orleans, PRONTO. According to her LiveJournal page at http://www.livejournal.com/users/docbrite/, she's staying because of her cats and her rental car contract. Please explain that a direct hit by a Category 5 hurricane is nothing to fuck around with, and by sitting it out, she is risking the health and even the life of everyone in her house. I'm not a personal friend of hers, but I am an admirer of her writing, and it would depress me beyond words if her upcoming novel, SOUL KITCHEN, turned out to be a posthumous release. Thanks.

Lee - Not a problem. Within my clan, there is ALWAYS room for music, so the Barenboim disc won't go to waste.

Cramer - I know there are about two-score drugstores in Arlington, some of them open 24 hours. Get back on your meds! And for god's sake, stay away from the panda paddock! (But seriously, I should haul myself east and we should do dinner, though your new extra-cirriculars scare the bejeezus out of me.)

Muchas Gracias!
Dear Unca Harlan,

The generous offer of a 2X4 shampoo notwithstanding, thank you for your answers. They were most helpful.

I had no female cassowary, but the National Zoo had several ibis’. I found a female and began following your instructions when 2 zoo employees reported me to the Park Police, who handcuffed me on the ground in front of a Japanese tour group. I don’t have to tell you, rationalizing your behavior and explaining yourself to cops after being handcuffed is not easy! However, my story was sufficiently implausible to have the ring of truth, and since I was not penetrating the ibis, I was able to convince them it was only a case of heavy petting (I had not yet used the bendee-straw). I was escorted out of the Zoo, however, and have yet to devise a plan to get back.

My friend is taking Immodium AD in the meantime.

Interestingly, the cassowary in my basement became highly stimulated by the scent on my fingers and began producing enormous quantities of jism, which I was able to use, along with its downy belly feathers, as a permanent solution to my plumbing problem.

Again, thank you for taking the time to school me.

-Keith

Ellison Quote
Dear All,

I'm trying to find a Latin aphorism quoted by Mr. Ellison in an interview a few years back (thought it was in "Locus," but didn't find it). I remember the translation as being along the lines of "He is a fool who tries to please everyone." I would like to hang it on my studio wall or have it tattooed backwards on my forehead, so, obviously, spelling is important.

Thank you! Bret

Ohhhhh, THE LIGHT WAS ON!!!

LOLOLOL!!!!
:)
Cindy

Kinda makes me glad I didn't try to answer the questions.

For the typewriter question, I was gonna ask Rick to describe the various non-letter controls on the front of the thing, because _one_ of them had to be for the Tab Stops. Then, failing that, I'd have suggested looking inside the thing, to find those little spring-loaded pins which act as "stops" for the tab-stops, and twinging them by hand.

As for the plumbing question... I'd hafta look at it. Home ownership has forced upon me the ability to solve plumbing problems all by my lonesome. So, I can sweat joints, run pipe, install valves, zone the pipes, install sinks, rebuild toilets, stop'em from running, replace parts... If the mortgage broker license didn't come through, I could always fix peoples' pipes freelance.

As for "The Aristocrats," I actually thought of two new tweaks on the routine. One is a diferent punchline that's not terribly funny. The other is dark. Very dark. Only funny if you think being dark is funny. Won't share it. Why? Can't tell it very well. Delivery sucks. Sentences fragment. Joke dies. Entropy reigns. Time. Space. Fragments. Loneliness. Silence. End.

I need some sleep.

Is anyone else getting the feeling that nihilism is the next "in" thing in today's films? You know, not as a mindset, but more as a kind of fad?

I've clashed with Roger Ebert's views on movies before, but the back-and-forth letter communication he has with the filmmakers of CHAOS just makes me want to shout, "BOOyah!"

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050818/COMMENTARY/508190304

GEE, I'M GLAD Y'ALL PAID ATTENTION

to my pathetic request not to be harrassed for a short while. The new questions are SOOOOOOO plangent, I can see where my squalid need for a little surcease, a spot of peace'n'quiet goes unheeded.

First, congratulations to Rick for figuring out his typewriter. Naturally, it seemed so urgent that I posted as soon as I got here, not reading on. Oh well.

Now we come to Cramer.

If you were here, and I had a 2x4, I promise you solemnly that I would whack yo onion head off its spindly vine!

My acquaintanceship with plumbing, on which I base my urgings to wannabe writers that they should take up the Stilson wrench and not the raven's quill ... is a lifetime of having to PAY THE MOTHERFUCKERS EXORBITANT RATES!!!!!!

Beyond that, Keith sweetie, I am no more hip than thou.

As for your friend with the buttocks glued, any fool knows the answer to a solution for dissolving cassowary jism. You get a FEMALE cassowary (an ibis will do in an emergency) and get her excited by three-fingering her clitoris till she orgasms, thus producing a thin amber fluid, which you then suck out with a bendee-straw, and apply directly to your friend's anus.

And of course, we call this rigor ... THE ARISTOCRATS.

Repeat the above to your hot girl friend, and that'll solve THAT problem.

Yr. pal, Harlan

-------------------------------------------------------------------Why me, gawd, why me??????-----------------------------------

REPLY TO RICK FROM TECH-GUY ELLISON

Not surprisingly, Kristin, as the user of a technology that is forgotten by most arrivistes who wallow in computerese, I DO INDEED know pretty much everything there is to know about the Olympia manual...both standard office machine and portable.

Rick, get my phone number from Webmaster Wyatt, call me, and I'll walk you through it in ten seconds. Unlike futzing around with hit this key and hit that key and slash dot this and input that...it is a VERY simple matter to cure BOTH your problems. I just need to know which model you've got, and where they put certain doohickeys ON that model. But, I assure you, it's dickyduck simple, and I'll happily step by step you. Just call.

Yr. pal, Harlan

Problem solved
Thanks to all who offered suggestions, but as is usually the case, soon after I posted my request for help, I figured out how to correct the problems. And, as I suspected, the solutions were right in front of me.

As I said, there's no "tab set" key, but there is a switch to the left of the keys with + and - markings. I'd initially ignored it, thinking it was for setting how hard the keys would strike the platen. Then this lightbulb went off in my head, and a voice said, "try that switch right in front of you."

So I did, and it worked.

Rick

Urgent questions need answers asap
Dear Unca Harlan,

I know you constantly recommend people enter into the plumbing profession instead of writing…so I assume you must have some plumbing experience.

Here’s my question:

An incompetent plumber recently installed a new drain pipe from my kitchen sink, and hooked it up to the hot-water heater’s emergency evacuation drain pipe in my basement. The problem is, every time I fill my sink with water and then pull the plug, the deluge of water is so great it goes down the pipe, and then up the other side of the V, and out the open end, which is where the copper pipe from the water-heater’s emergency evacuation conduit enters. I need to plug the hole, but if I use plumber’s putty, it could eventually crumble off and go down and plug up the drain pipe. What should I do?

Bonus question!

I used Cassowary jism to cement the two halves of my friends buttocks together as a practical joke (and you KNOW how hard it is to get Cassowary jism!), but now the joke is over and he’s really upset. What is the best way to dissolve the dried jism?

Bonus Bonus question!

My girlfriend no longer loves me, but she’s hot. Should I stay with her for the fantastic sex and the fun of exploring her magnificent body in ways never documented by either the Kama Sutra or Masters and Johnson, or seek out a serious soul-mate?

Thanks Unca Harlan!

-Keith

Repairing typewriters.

I don't know much, but here's what I do remember. (I never tried to repair an electric typewriter, but if you try, remember to unplug it first.) [Safety notice brought to you by the "Keep Coil from getting sued" agency]

Some typewriters have a lock position that stops the carriage in the middle for, indeed, transportation purposes. Perhaps this lock has fallen into place. If so, it would seem to indicate that something has come loose. The lock would most likely be a thin bar about a quarter-inch to a half-inch wide. Get a screwdriver or other appropriate tool and open up the typewriter (NOT a hammer!). Don't be afraid to open the casing. A manual typewriter is a simple machine, even though it has many parts. If you can find the locking mechanism, you might also find a screw loose (!) or other positioning device and be able to repair it yourself.

As for setting tabs, this is a manual function. When you press the 'set tab' key, it moves a cog into place that stops the carriage in that position. Clearing the tabs puts all the cogs back in the home position. As to your situation, maybe tabs cannot be set when the carriage is locked in the center. Maybe both functions are done by the same metal parts in the typewriter. Fixing the lock problem may fix the other.

I know that's not much help, but it's all I have. If you open the casing and find a bunch of loose parts or even a bent part, you're gonna need a professional repairman anyway, but this might save you a few bucks. Good Luck.

FinderDoug:

Thank you for a graceful resolution to the dilemma.

I mis-read your inital post and "went for the Russian CD" which translated to "Rimsky-Korsakov" at the time. Mea Culpa.

I'll be less precipitous in the future.

Rick: you think _Harlan_ is a tech support guy? Who sold you the typewriter? There are still people who sell or work on typewriters, some of them just for the love of it (it's not a mass market any more obviously) even if they don't hang out their shingle...you could do some looking around.

Everyone: there are brutal/corrupt dictators on BOTH the left and right. This is news?

I'm gonna be gone until at least the Wednesday after Labor Day; I date a guy who is a fanatic about Burning Man, and who has a theme camp (literature and giving books away - sorry, not Harlan books but some good sf and leftist stuff; his politics, not necessarily mine) so he can get in early....we're leaving tomorrow. I'll miss this board..

Kristin "Shoot All Extremists" (always loved that button)
Hitler won a free election too....

Seeking typewriter assistance
Since Harlan uses an Olympia typewriter, I'm hoping he might he might know how to resolve my two typewriter problems. I own an Olympia SM9, and earlier tonight I inadvertently pressed the "clear all tabs" lever, forgetting that was the lever's function.

The problem is, I can't find how to re-set the tabs. The "tab" key itself doesn't do it, and there's no conveniently labeled key marked "set." Now, I know it's got to be right in front of me, but it must be pulling a Lamont Cranston on me, because I can't see it.

The second problem came in trying to solve the first. I seem to have somehow "locked" the carriage in place at the centerpoint, and it will now move neither forward nor back. I'm sure that feature would be useful if I was transporting the typewriter, but I'm not, so I'd like to "unlock" it.

If you know how I can accomplish these tasks, I'd appreciate the assistance.

Rick

Steve Barber is bedrock. The lovely Land of Jazz stretches far, across green and mellow leas to rocky, wave-pummeled cliffs. Its nations speak many fluent tongues. The lingua franca is heart, the pidgen english is soul.

The first time I ever heard Yusef Lateef, on an obscure lp label apparently no one remembers but me, it was a magnificent set called PRAYER TO THE EAST. It was the spring of 1958, I was living in a trailer off-base in Elizabethtown, Kentucky. My daily gig was at the US Army Armor Center, Fort Knox, and I was Pvt. SadAss Ellison. I was living off-base on the down-low, my first wife having decamped with all my money and the furniture. The thought of moving back into the barracks sent me into a spiral of such petroleum-ooze despair that I faked my marital situation, and just rented that ratty li'l trailer with my buddy, Derry "The Tiger" Taylor. PFC SadAss Taylor, formerly of Worcester, Mass. And there, in that hellish place, I won PRAYER TO THE EAST from Derry in a blackjack game that went on for a year and a half.

It was as if the heavens had opened to me. Lateef on flute was so mesmerizing I went in search of everything even remotely allied. And so, I was onto Pharoah Sanders, Ornette Coleman, Steve Lacy, Sun Ra, Officer Len Winchester, Bill Evans, Charlie Mingus, Trane, Diz, Blakey, Don Cherry, Wynton Kelly, and on and on and on, long before anyone I knew had a click they even existed.

And then, after being mustered out and doing my stint in Chicago, when I got back to the Apple and was working the clubs, in New York and environs, doing stand-up and singing, I worked with Mingus and Dolphy. Bill Evans was my backup when I sang.

How do I feel about...ALL DAT JAZZ...?

If you got to ask, as Satchelmouth once said, you'll never know.

Now lemme alone for a while witcher endless curiosity.

Yr. pal, Harlan

DANGEROUS VISIONS
Even though I have had the Dangerous Visions books since 1970...I rescued an older version of D V #2 and the paperback
of LOVE AIN'T NOTHING BUT SEX MISSPELLED, from of all places the book section at Goodwill. Cost: 49cents for DV 2 and 99cents for Love.....just thought you might want to know where some of your writing ends up after nearly thirty some odd years.
For several years now, I have also obtained the VHS of DEMON WITH THE GLASS HAND.

I thought this might be a change from the political stuff we have had on here lately, the rules state we should discuss the stuff you have written or recently written.

I'm mostly with Steve Barber on this, if slightly more open to the avant-garde. I like Ornette. There's something of the human voice in his playing, though it gets lost in the cacophony of a recording like Free Jazz for double quartet, which I can't stomach. Late Coltrane I find monotonous. I have an odd soft spot for Cecil Taylor's Unit Structures, though his solo efforts bore and/or mystify me. Dolphy's alto playing (not his flute and clarinet) can be terribly abrasive, but he knows how to put it in context (cf. Out to Lunch, alongside the melodious Freddie Hubbard.)

Wynton Marsalis came in for a lot of bashing and backlashing, some of which he brought on himself for being a longwinded missionary of tradition, abetted by Stanley Crouch, notorious critic-puncher and author of some of the worst liner notes in history, an astonishing distinction. But he's made some excellent records, particularly with his 1980s quartet. No one in his right mind and ears can listen to Live at Blues Alley and call it something out of a museum. Still, I find his later, large-scale works a snooze.

Jazz Notes
Frank, you asked Harlan, but I'd like to chime in if I could. (I was at Newport the year it was burned down, raised by jazz lovers and married to a jazz singer, so the topics a favorite.)

I've never been a fan of avant-garde (or "free") jazz, though Ornette and Coltrane are listenable in small dosages. I consider some of its worst forms to be little more than tuning the orchestra, and once abandoned just such a performance at the Village Vanguard in order to flee to the much more melodic 5 Spot.

Wynton's problem with free jazz stems, from what I've heard, a similar perception. He is well known for championing a return to jazz roots as opposed to the semi-pop music we hear on The Wave or the previously mentioned orchestral tune. Wynton felt (and feels) that jazz is, above all, about the music and construction -- not prefab or unconstructed.

Jazz comes in a lot of forms, however, and there's room in the house for everything from Jarreau, Krall and Koz to Coltrane, MJQ, Stan Getz and Charlie Byrd.

In a shameless bit of semi-self promotion I might recommend as an example the instrumental solos on my wife's most recent cd (a collection of jazz standards with some bossa nova thrown in). They range from some sax riffs Coltrane and Ornette would have loved (performed by the inimitable Doug Webb), to very simple and basic playful percussion that just gets you bopping along (Kurt Rassmussen).

IMHO: The best jazz comes from all over the spectrum -- which, to me -- is the strength of the genre. There's room for both Marsalis and Ornette, though my own personal preference is profoundly the former.

For what it's worth...

S. Evil: "Chavez was elected into power. Quite democratically. With an overwelming majority (unlike many Western Leaders)."

While there is no doubt right-wingers dunk their heads in cement INVARIABLY when it comes to logic on the issues, I think we ALL have to be really, really careful when we describe "free elections", any notions about the "majority", in those countries, given the incessant corruption down there. Political climate is, like everything else, an extension of environment.

Simplistic arguments never work no matter WHO they're coming from.

Mark, your friend has been listening to propaganda, I'd suspect. I know the left media would not support Chavez, if he was as bad as you say.

-----------

Harlan, what do you think of the music of Ornette Coleman? And, what do you think of the Stanley Crouch, Wynton Marsalis wing of the jazz community, who hate fusion or more experimental forms of jazz? Thanks.

Harlan - Given Lee's staunch determination and tireless efforts to put the Rimsky-Korsakov in your hands, please feel free to disregard my post from yesterday morning regarding the copy I'd already secured for you. I've got the shelf space and am always up for something new, and your desire to find it has to say something of what it has to offer.

Lee - You're a steamroller, baby.

Apologies for posting twice but interesting article on Chavez
My apologies for posting again, and I will refrain from posting for a while, but here is an interesting article that provides a counterpoint to the accusations against Chavez made by my friend.

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Parenti/GoodThings_Venezuela.html

Harlan,

Due to a problem w/ international shipping, I went ahead and had the Scheherazade disk shipped directly to HERC from the CSO. You should have it by next Friday.

Hugo Chavez
It is interesting that there is so much discussion of Chavez on this board as I was talking about him last night with a buddy of mine who is originally from Peru, and whose family now lives in Venezuela.

My knowledge of Chavez was somewhat limited before this. I knew he had been democratically elected, was allied with Cuba, and the yutzes in the US government hated his guts. That was about it.

According to my friend, who was down there last year, and talks to his family weekly, this guy is a monster. He described Chavez as a complete dictator who has been burning people alive who opposed him. If a TV or radio station says something negative about him, their charter is revoked.

While he was elected, he used voter fraud, intimidation and outright bribery to become elected. Furthermore, he had been in prison shortly before being elected as he had been trying to have a violent overthrow of the previous government.

Once in power, he took steps to re-write the Venezuelan constitution, granting himself greater powers and has consolidated his power by currying favor with the military through such actions as a 60% pay raise for individuals in military service.

With all of this going on, there may also be a brain drain in Venezuela, where many professionals and educated people are leaving before the situation deteriorates further. My friend told me that real estate prices have been dropping precipitously, as the wealthy are trying to liquidate their assets, to prepare for a possible conversion to communism.

I am not saying I believe everything my buddy said, but he provided enough specifics that I am curious and will try to verify some of the allegations he made

Harlan,

I picked up a copy of the Rimsky-Korsakov for you.

Scheherazade Tsar Saltan, Chicago Symphony Orchestra, Samuel Magad Solo Violin, Barenboim Conducting. Erato Discs, 1993.

I'll forward it to the HERC address when it arrives.

Viva Boliva.
"Steve Evil would excuse Cuba and Castro because they have a good health care system. But Castro's prisons are full of poets and writers and individuals whose only crime is that they were so rude as to try to think for themselves. That is my criticism of Chavez as well."

No one said anything about excusing Castro. I don't romanticize him, and have no patience for those who do.

But he ain't comparable to Hitler. Everyone remotely unkind is compared to Hitler, my step mother, your older brother, our high school Math teacher. Let's keep things in perspective.

But you're right, Castro does have a good health care system. Universal access to doctors and medicine. Which we all know, right wingers can't abide. I suspect that is actually his greatest crime. After all, the West allies itself with other countries that also jail poets, but have far worse health care systems. (Saudi Arabia is my favorate example).

Now unlike Castro, Chavez was elected into power. Quite democratically. With an overwelming majority (unlike many Western Leaders). He will have to run for re-election in 2006. His crackdowns are a response to TWO attempted coups. How else is a democratically elected (those lovely words again) leader supposed to respond to an attempted coup? The corporate press is free to condemn him all they want (and they do). His prisons are not festering with free thinkers.

80% of the land in Venezuala is owned by 5% of the people (mostly foriegners). Hugo Chavez is being branded a seventh rate Hitler because he is rude enough to say this is bollocks.

A good place to look for hard to find music is www.musicstack.com
Good Luck

Red freakin' dawn! I occasionally have nightmares about this. But I'm not so sure they're commies all the time...

Anyway, I haven't heard squat about DREAM CORRIDOR anywhere else. Not even the Dark Horse site. I'd be terribly depressed about it if I wasn't going to see Nellie McKay at Woodstock, NY on Saturday.

Yeah, I had to gloat. Sorry. Somehow she makes the crap seem trivial. Even the commie-talk. Maybe that's just me.

But after I return...RED FREAKIN' DAWN!

Ezra,

Could've fooled me.

Mark W.

Chavez just went to Jamaica; seems the commie bastard rolled the red star through all that great Jah weed and offered the people of that land, oil at forty bucks a barrel. Damn, that fiend, offering cheap gas to those spliff smokers, how dare he!

If America tried to overthrow my administration, I would be a bit red under the beret as well. And, most of the guff about Chavez comes from right wing sites.

Here is the real skinny on Chavez, from America's best reporter, Greg Palast, who interviewed Chavez twice:

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=452&row=0

Jonathan Alter of Newsweek, a moderate, at best, interviewed Chavez as well. He told Al Franken that Chavez was not a communist, and in the interview, Chavaz had nothing but contempt for the old soviet system. His siding with Castro is diplomatic, at best. You find friends where you can. No different, then the Sandanista's excepting arms from the Soviets.

Bush is the most dangerous leader of any country, for about fifty years, and you all wanna yammer like hens about Chavez? If Chavez is a dictator, then he is a benevolent one at worst. So is Castro.

--------

David, I was having fun with Williams.

--------

Todd, I am forced to hear all the right wing guff that saturates our society, so it would be nice of you to listen to differing points of view, instead of living in a dreamland.

Doug asked: "So who's got the Russian release covered? My brain is tired."

Playlists, playlists, playlists. That's all I've found it on, too. I, too, had a long story on this particular disc, but, suffice to say, I probably went to the same cul de sacs and dead ends that Doug entered.

However, I will add that MELODIYA is also spelled MELODYA and supposedly BMG Classics has taken over the collection (collection of what, I'm not entirely sure) of Melodiya (or, Melodya) discs. Unless someone knows Russian or can find someone other than a webmaster at BMG Classics to talk to, it ain't for sale.

One other thing: Have you tried to contact K-Mozart to see if they have an extra copy? Or, (cough, cough) can burn (cough, cough) a copy? Legally, of course (cough, cough). Sorry, I seem to be throwing up my ethics. Their number is 1-310-478-5540.

Oh, and one final other thing: I found this, but not knowing anything about classical music or anything about anything for that matter, you may want to check out this site for a review of a Balakirev 2-disc set. It doesn't look like it's the same thing, but I include it for your perusal only because I really don't know what I'm looking at. The reviewer, Rob Barnett's email is rob.barnett1@btinternet.com in case you may want to contact him for clues on the disc you're looking for.


http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/jan99/balakirev.htm

And just to show off, Doug gave you the day, but I have the time: 11:56am. (I think. I closed all my tabs and my brain is tired too so that's just what I remembered.)

Mark Walsh wrote

“And I hate to burst -your- bubble, Ezra, but there is also a red, sticky puddle under the stars & bars.”

Yes Mark I am not blind to the fact that the Confederacy was a blight on the early history of this country. But I remind you that it was destroyed at terrible cost. By Americans themselves, I might add.

But wait a minute; perhaps you aren’t aware that the “stars & bars” is what American southerners such as myself call the Confederate battle flag, and what has become a symbol of the old racist south. Maybe you meant the “stars & STRIPES”?

In that case, again I am not blind to the faults of the USA. They’re obvious to anyone who is honest with themselves (sadly many Americans are not). But I suppose I am extremely simple-minded and naïve. I think there is still something worth salvaging in this country, something worth fighting for. Its ideals and the principles on which it was founded. (Cue the band music.)

The original context of my statement was a response to Frank’s belief that Left Wing Totalitarianism is somehow superior to Right Wing Totalitarianism. I simply believe that liberty is superior to any form of totalitarianism.

Steve Evil would excuse Cuba and Castro because they have a good health care system. But Castro's prisons are full of poets and writers and individuals whose only crime is that they were so rude as to try to think for themselves. That is my criticism of Chavez as well.

Ask, and ye shall...
Harlan - Guess I know what YOU were listening to on August 6th...

Okay - long story short - one down, one still standing.

Long story long: what I can tell you to help narrow the search:

Melodiya SUCD 10-00153 (full catalog number) contains three Balakirev compositions performed by the USSR Symphony Orchestra and conducted by Svetlanov: "Incidental Music "King Lear"", "Overture on the Theme of Spanish March" and "Suite in B Minor". I have no clue as to the year of release, though it's a digital master of an analog recording/mix, and dates back to at least 2001 on CD, (as WHRO in Hampton Roads VA played the "King Lear" track at 4:01 am on May 9 of that year). I've gotten a gander at the cover compliments of a Japanese web page, but that's of minimal value, since a Melodiya CD should stick out like a sore thumb, what with the being in Russian and all.

Erato 4509-91717 contains "The Tale of the Tsar Saltan: Suite, op. 57", and "Sheherazde, op. 35". It dates back to 2000. The disc that Jon Stover has identified is indeed the Elektra/Wea reissue of the Erato edition, adding what appears to be a second disc containing Tchaikovsky compositions Barenboim recorded with the CSO. It's out of print.

That said, YOUR copy of the Rimsky-Korsakov, dear Harlan, is currently winging its way to me from Maryland, and I'll send it along when it's in hand - give me a week.

So who's got the Russian release covered? My brain is tired.

Harlan:

Is this one of them?

http://www.cduniverse.com/search/xx/music/pid/1193244/a/Rimsky-Korsakov:+Scheherazade,+etc%3B++Tchaikovsky+%2F+Barenboim.htm

Cheers, Jon

CLASSICAL MUSIC HELP REQUESTED

I am trying, have been trying for some time, all in vain, to obtain a couple of classical discs. CDs if available, lp vinyls also perfectly acceptable. Prefer brand-new items, if it is doable, but pristine used is okay, too.

Anyone who gets these for me will be recompensed either with a straight money payment, or more abundantly in jazz or classical CDs, still sealed, a vast congeries of amazing sides you may not know. Yer cherce.

I need:

MELODIYA 10-00153 / Mily BALAKIREV: Suite in B Minor
USSR Symphony; Evgeni Svetlanov, Conductor


(Label Unknown) / RIMSKY-KORSAKOV: "The Tale of the Tsar Saltan"
Suite, Opus 57
Chicago Symphony Orchestra & Chorus; Daniel Barenboim, Cond.


These are the ONLY versions of these I want. There may be many others extant, but these are the tasty versions I hunger to own.

Some of you guys know your way around the infinite web a lot more facilely than I. I've tried KMOZART's playlists, e.bay, Amazon and just plain Google, for Balakirev, for Melodiya, etc. No luck.

I fall back on such as Doug, Alejandro, Barney, et al.

Yr. pal, Harlan

I pulled a HARLAN, yesterday, and lost most of my post.

Having said that, knowing now who all the commies are, I'll just keep reading the menu...

*insert sound of heavyset canuck falling off desk chair*

Ack! Scare the Irish bajaysus out of me why don't you.

Meh, not really like I'm afraid of the e-stalkers or anything. Nobody's really gone the Glenn Close route with introverted comic-book fans. My address is as follows:

Stacy Dooks
492 Rocky Ridge Drive NW
Calgary, Alberta
Canada T3P 5C3

I was wondering a bit about that. . .I remember you mentioning you had some mail you'd held in trust for me, but between the Canadian civility and the Catholic cringe I couldn't make myself speak up. I'm a weak man, I know.

Thanks in advance,

Stacy

Ps. Going to miss you in Dragoncon chief. Figures, the one year I can make it. . .sigh.

Please come to my home page
I am a creator resident in Japan.
I create a sf robot and an abstraction picture mainly.
There are illustrations, too.
There is a Japanese text, but please do not please mind it.
Please come to my home page to play if you don't mind.

http://www2.odn.ne.jp/~cjf00150

Stan

Stan, the whole thing may always blow up.If you have ever read any science fiction story you can figure that out.

I don't know if I am just feeding the troll here but Stan's comments are becoming real boring.OK.Let's live in STANS world for a little while.After we have cut down all the trees and put dam's on all the rivers in the name of human progress we can make war on everyone Stan smell's some leftis'm on.Sorry but that has been tried before.The fall of the Berlin Wall taught me that people yearn to be free.Sadly all Stan learned was that people did not want to be commies.
Sorry but get real.
Paul Leslie

HEY!!!!!!! STACY DOOKS!!!!!!!! YO!!!!!!!!!!

I am a dilatory idiot. I've had a couple of small items I'd promised to send you, just as a bit of largesse; and they've been sitting on the railing in my office for more than a year, awaiting a "spare moment" to post them. Well, I finally got around to bubblewrapping and boxing them today and...

I've lost your new address.

Would you get it to me ASAP, either via regular mail, or right here if you ain't paranoid, or via Rick if you are. He'll pass it along. Thank you, and please forgive my sluggish attention to this picayune matter.

Yr. pal, Harlan

Can any one confirm for me that Citgo gas is 100 percent Venezuelan? There are only a couple places to buy it around here (both attached to 7-11s); I suspect more of their stations are in regions where such would be a business liability rather than an asset! Some folks go out of their way to patronize what others boycott.

As for "commies," well I don't think we have to worry about the Soviets coming in anyomre; the threat is more to American business interests.

Burma/Myanmar, now there's some horrid human rights violations (not to mention environmental destruction) going on. But they're right instead of left, so the US leaves them alone. (Oil companies like Unocal and Chevron want to drill there.)

Amy: where are you from?

Kepi: right you are..I remember now. There was the main (king) intro and Harlan's piece (which had less to do with the stories in the book - the idea being that each story spoke for itself and so there.)


Kristin

Harlan, you weren't *really* mean to children chasing you around, were you? (Some kids ARE brats. But thats more their parents fault.)

" Chavez is a fourth rate Castro."

Indeed. Saints forefend anyone spend oil revenues on hospitals and schools. Or give land to the peasants.

And check out all those crematoriums in Cuba. . .

>"Somalia": Let's take the wayback machine and determine how those troops got to Somalia. Oh, that's right. The first President Bush put those troops in there. Admittedly for the right reason (protection against gangs so the people could be fed), but then, as we tend to do with these types of things we overreached and agreed with the UN in "nation building". After "Bloody Sunday" in '93 and 18 Rangers are killed, Clinton orders the troops out.

rich -

Task Force Ranger was sent in by Clinton, after the massacre of Pakistani UN troops, for the specific purpose of capturing Mohammad Farah Aidid.

"Hey Frank I hate to burst your little leftie bubble but there's just as much blood dripping off that litle red star as there is off the swastika."

And I hate to burst -your- bubble, Ezra, but there is also a red, sticky puddle under the stars & bars.

Mark W.

My thoughts on _The Aristocrats_ are at my blog,
http://www.livejournal.com/users/rpk

Of course, my thoughts are ten times better than most people's, so have a look and walk away enriched.

Hey Frank I hate to burst your little leftie bubble but there's just as much blood dripping off that litle red star as there is off the swastika.

Castro is a third rate Hitler and Chavez is a fourth rate Castro.

The struggle is not between left and right but between freedom and slavery. Understanding and ignorance.

At least now we know for sure which side you're on.

Comrade.

I apologize for an off the cuff comment that clearly belonged on the other board.

woody or wouldn't he?

Jeez, Frank -- show a little common sense now and then, huh?

If YOU were dancing nude in Central Park, in the dark and cold, before a film crew and a rolling camera, do you think YOU would be at full mast?

And what difference does it make, anyway? The stereotype about the supposed size of our dark brothers is based on a simple misapprehension that has become a general piece of ignorance.

OK, I am officially creeped out: I too just watched the Fisher King again.

Good God, does this mean I will be viewing a copy of Chomsky Speaks in the very near future? And liking it?

Does he also have a nude scene?

-TODD

Thank You
Rich -
I was working up quite a lather over Duane's comments. Facts don't seem to be relevant in the current political climate, which is disturbing as hell. In addition to your cited examples lets add Rove and a host of other "ignore it and it will go away" mistakes. And the American people, blinded by ideology, choose that version of reality which suits their current perceptual needs. Which is why, in America, the press was (note past tense) regarded as the cornerstone of American Democracy -- the media had the right and the obligation to challenge the government, free from contraint and without regulation of content.

Without a free and unfettered media, it was suggested by our forefathers, we the people would be at the mercy of the government gone amok.

Frighteningly, that's exactly what appears to have happened. We've witnessed the complete castration of investigative journalism in the last few years -- Time, CBS and others have rolled over after a single bout with the Administration, and Fox is as sycophantic as ever. We're at the point where Rolling Stone magazine is a lone strident voice in an increasingly submissive "4th Estate" -- which leaves the facts, as well as history itself, very much in the shadows.

Duane said:

"Somalia?
The USS Cole bombing?
The FIRST attack on the WTC?

Who was president WHEN?"

Ah, I almost feel as if I'm on the freerepublic boards. It's amazing, though, what's lost when such catchphrases are thrown out there. Shall we take them one at a time? I think we shall.

"Somalia": Let's take the wayback machine and determine how those troops got to Somalia. Oh, that's right. The first President Bush put those troops in there. Admittedly for the right reason (protection against gangs so the people could be fed), but then, as we tend to do with these types of things we overreached and agreed with the UN in "nation building". After "Bloody Sunday" in '93 and 18 Rangers are killed, Clinton orders the troops out. Arguments still ensue about whether that debacle showed that terrorists could bloody our nose and we'd retreat, but, quite frankly, Clinton did the right thing by pulling out and the UN left a year later. Near as I can tell, no Somalians have attacked US soil or brought down any buildings.

"USS Cole bombing": Again with the wayback machine and we see that the Cole incident took place October 12, 2000. Clinton could've launched airstrikes or retaliated soon after, but he had about 3 months left in office. When Bush ascended the throne, he opted to do nothing. However, while Clinton was still there arrests were made a little over a month later and an apparent link to bin Laden was discovered about a month after that. This now makes it December and Bush is trying to take the throne. Again, he opts to do nothing when he becomes President.

"The FIRST attack on the WTC?": Just to remind everyone, there were four convictions in 1994 for the '93 bombing by Yousef. In 1998, Yousef was convicted for his role in the bombing. We've had one conviction for the 9/11 attack and that was recently overturned by another government's court.

So yeah, Clinton was president then and his track record makes Bush look like a complete idiot (as opposed to the usual 'partial idiot').

Face it: Clinton made terrorism one of his primary priorities while in office and Bush didn't. That's not to say Clinton made some mistakes, but they pale in comparison to what the Bush administration did, or, failed to do.

Let's review what happened, and continues to happen, on Bush's watch:

11 Sep 2001: Over 2700 people died in a single day on US soil because of terrorist attacks, and not a single FBI agent has been fired for what is possibly the worst intelligence breakdown and incompetence in any government agency.

Iraqi War: A war that the administration consistently changes the reasons for waging in the first place, the toll stands at over 1800 Americans dead and who knows how many Iraqi citizens.

Abu Ghraib.

George Tenet, who said that Iraq having WMD was a "slam dunk" receives a Medal of Freedom.

Condeelza Rice, who never met a mushroom cloud that couldn't scare people, was National Security Advisor when 9/11 happened. She's been 'promoted' to Secretary of State.

More terrorists are active now because of the war in Iraq then ever before. Bush has given them all a reason to rally 'round bin Laden and a target for their hate.

There's more, but you get the idea.

It's very depressing when the current state of affairs, and Bush's incompetence, are blamed on a previous President. I don't give a shit if the President before Bush was Nixon, the fact is Bush has fucked up and he's fucked up royally. I mean, no one blames Carter's problems while he was President on Ford.

I have my own beef with FDR, so I will leave that for another day.

Chavez would be a great improvement over a mafia don like Bush; this is my contention. Hell, Castro would give us more rights in America, than the creep from Crawford.

And the right hates Chavez, like the prom queen hates black lipstick, so that has to count for something. When the right hates someone, you know they must rock.

Greg Palast has done some great interviews and pieces on Chavez, and from what I have seen, he is a mild marxist, at worst.

Fascism in the white house is worse. Better to have a red star on my lapel then a swastika.

---------

I saw The Fisher King again. Robin Williams does that nude scene, remember? Harlan must have rode him crazy for that. Can we say, smallfry.

Clarifying Intelligent Design
http://www.venganza.org/

STEVE DOONER: I saw "The Aristocrats" and thought it was very funny, but I'm probably biased because my father is in it. If you see the movie, he's the guy in the hot-tub with the naked girl on his lap.

Frank, Stan has tried to cheer you up and held out hope to you that Chavez is like FDR and that things may turn out all right with such a fine leader in charge. If Chavez is the caliber of leader Stan from Oregon is suggesting, everything will turn out OK. So let's hope that Stan is right and Chavez is like FDR.

Cheers, Jon

Susan, thanks for the HERC discount for the new printing of the 50th ANNIVERSARY edition of THE ESSENTAL ELLISON. I'll finally get a copy.


David

TO FRANK CHURCH
America had its own Chavez....Franklyn D. Roosevelt for one, another was Andrew Jackson (some say he was the U.S.A.'s first dictator). We don't need any commie breathing activists like Castro or Chavez. Hasn't the fall of the Berlin Wall in 1990 taught you anything, Frank....hell...Communism does not work and in time even Cuba will give it up. China...they are just evolving into a government type started by Yugoslavia's Tito.
North Korea? Big question there....they too may implode and take everyone with them. Besides....the way we are going now, the whole thing might blow up tomorrow and then it will not matter one damned bit....will it?

" Somalia?
The USS Cole bombing?
The FIRST attack on the WTC?

Who was president WHEN?"

Well, he did say there was blame in BOTH administrations.

BUt's let's face it. Bush's foriegn adventures were (are)bloodier. And the second attack on the WTC was worse. . .

E.

"Can we all agree that Pat Robertson has finally lost it?"

Hell, I don't think he's losing it. I think he
s speaking for the same beautiful ideas and devout, wall-eyed wallabies he's ALWAYS

"Face it, there's a lot of blame to go around, in both the Clinton and the Bush administration, though I think more on the Bush administration."

Somalia?
The USS Cole bombing?
The FIRST attack on the WTC?

Who was president WHEN?

>Eric, I was bored and wanted to get a laugh. Usually Comedy Central thrills me. I will be more careful next time.<

Frank, try friggery. Be careful there too, though.

SUSAN: Ginchy-keen. I still don't have one of those. Thanks for the update!

KRISTIN: My husband and I will be at Foolscap.

Eric, I was bored and wanted to get a laugh. Usually Comedy Central thrills me. I will be more careful next time.

Gives Eric a sugar free gumball.

-----------

Pat Robertson may have finally said the thing that will get him canned, for once and for all.

I can smell the sulfer, as the emails grind out and fling like burning paper airplanes, into the mailbox of the 700 Club.

We should send Robertson to Venezuela, and let them try him for crimes.

America needs its own Chavez.

Franky Boy Lupo, Writer & Producer extraordinaire
Frank Lupo was my friend from childhood through late adolescence. He followed his dreams, and became one of the most successful screenwriters and producers in TV history. OK...forget about "Lawless"...I'm talking ""Walker, Texas Ranger", "Hunter", Wise Guys", Werewolf" etc. (funny..I've never actually watched a Frank Lupo TV program). We caught up 10 years ago, then lost each other again. Tried to find him, and Harlan recommended the Writer's Guild..however, if Franky got my forwarded letter, he must have round-filed it and never wrote back. If anyone knows Frank Lupo, or knows where to find him, tell him that Bennett from Brooklyn is trying to catch up, on the eve of our respective 50th B-days (well, he's a lot older than me...he turned 50 earlier this year).

Thanks.

Pat Robertson finally losing it? Motherfucker lost it when he was born again. But, yes, Andrew, I agree with you.

And a slight dissent with Jay on the 9/11 thing by National Geographic (plus I promise not to start anymore sentences with conjunctions 'cause it really doesn't get me far).

Yeah, the satellite photo things they had going on were distracting, and it really wasn't necessary to run all 12 seconds of bin Laden video constantly. The same scenes of the same crowd got old real quick, but...

I thought it was a good overview of the whole thing. Starting from 1980 and culminating on 9/11, I thought they did a pretty good job of encapsulating WHY and HOW. The production didn't bug me quite as much as Jay, but, yes, it was distracting at times and unnecessary. However, I think as something to show students or the kids in later years, it's not a bad choice.

I did think it was revealing at times--Osama's almost mythical status gave radical Muslims something to rally 'round, the (somewhat) delving into the hijackers themselves and their motives to name a couple--but there were instances where their penchant for melodrama got the better of them. For example, the ticket agent that gave Atta and his buddy their boarding pass. Not necessary and borders on the opportunistic that Jay was talking about. As a whole though, I'd have to give it a thumbs up.

The thing is, I wonder if we're still too close to the event to actually give it any kind of perspective. I mean, the show was pretty dry in detailing the timeline, but fell far short of pointing fingers or asigning any type of blame other than the quick shot of Keane's 5-second soundbite. Face it, there's a lot of blame to go around, in both the Clinton and the Bush administration, though I think more on the Bush administration. To say that now would just sort of solidify the perception that I'm a Bush-hater (which I am), and I'm partisan no matter how accurate the accusation.

As usual, time will tell.

Note: I have arranged a HERC discount for the new printing of the 50th ANNIVERSARY edition of THE ESSENTAL ELLISON. The next newsletter is already being put together. Time to renew/rejoin.

Thanks--Susan

> Uh-
The *introduction* to STALKING THE NIGHTMARE? I thought Stephen King wrote that. Maybe you mean the intro to one of the stories in it?

No, although "introduction" is a flexible term. The stories in that volume didn't have individual introductions, and King's intro was followed by an unusual and uncategorizable piece by Harlan called "Quiet Lies the Locust Tells".

But the point really is that everyone should check out The Central Meridian (AKA The Garage, Michael McMillen, LA County Museum of Art) as soon as possible, preferably while listening to Out to Lunch (Blue Note, 1964. Eric Dolphy - Alto, Bass clarinet, Flute; Freddie Hubbard - Trumpet; Bobby Hutcherson - Vibes; Richard Davis - Bass; Tony Williams -Drums).

Mark Twain on Intelligent Design
I swore I was going to leave this thread alone but this mornin's reading dove-tailed so neatly I couldn't resist...

TWAIN -

Man has been here 32,000 years. That it took a hundred million years to prepare the world for him is proof that that is what it was done for. I suppose it is. I dunno. If the Eiffel tower were now representing the world's age, the skin of paint on the pinnacle-knob at its summit would represent man's share of that age; & anybody would perceive that that skin was what the tower was built for. I reckon they would. I dunno.

- "Was the World Made for Man?"

Pat Robertson
Can we all agree that Pat Robertson has finally lost it? The Associated Press and other news organizations are reporting that Pat Robertson is calling for the assassination of Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, to keep Venezuela from becoming a "launching pad for communist infiltration and Muslim extremism."

I think that Peter David says it best on his weblog PeterDavid.net: "I can understand why Pat Robertson is such a prominent religious figure. Every time the guy opens his mouth, people say, 'Chriiiiiiist.'"

Want to see something cool?

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/050822_spirit_dustdevils.html

Greg -

Did you watch the show?

My comments about the program stem from the simple fact that it is a poorly produced show.

It is a poorly produced show. It is a poorly produced show.

When a national tragedy is handled with MTV style cuts, James Bond flashing-map graphics and film school trickery, while not even attempting to provide a new insight into the events, I find it disrespectful and opportunistic. ESPECIALLY when they run the show under the prestigious banner of a National Geographic program. It is sometimes slow-paced, soemtimes bombastic, often melodramatic, overall uninteresting and never revealing.

Technically, the failure comes from adopting as visual style for the program that was inapporpriate and poorly executed. There weren't enough stills or coverage (generic airliner exteriors, interiors, shots flying, landing, etc. repeated because they didn't assemble enough unique footage), so they substituted repeating stock graphics to eat up the time required for expository present-tense narration.

For example, you'll see Atta's image projected on a softly billowing canvas as we slow-zoom in on his passport photo, fixed on his malevolent expression as we hear shit like: "March 13th, 11:42am: Dark and sinister Islamic fundamentalist Mohammad Atta - has a salad and bottled water with future Flight 93 hijacker Ziad al-Jarrah at a restaurant frequented by Moslem extremists on the corner of Sturm and Drang. It is believed that HERE the two men discuss which brand of box cutter would be most effectively smuggled past half-sleeping security guards. 11:52: Atta clears the Men's room with what officials claim might have been a test of a methane-based chemical weapon."

They don't KNOW anything new. They are parroting the official reports and repackaging it. THAT, my friend, is jaded.

I don't think anyone who lost touch with family or friends in flight, south of Canal on 9/11 or around the Pentagon will ever consider those events ripe for such a portrayal, and parading the witnesses and victims out for their little pony show simply makes me mad.

9/11.....
It's funny and somewhat scary how fast some people become jaded about an event that paralyzed a nation for nearly a week, and whose repercussions are still reverberating. "Yeah stock footage, annoying graphics, CGI. That's not my 9/11, lemme tell YOU". K--rrisst! Had the mock pilots known they were being photographed, I'm sure they would have posed for more photos. 'Autographs? No problem.' Once the planes hit everyone who had a camera and balls enough to walk through the debris had a personal reminder and these did show up on the special, but I'm sure we'll hear "You don't run a video camera on auto-focus on a falling building, are ya nuts??". All that aside, I think I agree much more with Rich's view. Initially it was a more upfront "My god can beat up your god" type of thing. Now it seems to be more hand wringing and finger pointing. At least for a few days people seemed to care about others they would never meet. In parting let me add this: I will never ever forget thinking I have to get Limbaugh's impression of all this. And he was on vacation oddly enough, with some sub-host filling in. He did call in with this piece of brilliance "Yeah, and somebody told me it had something to do with Clinton. Heh, heh, heh." Typical, I suppose.

Uh-
The *introduction* to STALKING THE NIGHTMARE? I thought Stephen King wrote that. Maybe you mean the intro to one of the stories in it?

Kristin
Anyone going to Foolscap? I'm thinking about it

>Harlan gives a brief nod to Dolphy in in the introduction to "Stalking the Nightmare"

*Hand--Forehead--Staple* That's it! Thanks! (And Dolphy's horn always reminds me of a balloon that zig-zags all over when you let the air out of it. That's a compliment, by the way.)

R.WILDER: Figures that Blue Note would be on top of it. Apparently, it's a fifty-minute concert, which is sweet beyond the telling.

Jim Davis -

Harlan gives a brief nod to Dolphy in in the introduction to "Stalking the Nightmare".

On the subject of Dolphy, "Out to Lunch" always makes me think